Battery Health Recs from Ford

[shberry]

Seems to only be an issue if you are parking your car in very hot temps. Here is CA my garage stays around 85 at the hottest.

Agreed. Temperature wise I wouldn't have to, but I'm wondering about the philosophy of how to charge.

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[Shayne]

From my observations......
The car doesn't cool the battery while parked off plug....ever.
While parked on plug, it will cool the battery if inside the charge schedule but will not cool the battery outside of the schedule even if it is plugged in.

@macchiaz-o figured out a trick to allow the battery cooling without charging while parked on plug. You must be at a saved charge location though. Open up the charge schedule (charge anytime) and set the max charge percentage to something lower than current SOC. Park and plug in. Vehicle will NOT charge but WILL cool the battery when necessary.

I have been using this trick for the last week or two. Works great. Not ideal, but better than letting the battery cook. I hope Ford corrects this programming snafu Pronto.

My car cooled the battery a bit this morning before I left for work. Drove to office and plugged in but no cooling was needed. Returned from lunch and it was pretty warm out. Got the message on the screen about high temps. Plugged in but no cooling. About an hour and half later, during the hottest part of the day, the cooling system turned on and brought down the battery temp.

Arrived home, set my charge limit down to 50%, opened the charge schedule and plugged in. I could hear the car cooling the battery while making dinner. No charging......just cooling the battery.

When I head to bed, I open FP and turn up the charge percentage and set my schedule to super off peak.

Tomorrow, will do it again.
And again and again until summer is over and/or Ford fixes the software. The car SHOULD cool the battery while parked on plug no matter what the charge schedule or setting. Someone dropped the ball in a major way IMO....

Thanks for the tip if it is not addressed prior to temperatures falling below 0 I will see if this works. Set schedule to something below SOC and then run around it once an hour to wake it up. Sounds simple and convenient. I will set my alarm at intervals as the temperatures usually drop to their lowest in wee morning hours.

You would assume it should look after the pack whether it is plugged in or not. That is pretty much a no brainer but I am not sure if that is the case. I think the messages I receive about the car being asleep are the most ridiculous notifications. Almost as funny as I killed the 12V because I was using fordpass too much. Should be a big enough pack to maintain itself. Send a notification when charge is too low to do that and I will plug it in sounds easier. That notification I will not turn off.

Ford could speak up and explain the BMS logic at all states to help us help maintain.

 

[zhackwyatt]

Don't have my car yet, maybe October(ish). Anyway maybe this has been answered, so sorry, but here's my question. It seems to me that preconditioning won't be good for the battery. Wouldn't preconditioning cause more cycles of charging on the battery? Based on recommendations, I shouldn't charge until I get down to 20%, and then charge to only 90%. For me, this will result in charging about once a week on the 240V I put in the garage. If I precondition, won't it charge whenever I'm less than 90%, resulting in charging unnecessarily, thereby reducing the battery life? What am I missing?

Preconditioning uses shore power to condition the battery before you drive. It doesn't charge the car anymore than your set charge limit.

 

[shberry]

Preconditioning uses shore power to condition the battery before you drive. It doesn't charge the car anymore than your set charge limit.

So, to be clear, when I'm at home, I should have the 240V charger plugged in all the time, and it won't take me from 80% - 90%? Then how does it know to start charging when I get down to 20%?

 

[Shayne]

So, to be clear, when I'm at home, I should have the 240V charger plugged in all the time, and it won't take me from 80% - 90%? Then how does it know to start charging when I get down to 20%?

You should not need to plugged in all the time. You set a schedule based on charging location and when you plug it in that location (home) it will run that schedule. Example charge from 10 pm to 10 am and charge it up to 80%. It is explained fairly well in the owners manual.

 

[zhackwyatt]

So, to be clear, when I'm at home, I should have the 240V charger plugged in all the time, and it won't take me from 80% - 90%? Then how does it know to start charging when I get down to 20%?

You can set a max charge per charge location. I set my car to not go over 80% and plug it in every night. I have a charge schedule set to only charge after 11pm. That way it's a little cooler.

Ford actually recommends keeping your car plugged in when not in use. There is no down side of charging to 80 or even 90%. What's important for the health of a car li-on is to stay off the extreme ends (empty or 100% full) as much as possible and to keep the battery cool.

 

[SnBGC]

Don't have my car yet, maybe October(ish). Anyway maybe this has been answered, so sorry, but here's my question. It seems to me that preconditioning won't be good for the battery. Wouldn't preconditioning cause more cycles of charging on the battery? Based on recommendations, I shouldn't charge until I get down to 20%, and then charge to only 90%. For me, this will result in charging about once a week on the 240V I put in the garage. If I precondition, won't it charge whenever I'm less than 90%, resulting in charging unnecessarily, thereby reducing the battery life? What am I missing?

Preconditioning isn't charging. Just cooling or heating the battery and/or cabin for use.

 

[shberry]

Preconditioning isn't charging. Just cooling or heating the battery and/or cabin for use.

But if I'm plugged into my home 240VAC how does the car know I don't want to charge up to 90%?

 

[SnBGC]

Thanks for the tip if it is not addressed prior to temperatures falling below 0 I will see if this works. Set schedule to something below SOC and then run around it once an hour to wake it up. Sounds simple and convenient. I will set my alarm at intervals as the temperatures usually drop to their lowest in wee morning hours.

You would assume it should look after the pack whether it is plugged in or not. That is pretty much a no brainer but I am not sure if that is the case. I think the messages I receive about the car being asleep are the most ridiculous notifications. Almost as funny as I killed the 12V because I was using fordpass too much. Should be a big enough pack to maintain itself. Send a notification when charge is too low to do that and I will plug it in sounds easier. That notification I will not turn off.

Ford could speak up and explain the BMS logic at all states to help us help maintain.

Right?
You might have the same basic issue as we have here in the desert. You want the car to warm the battery when necessary and charge when ambient is coolest outside since there is free heat while charging so the electric heater will consume less shore energy to keep the battery warm compared to having to keep the battery warm without charging.
If the car charges when you first get home for the evening then it might be done by the time you go to bed and then in the wee hours when it gets way below zero the electric heaters will have to warm the car all by itself.

Maybe the heat retention properties will play in your favor and store the charge heat for many hours so the electric heaters don't have to work so hard.

On the plus side.....I think the only real issue with cooler temps is temporary reduction of battery capacity. I don't think the cold temps cause as much if any permanent damage compared to excessive heat.

 

[Shayne]

Right?
You might have the same basic issue as we have here in the desert. You want the car to warm the battery when necessary and charge when ambient is coolest outside since there is free heat while charging so the electric heater will consume less shore energy to keep the battery warm compared to having to keep the battery warm without charging.
If the car charges when you first get home for the evening then it might be done by the time you go to bed and then in the wee hours when it gets way below zero the electric heaters will have to warm the car all by itself.

Maybe the heat retention properties will play in your favor and store the charge heat for many hours so the electric heaters don't have to work so hard.

On the plus side.....I think the only real issue with cooler temps is temporary reduction of battery capacity. I don't think the cold temps cause as much if any permanent damage compared to excessive heat.

Think your right degradation is more at temps over 45 C but if the car is just sitting for days not charging you would think the car is smart enough to wake up and ensure the pack is not at an extreme temperature at either end. Their should be an ideal temp range that the AI should deal with in both temperature conditions when it is parked plugged in or not. I have wondered how this works for a while now.

I know it now wakes up to charge the 12V. You are seeing the last info before it fell asleep is not a really comforting notification to me. They have even used deep sleep? If the vehicle can do 300 miles it has the battery to keep an eye on things when just sitting there. You are saying that does not happen under high temperatures for you right now and a trick and some hope is required?

 

[SnBGC]

But if I'm plugged into my home 240VAC how does the car know I don't want to charge up to 90%?

If you are plugging in for the sole purpose to condition the battery but do not want to charge then you have to temporarily reduce your max charge limit to some number less than your current state of charge AND open up your charge schedule so you are inside that window.

Not ideal but a temporary work around until the software is corrected.

 

[SnBGC]

Think your right degradation is more at temps over 45 C but if the car is just sitting for days not charging you would think the car is smart enough to wake up and ensure the pack is not at an extreme temperature at either end. Their should be an ideal temp range that the AI should deal with in both temperature conditions when it is parked plugged in or not. I have wondered how this works for a while now.

I know it now wakes up to charge the 12V. You are seeing the last info before it fell asleep is not a really comforting notification to me. They have even used deep sleep? If the vehicle can do 300 miles it has the battery to keep an eye on things when just sitting there. You are saying that does not happen under high temperatures for you right now and a trick and some hope is required?

Agree on what the car should do. My last Ford BEV operated the way you described and it was glorious. After 50k miles in that car I still had the same available capacity as the day it was new. The battery health was very well managed in that vehicle.

And yes. No matter how high the temps....it won't cool the battery when plugged in unless it is inside the charge schedule. And now with this new update, it also has to be awake to begin charging or when the battery needs cooling. If it is asleep, then neither appear to happen since the Power Up 1.6.0 update.
Thanks Ford. Let's keep "improving" the car. ?

 

[pottslaw]

Interesting!

Mine doesn't do that... It behaves as Greg described. My vehicle was built in December/January, his in November. When was yours built? Have you been back for any dealer installed updates at all?

Is anyone else noticing the same behavior? (Vehicle recommends plugging in due to temp, you plug in and vehicle periodically cools itself outside of its charging schedule)

My MME was built right in the middle. Mine was built the third week of December and delivered the second week of February.

I only have the 21B36 (PaaK) update completed by the dealer. I have requested all available updates, but I understand that until you can document a specific issue (like the 12 volt battery discharging) Ford won't reimburse the dealer for any other "optional" software updates at this time.

 

[AZBill]

Ford needs to fix this for sure. I live in Phoenix and also have a Bolt. It ignores the charging schedule and charge level entirely for battery conditioning. If I am plugged in and the temp in the garage is 100+ it will run the fan and battery conditioning even in off peak hours. It is not charging then. If it has reached full charge and temps are high, it will run battery conditioning. I can see it use the charger for this almost every hour for several minutes. I have ChargePoint Home Flex that provides time history on it, conditioning generally takes less than 1KW during that conditioning.

 

[Shayne]

Agree on what the car should do. My last Ford BEV operated the way you described and it was glorious. After 50k miles in that car I still had the same available capacity as the day it was new. The battery health was very well managed in that vehicle.

And yes. No matter how high the temps....it won't cool the battery when plugged in unless it is inside the charge schedule. And now with this new update, it also has to be awake to begin charging or when the battery needs cooling. If it is asleep, then neither appear to happen since the Power Up 1.6.0 update.
Thanks Ford. Let's keep "improving" the car. ?

Just got 1.6.0 today and have not tested charging. I will and for me it would most definitely be sleeping between the time I come home and plug in and when the late night schedule kicks in. That is not working for you now either and it does not even wake up to charge? That will need to be patched as that will impact all of us. I thought 1.6.0 was just a gateway install and had no effect on functionality. It has slept more and deeper as time goes on with less info being reported to the app. If "improving" is less info and more sleeping they are moving in the right direction.

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