voxel

Well-Known Member
First Name
Nelson
Joined
Sep 6, 2021
Threads
22
Messages
1,818
Reaction score
1,662
Location
Altamonte Springs, FL
Vehicles
22 Mach-E 4X, 23 GC Limited
Occupation
Software Engineer
Country flag
Not me. EA is still our #1 choice on road trips by a wide margin. We know what power levels every station is gonna have, what their pricing will be, that P&C is compatible, that there will be at least 4 chargers at every station, etc. With all those other ad hoc chargers, any or all of that can be different. Relying on just 1 or 2 chargers at a location is a risky proposition unless there's other options in the area. Especially as the # of CCS EVs doubles, then doubles again...

I know your point was about charger dependability, and it's true, EA is often slow to make repairs. But that's also true for many of the others. Hit and miss.

We occasionally use non-EA DCFCs on road trips too, but only ones I've done the research on first. At least 80% of our DCFC is using EA.
It depends where you are. In Florida, the turnpike is well serviced by local utilities where EA is non-existent and now along I-95 the util companies are building out chargers where as EA has built almost nothing in years.

Before I attended a track night at Daytona I popped by EA Ormond and 3/6 stalls were down and two were occupied. I just wanted to burn my free credits (yes P&C is nice too) because there were 12 stations (6 FPL Evolution and 6 EVGo) next to the race track that were operational (didn't check exactly how many).

My experience with Tesla Superchargers in Florida is they always work and I've seen one broken one out of maybe hundreds. Private corporations have a vested interest in keeping chargers operational. A "non-profit" like EA doesn't care. Their mandate is to build chargers not maintain them.
Sponsored

 

Caulk-E

Well-Known Member
First Name
Tommy
Joined
Mar 27, 2022
Threads
3
Messages
147
Reaction score
166
Location
Bay Area
Vehicles
2022 Mustang Mach-E Premium ER RWD
Country flag
Just as I thought in my earlier post. Manchin is a coal guy. His interests are in protecting coal. This “Federal EV Credit” is all smoke in mirrors. If this bill passes, no cars will qualify for the full $7,500 EV credit next year. Very clever how he’s using these strict stipulations to appear that he’s a proponent of reducing emissions and building the American supply chain, but in reality he just gutted the $7,500 EV Tax credit for all manufacturers that haven’t sold 200,000 EVs.
25CC1D95-9F5D-4A7F-B2F5-CDF112CF899E.jpeg
 

dbsb3233

Well-Known Member
First Name
TimCO
Joined
Dec 30, 2019
Threads
54
Messages
9,299
Reaction score
10,814
Location
Colorado, USA
Vehicles
2021 Mustang Mach-E FE, 2023 Bronco Sport OB
Occupation
Retired
Country flag
It depends where you are. In Florida, the turnpike is well serviced by local utilities where EA is non-existent and now along I-95 the util companies are building out chargers where as EA has built almost nothing in years.

Before I attended a track night at Daytona I popped by EA Ormond and 3/6 stalls were down and two were occupied. I just wanted to burn my free credits (yes P&C is nice too) because there were 12 stations (6 FPL Evolution and 6 EVGo) next to the race track that were operational (didn't check exactly how many).

My experience with Tesla Superchargers in Florida is they always work and I've seen one broken one out of maybe hundreds. Private corporations have a vested interest in keeping chargers operational. A "non-profit" like EA doesn't care. Their mandate is to build chargers not maintain them.
Sounds like Florida has a lot more non-EA DCFC than I see in my part of the country. We've traveled the southwest quite a bit and EA is the clear go-to. I've also been researching a trip thru KS/MO/TN/LA/TX/NM and it's pretty much the same there.

Here in CO the state has done a pretty good job of sponsoring some DCFC on some key non-interstate highways through the mountains. Those are pretty dependable CP125 units. But there's usually only 2 chargers at each place, so it's a little riskier.
 

All Hat No Cattle

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 24, 2020
Threads
19
Messages
446
Reaction score
564
Location
Las Vegas
Vehicles
2023 Genesis GV-80 , 2017 Edge Titanium
Country flag
This is where the new Tax Credits are today, according to the WSJ.

Proposed Tax Break for Buying Electric Vehicles Is Too Hard to Get, Auto Makers Say
Draft rules in Senate climate package mean few current vehicles would be eligible, say lobbyists


Major auto makers are pressing lawmakers to ease a proposed battery-sourcing requirement for electric-vehicle tax breaks, saying that few, if any, plug-in models on sale today would qualify.

The Senate climate package proposed last week would extend until 2032 a current $7,500 tax credit for electric-vehicle purchases, a consumer incentive that has been in place for more than a decade. The legislation, a deal struck between Sen. Joe Manchin (D., W.Va.) and Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer (D., N.Y.), could get a Senate vote by this weekend.

The bill would enhance the electric-vehicle tax credit in some ways, including making vehicles produced by General Motors Co., Tesla Inc. TSLA -5.69%â–Ľ and Toyota Motor Corp. TM -0.26%â–Ľ eligible for the subsidy again.

But the proposal would stiffen the requirements for an electric vehicle to qualify. Only U.S.-built vehicles would be eligible. It also pushes car companies to bring more manufacturing to North America, including setting minimum thresholds for the value of battery components that must be manufactured or assembled in the region. Essentially any EVs with battery components made or processed in China would be ineligible for the subsidy.


These thresholds also target crucial battery materials, such as lithium and nickel, requiring a certain percentage to be sourced domestically or from the U.S.’s free-trade partners.

Car-industry lobbyists say meeting the new requirements on batteries could take years to achieve. The majority of processing for major battery minerals, including lithium, nickel and cobalt, is done in China, according to research firm Benchmark Mineral Intelligence.


Most electric-vehicle models on the market today wouldn’t qualify for the EV tax credit as drafted because they have too much battery content sourced outside of North America, the industry lobbyists say.

Instead, GM, Ford Motor Co. and other car companies are asking for a longer timeline to reach the requirements, and to expand the number of countries from which minerals can be sourced, according to people familiar with their lobbying efforts.
Then it shows the charts in Post #392, above.
 


voxel

Well-Known Member
First Name
Nelson
Joined
Sep 6, 2021
Threads
22
Messages
1,818
Reaction score
1,662
Location
Altamonte Springs, FL
Vehicles
22 Mach-E 4X, 23 GC Limited
Occupation
Software Engineer
Country flag
Sounds like Florida has a lot more non-EA DCFC than I see in my part of the country. We've traveled the southwest quite a bit and EA is the clear go-to. I've also been researching a trip thru KS/MO/TN/LA/TX/NM and it's pretty much the same there.

Here in CO the state has done a pretty good job of sponsoring some DCFC on some key non-interstate highways through the mountains. Those are pretty dependable CP125 units. But there's usually only 2 chargers at each place, so it's a little riskier.
Yup because EA Florida is a joke outside of Miami and parts of the eastern I-95 corridor. I can't recall a new location built in 1.5 years. Maybe one in the Miami area but definitely none in central + north Florida.

Non-EA DC charging continues to improve here. There will be a massive 20+ stall charging hub in downtown Orlando. The push is by local utilities and local governments.

Regardless, Tesla has built 6 new SCs (each with 8 to 14 stalls) near me in the last 8 months and probably another 6 around in Florida that I never tracked. So while non-EA DCFC is improving.. it's still being lapped by big T.
 

Regulus7

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 24, 2021
Threads
3
Messages
265
Reaction score
259
Location
NYC
Vehicles
993 C4 Cab, Macan S, SantaFe, Ice Blue MME GT
Occupation
Money Manager
Country flag
Well I hope they realIze the folly of passing this bill as is and at the very least maintain the $7500 legacy tax credit as it is for manufacturers that have not yet hit 200k vehicles…

Hey - separate question does anyone know if the 30% tax credit on solar installation also has an income limit?
 

DennisD

Well-Known Member
First Name
Dennis
Joined
Nov 26, 2021
Threads
7
Messages
867
Reaction score
1,002
Location
Omaha Nebraska
Vehicles
2022 Mustang Mach E
Occupation
Driving School Instructor
Country flag
Well I hope they realIze the folly of passing this bill as is and at the very least maintain the $7500 legacy tax credit as it is for manufacturers that have not yet hit 200k vehicles…

Hey - separate question does anyone know if the 30% tax credit on solar installation also has an income limit?
I would guess not. Coincidentally, I am getting Solar Panels installed this coming Wednesday and the tax credit for that has no income limit so I would assume when they say "extension", it will also have no limit.

The nice surprise is that I read that any installation in 22 will receive the "bump" in the credit.

This Bill (in the current form), just advanced me another 4%. The old one was 26% so it will save me another $1,200 on my total bill.
 

kennethjk

Well-Known Member
First Name
Ken
Joined
Sep 3, 2021
Threads
30
Messages
3,266
Reaction score
2,080
Location
NY
Vehicles
MME Prem. EB 4WD, X3
Occupation
Retired
Country flag
Well you're half right anyway. You got "tax credit" right. You got "tax cut" wrong. A tax cut is something that applies broadly to the populace (like lowering the base rates), not just to your own isolated situation (that's a tax credit, like for buying an EV).

This bill includes tax credits (for EV buyers), and tax increases (for a bracket of taxpayers).

Maybe that will help you understand it better. If not, oh well, this is going nowhere good.

Have a nice day.
I have to disagree that a tax cut applies broadly to the populace. Many times it doesn’t. In the tax bill passed under trump one provision it applied to passthru entities And w2 individuals did not get the same break. another provision reduced the state tax deduction which increased taxes to a select group. To me that is a select group, not the broad populace, a reduction in the estate tax does not benefit the entire populace just people who have assets in the multi millions. This has been going on forever.

at the end of the day a credit is really the same as a tax reduction. Government losses revenue. Just depends who is getting the benefit.
 

MMENJ

Well-Known Member
First Name
Jeff
Joined
Apr 13, 2022
Threads
6
Messages
258
Reaction score
186
Location
NJ
Vehicles
22 Wrangler 4xE, 23 Mach E GT-“Julius”
Country flag
Probably means nothing, that’s the point. What people should probably spend their money on , is not what they actually do.
 

Caulk-E

Well-Known Member
First Name
Tommy
Joined
Mar 27, 2022
Threads
3
Messages
147
Reaction score
166
Location
Bay Area
Vehicles
2022 Mustang Mach-E Premium ER RWD
Country flag

yngwenli

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 8, 2021
Threads
3
Messages
1,033
Reaction score
719
Location
So California
Vehicles
2022 MME Premium RWD SR
Country flag
Just as I thought in my earlier post. Manchin is a coal guy. His interests are in protecting coal. This “Federal EV Credit” is all smoke in mirrors. If this bill passes, no cars will qualify for the full $7,500 EV credit next year. Very clever how he’s using these strict stipulations to appear that he’s a proponent of reducing emissions and building the American supply chain, but in reality he just gutted the $7,500 EV Tax credit for all manufacturers that haven’t sold 200,000 EVs.
Ford Mustang Mach-E Senate Bill Deal to Expand EV Tax Credits (7/27/2022) 25CC1D95-9F5D-4A7F-B2F5-CDF112CF899E

If true, then yeah, waste of time.

I've always felt for EVs, we should have just left it alone with the 200k cap. I liked no income caps, no car cost caps, etc...

Now, no more Lucid, Porsche, or other higher priced future EV maker with this new deal.
 

voxel

Well-Known Member
First Name
Nelson
Joined
Sep 6, 2021
Threads
22
Messages
1,818
Reaction score
1,662
Location
Altamonte Springs, FL
Vehicles
22 Mach-E 4X, 23 GC Limited
Occupation
Software Engineer
Country flag

Caulk-E

Well-Known Member
First Name
Tommy
Joined
Mar 27, 2022
Threads
3
Messages
147
Reaction score
166
Location
Bay Area
Vehicles
2022 Mustang Mach-E Premium ER RWD
Country flag
Um, article says 30% would qualify (70% would not) not zero. Pointless clickbait article.

Somebody on Reddit listed all EVs and PHEVs and guessed the new tax credit/rebate status.

Ford Mustang Mach-E Senate Bill Deal to Expand EV Tax Credits (7/27/2022) 0D337BAA-6DDA-4BD8-A5FF-A534DAA0A478
Read it again. 30% would qualify for the partial credit. 0 cars would qualify for the full $7,500 credit. Manchin was adamantly against EV credits. Why is he all of a sudden fine with EV credits? It’s because he knows none of them would qualify for the full EV credit.
 
 




Top