Farley's Comments On Where Ford is On EVs

[llinthicum1]

Interesting article of Ford's strategy on EVs. Seems like concern with possible China flood of small, in-expensive EVs.

https://carbuzz.com/news/ford-ceo-s...t electric crossover could be in the pipeline.

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[Mach1E]

Interesting article of Ford's strategy on EVs. Seems like concern with possible China flood of small, in-expensive EVs.

https://carbuzz.com/news/ford-ceo-says-escape-ev-would-be-cheaper-than-maverick-hybrid#:~:text=A compact electric crossover could be in the pipeline.

Sounds like the bottom line is…….the bottom line.

Gotta figure out how to build cars and sell them at a profit.

Every major manufacturer is watching the EV market closely and adjusting.

Early adopters may have been willing to fork out $50-70k for a midsize daily driver crossover, but the rest of the market will not.

And if they can’t make a profit at the higher prices…….. expect more cutbacks in EV investments in the near future.

 

[Green Machine]

Interesting article of Ford's strategy on EVs. Seems like concern with possible China flood of small, in-expensive EVs.

https://carbuzz.com/news/ford-ceo-says-escape-ev-would-be-cheaper-than-maverick-hybrid#:~:text=A compact electric crossover could be in the pipeline.

Who could see this coming? lol. Farley is as much of a joke as his cousin was. Read what Alan Mulally said about Farley 12 years ago. Not up to running company and basically over rated. I have 6 ford trucks on order since Oct 2022 with allocation, and not one has shown up. at least they build electric cars that don’t meet promise and are over supplied. He did government math with the white house. lol.

 

[dbsb3233]

While there's a lot more to it than just this, the feds jacking the tax credit around made a huge difference. In the span of less than a year, Ford lost the $7500 credit on the Mach-E while many Model Y's gained $7500. That's a whopping $15,000 swing vs it's main competitor. Pulled the rug right out from under Mach-E demand.

Regarding the Escape, it was already announced to be ending in 2025, and likely replaced by an EV. With no ICE/hybrid Escape anymore, I'd expect a whole new vehicle designed ground-up to be EV-only, just taking over the Escape nameplate. Regrettably, I'm not expecting it to be much like the old Escape. Probably smaller and squattier. And short range since battery costs are still a huge problem. Commuter car. ?

 

[Glen Boise]

How long did it take Tesla to become profitable? Wasn't it something like 16 years?

 

[Mach1E]

How long did it take Tesla to become profitable? Wasn't it something like 16 years?

Acceptable for a startup.

Not for a century old company with shareholders.

If it doesn’t make profit in the near future, it goes away. There has to be path to profitability with a light at the end of the tunnel.

Sometimes that light is an oncoming train.

The problem with the statements like “well Tesla/Apple/Amazon did it,” is that there is usually only one example of success with dozens of examples of companies trying to do the same thing and failing.

 

[SashaLondon]

For Europe at least they have to make a small cheap ev. Call it the Fiesta (once a best seller in Europe for many years I think).

 

[dbsb3233]

How long did it take Tesla to become profitable? Wasn't it something like 16 years?

Roughly, although that was with a big assist from the government effectively forcing their competitors to pay them 100's of $millions (even $billions) for emissions credits. That money is what pushed them into the black a few years sooner than it otherwise would have.

It definitely takes time, but the Tesla example is a bit of apples-oranges because the battery tech was way worse when Tesla started vs when Ford started with BEVs. 2015 is roughly the point where battery tech & price started becoming capable of long range on something other than a 6-digit "rich people" car. Anything before that fell more into the "demonstration" or "compliance" categories, with no real chance of becoming mainstream successes.

 

[dbsb3233]

For Europe at least they have to make a small cheap ev. Call it the Fiesta (once a best seller in Europe for many years I think).

Yeah, that fits within the comments by Farley too of needing to go smaller to have any chance at profitability with BEVs. The Fiesta is a good name to bring back, especially made in Mexico which seems more likely now.

 

[Mirak]

Ford is discovering that the EV market is played out in this price segment. Unless you massively cut the price tag (and there’s no help on the way on that score from the government), there aren’t enough buyers left who want to shell out $50k+ for a car with the limitations of current battery tech. So Mach Es stack up on the lots.

Ford could retool to chase the econobox model, but I don’t think it would be wise. I think it would be smarter for Ford to take a step back and wait for the next gen of battery tech to make these cars truly palatable for the masses.

 

[Machetraccs]

What happens to all of us that have this first gen tech? Do they stop updating, stop improving if they step back?

 

[Mach1E]

What happens to all of us that have this first gen tech? Do they stop updating, stop improving if they step back?

Probably not a concern unless they completely stop making EVs. And even then, not an issue until the warranties run out.

Yes, the car has had some improvements over the last few years, but most of it is just squishing bugs.

And as long as we are under warranty, bug squishing will continue. So basically 3+ years after the last first gen is built. 2029 or so?

 

[GreaseMonkey]

What happens to all of us that have this first gen tech? Do they stop updating, stop improving if they step back?

They already stopped updating. This is the car, as it is now. Pretty bad, actually, considering where the competition is.

 

[macchiaz-o]

Yeah, that fits within the comments by Farley too of needing to go smaller to have any chance at profitability with BEVs. The Fiesta is a good name to bring back, especially made in Mexico which seems more likely now.

I know you're making a joke about the name and perhaps you're already aware, but the Fiestas built for the Americas were assembled at the Cuautitlán plant, precisely the same place currently assembling the Mustang Mach-E.

European Fiesta assembly was in Cologne, Germany.

My previous vehicle was a 2014 Fiesta. I liked it overall, especially the total cost of ownership. Now though, I'd want something easier for seniors to get in and out of, with seating a little bit higher up and way more rear legroom.

The way BEVs are engineered these days suggests higher up seating (due to battery size and placement). I'm guessing Ford's next "low cost" BEV will be sized more like an Escape or Focus. I'm hoping for a sedan or hatchback but Americans still seem to be preferring crossovers and larger so that's probably what Ford will stick with.

 

[Mirak]

What happens to all of us that have this first gen tech? Do they stop updating, stop improving if they step back?

We’ll be ok on software for a while. Many ICE cars are running SYNC 4A. I rented an edge that actually runs a slightly smaller version of the same vertical screen we’ve got. And BC Will expand to ICE, too.

The sad thing is that, yes, I think EV-specific software enhancements for this first gen are gonna tail off dramatically.

Should be fine on warranty work.

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