1 in 5 electric vehicle owners in California switched back to gas

[JSW]

I Street Park in SF .........

I do agree that there are likely those that didn't want to put in the extra effort........

You’re committed to the EV - very cool!

Personally, I own a car to add convenience to my life and am unwilling to introduce inconvenience to my life for a car (any car). This remains true even though I’ve owned 3 EVs. Perhaps you and I are at the ends of a spectrum.

It’s interesting how perspective influences our views and what we take away from an article. I ascribe to the ”see a gap, close the gap, continuously improve” approach to work/life. If you don’t see a “gap,“ then improvement is difficult and takes longer. Accordingly, I read the article as being somewhat positive for the future of EVs. Almost like a call-out for faster charging and a more robust charging infrastructure (things I would love to see). Wouldn’t it be glorious if charging stations were as common as gas stations and EVs charged at 3x their current speed. Someday...

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[memcm_expert]

And what person in their right mind would try to charge an EV on a 120v outlet. IMHO, that's insanity defined.

 

[ChasingCoral]

80% of early adopters sticking with it is pretty good percentage I would think. I only have to charge at home or work so it’s easy for me. But even on the couple longer road trips, I actually enjoyed being forced to stop for a bit here and there.

Besides, the 1 in 5 reverting are PHEV drivers.

 

[AllenXS]

And what person in their right mind would try to charge an EV on a 120v outlet. IMHO, that's insanity defined.

There are times when that is reality. It works well unless you live in your car all day. Even then there are ways to make it work.
Not insane. Not anxious.

 

[JeffKeryk]

I didn't read all 5 pages of comments, but I did read the research article. The people who returned to ICE generally did not have adequate home charging. Also, Tesla owners were far less likely to switch back to ICE cars as compared to other brands like Fiat. If I didn't like my car or it broke down a lot I would get rid of it as well. Just posting statistics like "1 in 5" are misleading at best as it suggests people don't like EVs.

 

[2GOfast54]

So much BS in that article. That's what happens when you ask ignorant people about their opinions.
Those who are complaining about charging are the idiots who bought an EV without any idea where they are going to charge it. I bet most of them are young Tesla cult members for whom EV is an ideology, not a means of transportation, who bought more car than they could afford, who live in rental apartments with no access to L2 chargers.
I bet MME buyers are in a very different category, most buy this car because they like it, not because they are environmental crazies, who can afford it, live in their own home and have L2 charger installed.

And solar on the house

 

[Jim D]

The reality is that for a home owner with a garage that can put a 240v outlet in then an electric vehicle is a great option. Not so hot for almost anyone else, public charging is much more expensive and inconvenient. So this leaves out all renters, and most condo owners. If we want to have the country go electric we will need to get the infrastructure into rental buildings and condos. This still doesn't do a thing for people that have on street parking.

 

[KevinS]

This still doesn't do a thing for people that have on street parking.

It's possible. The bigger issue is ICE-holes who think it's funny to block chargers.

https://electrek.co/2021/07/29/egeb-these-new-ev-chargers-are-flat-and-flush-with-the-sidewalk/

 

[tannerk89]

This article is formatted as clickbait… a better title would be “80% of electric vehicle owners do not go back to ICE after their first EV purchase” or something to that effect. Because that is really what the data is showing. Even if they are spinning it to make it seem like “charging is so inconvenient that everyone is switching back!” The Business Insider article (which I believe is the source for this post, but wasn’t cited) has more than a few errors and opinions in it to make it unreliable. I don’t disagree with the opinion that if you don’t have access to charging at home or at work that it’s kind of dumb to own an EV at the moment, although it’s definitely possible to make it work as many have already pointed out.

How many people live in a condo/apt in a city and have to drive a lot anyway?? Isn’t that the whole convenience/point of living downtown? When I lived in a city I was only driving ~7-15miles per day max. I feel like I could make an EV work pretty easily even if I had to DCFC every 7-10 days assuming some longer trips each week using up the rest of the range.

 

[Jim D]

The reality is that for a home owner with a garage that can put a 240v outlet in then an electric vehicle is a great option. Not so hot for almost anyone else, public charging is much more expensive and inconvenient. So this leaves out all renters, and most condo owners. If we want to have the country go electric we will need to get the infrastructure into rental buildings and condos. This still doesn't do a thing for people that have on street parking.

To expand on this a little, the home ownership rate is about 67% in the US and is much higher for white people than others. That 67% includes house, condos, coops so not all will have a garage.
It is definitely true at this point that we are still at an early adopter phase for EVs. To expand EV ownership beyond the early adopters (mostly upper middle class & the rich) it will be necessary to make charging as convenient for people without a garage as it is for people with a garage. The charge at home model just makes much more sense than the gas station (read DC Fast Charger) model. If the Federal government funding is to build out (gas stations) DC Faster Chargers they are making a mistake other than along the big inter-state highways where it is needed. Money would be better spent trying to get L2 charging to people at their home or business.

 

[DevSecOps]

To expand on this a little, the home ownership rate is about 67% in the US and is much higher for white people than others. That 67% includes house, condos, coops so not all will have a garage.
It is definitely true at this point that we are still at an early adopter phase for EVs. To expand EV ownership beyond the early adopters (mostly upper middle class & the rich) it will be necessary to make charging as convenient for people without a garage as it is for people with a garage. The charge at home model just makes much more sense than the gas station (read DC Fast Charger) model. If the Federal government funding is to build out (gas stations) DC Faster Chargers they are making a mistake other than along the big inter-state highways where it is needed. Money would be better spent trying to get L2 charging to people at their home or business.

You can easily get your point across without involving/disparaging people's race, wealth and political views. There are poor white people in this country you know?

 

[Jim D]

You can easily get your point across without involving/disparaging people's race, wealth and political views. There are poor white people in this country you know?

I don't think I was disparaging anyone, I am simply stating facts. The model for what works for ICE, is not necessarily what works best for BEV. The model of charge at home/work seems to work well for BEV but to expand that beyond the early adopters you need to make that work for everyone.

 

[DevSecOps]

The model for what works for ICE, is not necessarily what works best for BEV. The model of charge at home/work seems to work well for BEV but to expand that beyond the early adopters you need to make that work for everyone.

Thank you for making my point. You just said the same thing without involving politically charged views. When we speak without political, social or racial motivation we get our point across much better because it doesn't go against what many people might disagree with.

Factually, most states or utilities have rebates that are meant to cover L2 charging installs. Some don't, but most do. Even if the state doesn't have that, everyone who purchases an EV, other than a Tesla, is eligible for a 7500 fed rebate which should help install that L2 charger. No one is advocating that L3 is the way you should charge on the daily, for a variety of reasons, cost included. A lot of new housing is being built with L2 already "plumbed" in. I think the government and utilities, by means of rebates are already encouraging people to put in L2. I think there might be a few people who take that 7500 on a vacation instead of installing a charger.

Either way the government normally doesn't give credits to switch your gas stove/water heaters to an electrical variant. That's normally left to the utilities. Government does however subsidize fuel in order to keep our costs down so people can afford it (at least that's the intent). So when we compare governmental subsidies of ICE to EV we should be comparing the publicly available refueling/recharging.

Lastly, businesses have HUGE subsidies available for installing L2 and L3 chargers on their property and they can even make a profit on the charging. This would include property owners for apartment and condominium complexes. Why they don't install them ... I believe that it's because the demand from the tenants isn't there. 5 tenants out of 100 may not justify the cost even with subsidies.

 

[Cptmorgemaker]

I believe it because I know so many people,company's that it is to expensive and or can't use because no pulling trucks or here in Midwest massive massive lack of chargers. I will never not own a ice. Ev is pushing but the dates they put will be pushed back. People comparing oh it's easy I love in sf you have no say against ice. Many people by me are driving upwards 100 miles or plus a day ev is not there yet winter hits not taking the chance. Living in a city with ev vs out in the rest of the country is big differences. It still does not fit into alot of people's life. And same I will not go out of my way to make it work sorry not worth my time. There is not much time here and will not spend 20-40 min every other day driving to a super charger. There are times I don't go home for multiple days so my ev is gonna be a massive test to see if it fits into my life. I have a ice, plug in hybrid and love the plug in. But it falls back on ice. My truck ev won't replace for many many many yrs to come. Currant truck EVs coming out are a joke there f150 replacements those are grocery getters they have there spot but true trucks used for work they are far from. I want tech to catch up but also we need nuke I'm all powered on coal. Windmills aren't a solution but please buy them they support my industry alot with massive massive massive carbon footprints.

 

[Cptmorgemaker]

Thank you for making my point. You just said the same thing without involving politically charged views. When we speak without political, social or racial motivation we get our point across much better because it doesn't go against what many people might disagree with.

Factually, most states or utilities have rebates that are meant to cover L2 charging installs. Some don't, but most do. Even if the state doesn't have that, everyone who purchases an EV, other than a Tesla, is eligible for a 7500 fed rebate which should help install that L2 charger. No one is advocating that L3 is the way you should charge on the daily, for a variety of reasons, cost included. A lot of new housing is being built with L2 already "plumbed" in. I think the government and utilities, by means of rebates are already encouraging people to put in L2. I think there might be a few people who take that 7500 on a vacation instead of installing a charger.

Either way the government normally doesn't give credits to switch your gas stove/water heaters to an electrical variant. That's normally left to the utilities. Government does however subsidize fuel in order to keep our costs down so people can afford it (at least that's the intent). So when we compare governmental subsidies of ICE to EV we should be comparing the publicly available refueling/recharging.

Lastly, businesses have HUGE subsidies available for installing L2 and L3 chargers on their property and they can even make a profit on the charging. This would include property owners for apartment and condominium complexes. Why they don't install them ... I believe that it's because the demand from the tenants isn't there. 5 tenants out of 100 may not justify the cost even with subsidies.

You will never get people to switch gas furnace to electric unless u cut electric cost by 95%. Nat is sooooooo cheap and most grids remc grids and place outside of cities can't handle housing switching all electric and EVs in a 10 yr period. Nay gas is so cheap compared to electric for heat not even a comparison. Even if u give someone electric heaters for free in 3-5 yrs it would be more expensive for the electric.

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