American bought Mach-E in Europe?

Jimrpa

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You likely would NOT have to buy a different “modem”. North America and Europe use pretty much all the same LTE bands. This is why your phone works when you go to Europe. You will have to get a data plan and, depending on the type of LTE radio Ford is using, you may have to put in a new SIM from the carrier providing your data plan. If the LTE radio uses an eSIM (like the new Apple iPhones do), you don’t have to swap SIMs.
That said, as I pointed out before, all that gets you is a data connection. I doubt any of the connected services are going to work (or work well) in Europe. They’re likely geofenced.
To make matters worse, it looks like the Europeans have decided to adopt their own, separate standard for electric car charging plugs, so once again, we’ve managed to create multiple standards when we had a chance for simplifying and creating one standard ?
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To make matters worse, it looks like the Europeans have decided to adopt their own, separate standard for electric car charging plugs, so once again, we’ve managed to create multiple standards when we had a chance for simplifying and creating one standard
Unfortunately, there really wasn't much of a choice due to the electrical grid. Here in the states residential service is 240V, whereas almost anywhere else in the world it is 480V.

So, A decision made more than a century ago rears its ugly head again!
 

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You likely would NOT have to buy a different “modem”. North America and Europe use pretty much all the same LTE bands. This is why your phone works when you go to Europe. You will have to get a data plan and, depending on the type of LTE radio Ford is using, you may have to put in a new SIM from the carrier providing your data plan. If the LTE radio uses an eSIM (like the new Apple iPhones do), you don’t have to swap SIMs.
That said, as I pointed out before, all that gets you is a data connection. I doubt any of the connected services are going to work (or work well) in Europe. They’re likely geofenced.
To make matters worse, it looks like the Europeans have decided to adopt their own, separate standard for electric car charging plugs, so once again, we’ve managed to create multiple standards when we had a chance for simplifying and creating one standard ?
Ford TCUs do not have serviceable SIM cards.

There is no way to reprogram a Ford TCU to a different carrier - if the firmware says AT&T, that's an AT&T TCU.

I get that the bands are "pretty much all the same" but the Ford hardware does not work that way.

Replacing the TCU is going to be the only way to get on a European cell network.
 

Jimrpa

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Ford TCUs do not have serviceable SIM cards.

There is no way to reprogram a Ford TCU to a different carrier - if the firmware says AT&T, that's an AT&T TCU.

I get that the bands are "pretty much all the same" but the Ford hardware does not work that way.

Replacing the TCU is going to be the only way to get on a European cell network.
Thanks for the details. Curious that it’s not able to roam off the AT&T network. I guess that means a US Mustang Mach E may not always work in Canada and probably won’t work in Mexico once you get a couple of miles past the border ? Also sounds like it makes manufacturing logistics incredibly complex at the factory if they have to have carrier/country locked radios for every market the vehicle is sold in.
 

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Thanks for the details. Curious that it’s not able to roam off the AT&T network. I guess that means a US Mustang Mach E may not always work in Canada and probably won’t work in Mexico once you get a couple of miles past the border ? Also sounds like it makes manufacturing logistics incredibly complex at the factory if they have to have carrier/country locked radios for every market the vehicle is sold in.
They roam in Canada, my previous Fords with the old 3G modem did work in Canada, but I didn't have the LTE modem and hotspot.

There's no way they're provisioned to roam in Poland or Spain though. Mexico and Canada are probably in Ford's prepaid plan with AT&T.

The manufacturing complexity is/was insane I imagine. The old SYNC 3 modules were different for each market and language pack too, if you imported a US car to GCC you'd need to disassemble the dash and replace the entire SYNC module (APIM) to get Arabic and local maps. US modules only know English/French/Spanish, etc. etc.
 


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MacheMe

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I had to pay an additional $1000 to finalize the order. Did you not?
Nearly all of US dealers did not require any additional deposit, beyond the $500.This tells me the dealer is extremely unlikely to do the right thing. Also, since you're moving to Europe, he figures that you are unlikely to become a repeat customer in the future, so even that little incentive is not there.

Sorry about your situation.
 

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I have a Mach-E First Edition on order. We’re planning to move to Germany (hopefully more than six months after I get the car, because of the extra import taxes)!

Does anyone know if the US version of the Mach-E would need any kind of conversion to make it legal to drive and own in Germany, beyond the license plates?

Is the European charging network compatible with the US made cars?
Where in germany you want to move to ?
 

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If you add up all the modifications to the car (plus buying the charge-convertors) and the hassle, the costs to get it overseas, etc. I think it will be more expensive than the 1500 dollar. Try to revert your reservation to someone that's interested in it, there might be someone that wants to get the MME in a few months instead of over a year. I know it's already hard to get US ICE cars imported and have them allowed to drive here. Let alone take the risk that the car is in Europe and the DC charging station doesn't accept the handshake of the car with the charger.
 

Jimrpa

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They roam in Canada, my previous Fords with the old 3G modem did work in Canada, but I didn't have the LTE modem and hotspot.

There's no way they're provisioned to roam in Poland or Spain though. Mexico and Canada are probably in Ford's prepaid plan with AT&T.

The manufacturing complexity is/was insane I imagine. The old SYNC 3 modules were different for each market and language pack too, if you imported a US car to GCC you'd need to disassemble the dash and replace the entire SYNC module (APIM) to get Arabic and local maps. US modules only know English/French/Spanish, etc. etc.
Again, what you’re describing sounds more like provisioning, which could be accomplished via software, using radios with eSIM, as opposed so some kind of some kind of specialized radios that rare country-locked. Unless you know more about the radios used in the Mustang Mach E, my suspicion would be that they actually use common radios that support all LTE bands, where possible, and just provision and carrier lock them for the market they’re sold in. That would simplify logistics and reduce cost by allowing common parts for all markets.
 

Jimrpa

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Unfortunately, there really wasn't much of a choice due to the electrical grid. Here in the states residential service is 240V, whereas almost anywhere else in the world it is 480V.

So, A decision made more than a century ago rears its ugly head again!
Not sure I understand that. You can buy a plug adaptor cable from the European plug to the American plug. Additionally, manufacturers of other electric appliances have managed to make them work in both Europe and the US (with only plug adaptors). They should be able to step down the voltage? ?‍♂
 
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MacheMe

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In the end, we've decided to not take delivery of the car. It's sad; I was so excited for this car.

There were just too many questions that nobody could answer because it's a brand new model. I tried asking the dealer, their contacts, the Mach-e question line, even calling Ford in Germany, to no avail.

Maybe the car could charge in Europe if I got new charging cables and an adapter. From reading military forums like someone suggested, it sounds like American-bought electric cars can usually(?) charge over there.

But then there are some scary functionality issues. Nobody could tell me:
  • if the navigation system could be updated with European maps without a new head unit
  • if the cellular data connection for the car could be converted to another network
  • if we would get the regular software updates (important in a partially self-driving car)
  • if we would be eligible for warranty or recall repairs
  • how much it would cost to modify the car to meet German TUV requirements to make it "street legal" (different exterior lights, often different tires and mirrors, sometimes additional safety testing). The shipping company I contacted said the car was not on the TUV approved list yet.
People who moved other American-bought electric cars to Germany often ran into those issues.

Because we're planning to move out of the country, we might not get the $7500 federal tax credit. We would have to pay German import and VAT taxes totaling about $17,000, if the car is "new" (meaning less than six months old or with less than 6,000km on the odometer) when shipping it there. Selling the car here soon after buying it is also a bad idea, with an estimated depreciation of roughly 10% on day 1 and 20% after one year.

Overall, we'll have a lot less stress in our lives if we just keep our current, paid-off cars and sell them right before we move.

And they're not giving any of our $1500 deposit back. I offered to help find them a buyer if they cut me a break on the deposit, but they said it would have to be sold to me specifically. So, we walk away.
 
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In the end, we've decided to not take delivery of the car. It's sad; I was so excited for this car.

There were just too many questions that nobody could answer because it's a brand new model. I tried asking the dealer, their contacts, the Mach-e question line, even calling Ford in Germany, to no avail.

Maybe the car could charge in Europe if I got new charging cables and an adapter. From reading military forums like someone suggested, it sounds like American-bought electric cars can usually(?) charge over there.

But then there are some scary functionality issues. Nobody could tell me:
  • if the navigation system could be updated with European maps without a new head unit
  • if the cellular data connection for the car could be converted to another network
  • if we would get the regular software updates (important in a partially self-driving car)
  • if we would be eligible for warranty or recall repairs
  • how much it would cost to modify the car to meet German TUV requirements to make it "street legal" (different exterior lights, often different tires and mirrors, sometimes additional safety testing). The shipping company I contacted said the car was not on the TUV approved list yet.
People who moved other American-bought electric cars to Germany often ran into those issues.

Because we're planning to move out of the country, we might not get the $7500 federal tax credit. We would have to pay German import and VAT taxes totaling about $17,000, if the car is "new" (meaning less than six months old or with less than 6,000km on the odometer) when shipping it there. Selling the car here soon after buying it is also a bad idea, with an estimated depreciation of roughly 10% on day 1 and 20% after one year.

Overall, we'll have a lot less stress in our lives if we just keep our current, paid-off cars and sell them right before we move.

And they're not giving any of our $1500 deposit back. I offered to help find them a buyer if they cut me a break on the deposit, but they said it would have to be sold to me specifically. So, we walk away.
That is really a shame. I can't believe they won't work with you to refund your $1500 deposit. What sticklers. What dealership is this, so that maybe we can blacklist them :)
I'm also surprised they asked for a $1500 NON-REFUNDABLE deposit. I would never have agreed to it. That's such a red flag.
Mine says my $500 deposit is fully refundable at any time.
Sometimes I really hate dealerships. But in the end, it sounds like you made the best decision.

Good riddance to that dealership and best of luck to you in Germany. You might as well order a Mach-E in Germany now :)))
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