Anyone want to run my VIN after CSP 21P22?

louibluey

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... I'm considering getting the tool to do it myself. ...
21P22 is for everyone eligible, no question. But, this thread is raising the issue again how we view MME updates in general. I just want my MME to be up to date, that's it. I don't care if any particular update improves my car or driving experience. I think of MME as as computer, and I want it up to date.

Another aspect, is where the TSB or SSM says customer saw a gear symbol, or told to pull over, I don't want to know if I am one of those. I just want to load the update and never have the problem in the first place (even if only 5 or 50 owners ever experience the problem).

On the other hand, (not for 21P22), I get that dealers need to be paid for their work, and are worried about doing harm if something goes wrong. After reading about Marlin getting a full update, that was my goal. It took months, but I finally found a super nice dealer willing to just update everything. Then, I kind of got it, because it took them hours, overnight (unattended), and they worked on it more the next morning too, I think it was another few hours.

Encouraged by @ProximusAl (one of the experts) postings about his DIY experiences, I finally just went for it. It is expensive to set up to do DIY FDRS, varies somewhat, I went high end with a one year license ($895), but I am so glad that I did it. I have saved so many hours spent talking with dealer service, arranging appointments, going there, etc. Plus, for some of us, it's kind of fun in a weird sort of geek way. For those who are so inclined and can afford it, DIY FDRS is very convenient. There are plenty of experts here who can help you if you have questions, not official, but certainly expert, plus we now have the collective knowledge of the group of DIYer's which include professional software engineers, and of course @breeves002 who keeps us in line.
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Murse-In-Airy

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21P22 is for everyone eligible, no question. But, this thread is raising the issue again how we view MME updates in general. I just want my MME to be up to date, that's it. I don't care if any particular update improves my car or driving experience. I think of MME as as computer, and I want it up to date.

On the other hand, (not for 21P22), I get that dealers need to be paid for their work, and are worried about doing harm if something goes wrong. After reading about Marlin getting a full update, that was my goal. It took months, but I finally found a super nice dealer willing to just update everything. Then, I kind of got it, because it took them hours, overnight (unattended), and they worked on it more the next morning too, I think it was another few hours.

Encouraged by @ProximusAl postings about his DIY experiences, I finally just went for it. It is expensive to set up to do DIY FDRS, varies somewhat, I went high end, but I am so glad that I did it. I have saved so many hours spent talking with dealer service, arranging appointments, going there, etc. Plus, for some of us, it's kind of fun in a weird sort of geek way. For those who are so inclined and can afford it, DIY FDRS is so convenient. There are plenty of experts here who can help you if you have questions, not official, but certainly expert.
For me, I don’t need everything perfectly on the latest software. My deal here and now is that the dealership couldn’t follow basic directions. This isn’t something I felt needed done. This is a service FORD says I need done. This is something explicitly spelled out in print, at a 6th grade reading level. And they still couldn’t follow it.
 

breeves002

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Plus, doesn’t it say they can bill for X hours to do the updates? So if they say they do them and then don’t but bill that it is completed, isn’t that some theft or fraud?
Yes up to 1.3 hours "REAL TIME". The updates should take roughly 1.1 hours if you know what you're doing so they leave 0.2 hours for misc time pulling in the car and hooking the laptop up/launching FDRS.

One member had the dealer do 6 updates to a total of 29 minutes (verified in vehicle history). So 0.5 hours + 0.2 hours for pulling in the car, etc you're at 0.7 hours. They billed 1.1 hours and didn't do all of the updates...
 

benk016

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Yes up to 1.3 hours "REAL TIME". The updates should take roughly 1.1 hours if you know what you're doing so they leave 0.2 hours for misc time pulling in the car and hooking the laptop up/launching FDRS.

One member had the dealer do 6 updates to a total of 29 minutes (verified in vehicle history). So 0.5 hours + 0.2 hours for pulling in the car, etc you're at 0.7 hours. They billed 1.1 hours and didn't do all of the updates...
Does ford check the logs when they receive warranty claims? Like will these payments to dealers be denied if they see the updates weren't actually done?
 

sockmeister

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Wonderful suggestion for Ford. $$SAVE MONEY!! READ BELOW$$

Push these module updates via OTA updates to individual cars who need it. Test it on your own fleet, first.
Let the owner's car update itself overnight. And, avoid getting bills from dealers around the country each time this update is performed on an individual's car.

?‍♂

Edit: According to Darren Palmer, there is no aspect of the car that cannot be updated via OTA update, from the drivetrain to the headlamp software -- so this should be entirely possible right now.
 


Neil4Real

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Wonderful suggestion for Ford. $$SAVE MONEY!! READ BELOW$$

Push these module updates via OTA updates to individual cars who need it. Test it on your own fleet, first.
Let the owner's car update itself overnight. And, avoid getting bills from dealers around the country each time this update is performed on an individual's car.

?‍♂

Edit: According to Darren Palmer, there is no aspect of the car that cannot be updated via OTA update, from the drivetrain to the headlamp software -- so this should be entirely possible right now.
I mean, but that's kind of the point of them putting out this PSA so to speak, its to ensure your car can properly receive OTAs, so they figure the dealer should also perform other updates while they're at it. Hopefully, they've gotten it right and after getting this, people won't have issues with OTAs and they can start to roll out most modules via OTA in the future.
 

wings2063

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I can't figure out how a tech could update some of the modules and not all of them listed in 21P22, my car was supposedly done on Dec 1 and FDRS showed most were not updated.

fdrs.png
 

breeves002

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Does ford check the logs when they receive warranty claims? Like will these payments to dealers be denied if they see the updates weren't actually done?
No because that would take time or an automation that costs time and money to make. Once I see the claim in history Ford has approved it. I have seen multiple now that have gone through that were not fully completed.

Wonderful suggestion for Ford. $$SAVE MONEY!! READ BELOW$$

Push these module updates via OTA updates to individual cars who need it. Test it on your own fleet, first.
Let the owner's car update itself overnight. And, avoid getting bills from dealers around the country each time this update is performed on an individual's car.
I am in 100% agreement with this, but I also think Ford needs to be 100% sure they do it right which is what is taking so long. What's worse than a car that has bugs that you have to take it to the dealer to fix is one that you can't drive because an update bricked it...

Also according to the WSM not every module can be updated OTA but that is subject to change I'm sure.

I mean, but that's kind of the point of them putting out this PSA so to speak, its to ensure your car can properly receive OTAs, so they figure the dealer should also perform other updates while they're at it. Hopefully, they've gotten it right and after getting this, people won't have issues with OTAs and they can start to roll out most modules via OTA in the future.
This is true but at the same time I don't think these updates had much to do with OTA capability. The GWM is the main module that deals with updates and it has had 3 OTA updates just to itself alone so far. It's the "computer and scan tool" interface that programs modules. The difference is they have to figure out how to do it without killing the 12v battery in the process since they make you put it on a charger to do it from the computer.
 

sockmeister

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@sockmeister
This right here.
Ford Mustang Mach-E Anyone want to run my VIN after CSP 21P22? fdrs

is the part that tells the dealer to update the 12 modules.
I’d be all for taking your work order that says “we ain’t doin’ it” and emailing it to David Johnson @ Ford. His email probably isn’t that hard to find. It’s his letterhead the CSP is printed on.
I was about ready to go there with my Service Manager, but apparently he saw the light.
Hmm... I'm actually going to give that a try. Why not!
 

BMT1071

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No because that would take time or an automation that costs time and money to make. Once I see the claim in history Ford has approved it. I have seen multiple now that have gone through that were not fully completed.
Claims can always be debited at a later date. Ford can conduct a warranty audit if they suspect a dealer is being shady with their claims.
 

breeves002

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Claims can always be debited at a later date. Ford can conduct a warranty audit if they suspect a dealer is being shady with their claims.
Yes this is true but my point was they don't at the time of the claim being made apparently. At least for this campaign.
 

BMT1071

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Yes this is true but my point was they don't at the time of the claim being made apparently. At least for this campaign.
Right. Unless the manufacturer is getting complaints that the work wasn't done (like in these cases) or they see a spike in a labor op the claims are going to slide through.
 

breeves002

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Right. Unless the manufacturer is getting complaints that the work wasn't done (like in these cases) or they see a spike in a labor op the claims are going to slide through.
Which is why I'm telling everyone to call Ford that has this happen. I'm not worried so much about the few bucks stolen in labor more so worried people who don't go on the forum will just have no idea their cars were not updated correctly.
 

BMT1071

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Which is why I'm telling everyone to call Ford that has this happen. I'm not worried so much about the few bucks stolen in labor more so worried people who don't go on the forum will just have no idea their cars were not updated correctly.
I agree. The trick is finding the right contact that will actually care and do something about it. Too many reports on here about CSRs just reading from a script and blowing people off.
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