Battery depletion cliff

[MightyMachMike]

I have a 2021 M-E GT with the extended range 88 kw battery pack. Have 2,000 miles, roughly half and half city and interstate highway miles. At 100%, I have never had available range of 270. The best I had was 235 right when I took possession. But the fully charged 100% range has plunged to only 170-180 miles, even with mild 60 degree weather when I drive interstate at 75 mph (I set cruise at 78). I have tried driving very calmly and in “whisper” mode.

Does anyone have insight into this issue? I love the car but this diminished range is pissing me off.

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[dml105]

What is your consumption?

 

[timbop]

This comes up all the time. The cold weather affects efficiency, and the range estimator (guess-o-meter) generally overcompensates for the cold. Your range will be less than the EPA estimate in the winter, and likely higher than the estimate in warm weather. This thread talks about how to more accurately compute your actual range, but the causes of the issue in the first place:

1. Because the car doesn't know how far, how fast, in what conditions, etc it cannot be exact unless you actually put in a route right then - and even that is an approximation based on modeling. Thus the GOM is intentionally conservative as a "worst case" scenario to prevent people from getting stranded because the GOM said they can go farther than they actually can. It tends to be more conservative for this very reason; Ford has been underpromising and overdelivering on the Mach E. While that confounds newbies, doing a little research results in recognizing the issue and not being alarmed by it. By contrast Tesla overestimates their range on their GOM in all conditions; see plenty of actual "real world" driving tests by insideevs, alexonautos, edmunds, etc.
2. ICE engines are only 30% to 40% efficient, with the majority of energy being lost as heat. In winter that is an advantage because the heat that would otherwise be wasted is used to heat the cabin. BEV's are by contrast 95% efficient with minimal energy lost as heat. In the winter the car has to use extra energy to heat the cabin. That is why they tell you to use the seat and steering wheel heaters instead of heating the cabin if you can, because there is a lot less to heat up. The chemistry of Li-ion batteries is to blame as well: the liquid electrolyte loses viscosity (and thus potency) as temps drop well below freezing. At 30 to 40 degrees F it is minimal, but once you get down to around zero or below it becomes an issue. The 2 factors (no waste heat and chemistry) combine for some loss (10% to 20%) in range once it gets down to freezing or below. Therefore in really cold (-30 degree) temps like in Alaska the car's actual range does drop by 40% to 50%. In more reasonable climates (20 degree temps) effective range drops by 20% to 30%.
3. You CAN compensate somewhat by configuring departure times and leaving the car plugged in; this will warm the battery and the cabin using grid power. You can also remote start the car for an impromptu journey, but that doesn't necessarily warm as much as a scheduled departure.
4. EVERY BEV experiences this issue right now; it is not unique to Ford. That is one of the reasons they are all investing so heavily in solid state batteries: "dry" batteries do not experience the issue with the electrolyte in cold weather.

 

[MightyMachMike]

What is your consumption?

dm, not sure what you mean by my consumption?

I knew performance and range would be less in cold and when driving 75 mph. But the decline in range of 25-35% is more than expected. And the decline persists even when moderate temperatures.
Thanks for any help

 

[RickMachE]

Miles per kWh?

 

[jgillmer]

dm, not sure what you mean by my consumption?

I knew performance and range would be less in cold and when driving 75 mph. But the decline in range of 25-35% is more than expected. And the decline persists even when moderate temperatures.
Thanks for any help

Have a pad of paper in your car and r3cord, manually what your actual consumption has been. For example, say you charge to 100% and the range says 180. You drive for the day, say 80 miles. Charge again to 100% and pay attention to how many kWh it took to get to 100%. Take that 80 and divide by the kWh of recharge. That gives you miles per kWh. Multiply by 88 (usable kWh), and you'll have a sense of what your roughly real range is right now. The vehicle also tracks miles per kWh, but if your don't trust what the system is telling you, this manual calculation from time to time is helpful.

Before my MME, I had a Honda Clarity PHEV with an electric range of 50-60 miles (EPA was 47). After the first brush with cold weather, the dash was showing a range of 35. I was furious. Then someone on a board similar to this suggested I track it manually for a week to see what the range really was (and to lay off the heater). I found the real world range to actually be closer to 48-50...not the 60 I would see at 70 degrees outside, but much better than the 35 the car was showing.

 

[Ride_the_lightning]

It must be one of those days that ends in Y…

 

[RockwallRick]

My last charge to 100% came in at 262 but overall with 5500 miles the average is at 3.5 miles per kWh x 88 which equals 308 miles for a full charge.

 

[Mach1E]

dm, not sure what you mean by my consumption?

I knew performance and range would be less in cold and when driving 75 mph. But the decline in range of 25-35% is more than expected. And the decline persists even when moderate temperatures.
Thanks for any help

If you read the forum, you would expect it. This topic comes up multiple times per week.

The colder it is and the higher your speed, the lower your range.

And the “range Guess O Meter (GOM)” is just a guess. If you look at your miles per kWh, you’ll get a more accurate estimate of actual range.

 

[Maquis]

If you read the forum, you would expect it. This topic comes up multiple times per week Day.

The colder it is and the higher your speed, the lower your range.

And the “range Guess O Meter (GOM)” is just a guess. If you look at your miles per kWh, you’ll get a more accurate estimate of actual range.

FIFY ?

 

[MightyMachMike]

This comes up all the time. The cold weather affects efficiency, and the range estimator (guess-o-meter) generally overcompensates for the cold. Your range will be less than the EPA estimate in the winter, and likely higher than the estimate in warm weather. This thread talks about how to more accurately compute your actual range, but the causes of the issue in the first place:

1. Because the car doesn't know how far, how fast, in what conditions, etc it cannot be exact unless you actually put in a route right then - and even that is an approximation based on modeling. Thus the GOM is intentionally conservative as a "worst case" scenario to prevent people from getting stranded because the GOM said they can go farther than they actually can. It tends to be more conservative for this very reason; Ford has been underpromising and overdelivering on the Mach E. While that confounds newbies, doing a little research results in recognizing the issue and not being alarmed by it. By contrast Tesla overestimates their range on their GOM in all conditions; see plenty of actual "real world" driving tests by insideevs, alexonautos, edmunds, etc.
2. ICE engines are only 30% to 40% efficient, with the majority of energy being lost as heat. In winter that is an advantage because the heat that would otherwise be wasted is used to heat the cabin. BEV's are by contrast 95% efficient with minimal energy lost as heat. In the winter the car has to use extra energy to heat the cabin. That is why they tell you to use the seat and steering wheel heaters instead of heating the cabin if you can, because there is a lot less to heat up. The chemistry of Li-ion batteries is to blame as well: the liquid electrolyte loses viscosity (and thus potency) as temps drop well below freezing. At 30 to 40 degrees F it is minimal, but once you get down to around zero or below it becomes an issue. The 2 factors (no waste heat and chemistry) combine for some loss (10% to 20%) in range once it gets down to freezing or below. Therefore in really cold (-30 degree) temps like in Alaska the car's actual range does drop by 40% to 50%. In more reasonable climates (20 degree temps) effective range drops by 20% to 30%.
3. You CAN compensate somewhat by configuring departure times and leaving the car plugged in; this will warm the battery and the cabin using grid power. You can also remote start the car for an impromptu journey, but that doesn't necessarily warm as much as a scheduled departure.
4. EVERY BEV experiences this issue right now; it is not unique to Ford. That is one of the reasons they are all investing so heavily in solid state batteries: "dry" batteries do not experience the issue with the electrolyte in cold weather.

Have a pad of paper in your car and r3cord, manually what your actual consumption has been. For example, say you charge to 100% and the range says 180. You drive for the day, say 80 miles. Charge again to 100% and pay attention to how many kWh it took to get to 100%. Take that 80 and divide by the kWh of recharge. That gives you miles per kWh. Multiply by 88 (usable kWh), and you'll have a sense of what your roughly real range is right now. The vehicle also tracks miles per kWh, but if your don't trust what the system is telling you, this manual calculation from time to time is helpful.

Before my MME, I had a Honda Clarity PHEV with an electric range of 50-60 miles (EPA was 47). After the first brush with cold weather, the dash was showing a range of 35. I was furious. Then someone on a board similar to this suggested I track it manually for a week to see what the range really was (and to lay off the heater). I found the real world range to actually be closer to 48-50...not the 60 I would see at 70 degrees outside, but much better than the 35 the car was showing.

Helpful and I will do. I get the whole estimation thing. But When your car says you have 5% of your SOC left and 10 miles of “estimated range”, do you defy these readings as too conservative and roll the dice when it hits 0%?

i just drove 432 miles on interstate and had to stop 3 times to charge. I started at 100%. Refilled 2x to 80%, the 3rd time from 48% to 75% and got home with 11%. I drive a steady 78 mph (75 limit) and the ave temp was 54 degrees.

i can do the math as you suggest but do you really conclude from that math to ignore the SOC when it says 0% and keep driving? Talk about range anxiety.

 

[Mach1E]

Helpful and I will do. I get the whole estimation thing. But When your car says you have 5% of your SOC left and 10 miles of “estimated range”, do you defy these readings as too conservative and roll the dice when it hits 0%?

i just drove 432 miles on interstate and had to stop 3 times to charge. I started at 100%. Refilled 2x to 80%, the 3rd time from 48% to 75% and got home with 11%. I drive a steady 78 mph (75 limit) and the ave temp was 54 degrees.

i can do the math as you suggest but do you really conclude from that math to ignore the SOC when it says 0% and keep driving? Talk about range anxiety.

No.

Did you keep driving your old gas powered car on empty?

The only only point we are making is that the “estimated range” that you are upset about isn’t necessarily the actual range you are getting.

It may say 170 miles but you actually may have 220.

Not because you can drive past 0%.

This is no different than a gas car range estimator. Mine said like 200 miles (because I drove mostly in the city), but actual highway range was over 300.

Also, just check your “trips” in the app, it will do the math for you.

 

[TheFDMayor]

I have a 2021 M-E GT with the extended range 88 kw battery pack. Have 2,000 miles, roughly half and half city and interstate highway miles. At 100%, I have never had available range of 270. The best I had was 235 right when I took possession. But the fully charged 100% range has plunged to only 170-180 miles, even with mild 60 degree weather when I drive interstate at 75 mph (I set cruise at 78). I have tried driving very calmly and in “whisper” mode.

Does anyone have insight into this issue? I love the car but this diminished range is pissing me off.

...do you have a "heavy" foot?...

 

[iankellogg]

driving near 80 mph is going to really tank the range. probably around 2.6m/kw in the best of weather. (230m range)

 

[RickMachE]

I would never drive to zero.

If you're concerned about range, slow down. Driving 78mph is impacting your range. Set the heat on 68 and use the seat warmer.

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