Biden wants to expand charging network

[dbsb3233]

that's fair. irrelevant to the end result ultimately but fair. a better phrasing would have been "run out of dead dinosaurs that are readily and cheaply available for use in vehicles instead of plastics and other such things"

"cheaply" being a relative term. Oil may remain as cheap as it is, but alternatives like electricity + batteries may get cheaper than oil. Thus the gradual displacement in use.

Sponsored

 

[TheVirtualTim]

Okay, imagine an all Electric USA. Every car, Freight vehicle, commercial vehicle etc. What powers the thousands of Electric Power Grid repair vehicles going into a natural disaster area to repair the Grid? What powers the Heavy equipment lifting collapsed buildings from an earthquake, to free trapped people? What powers the hospital who's life saving equipment is being used 24 hrs a day to save victims? It happens, it's real and it shouldn't be ignored.

We'll always have heavy machines powered by fuel. Years ago (this was pre 9/11) I was in NYC and we had torrential rains ... heavy enough to flood portions of the subway -- trapping the electric trains. They ran diesel locomotives in to tow them out. They planned for that scenario.

In the GM announcement (sorry, I think they use lower case "gm" these days) they are switching over all cars and "light duty" trucks ... but not "medium" or "heavy" duty trucks ... those will still be ICE.

 

[TheVirtualTim]

Part of me wonders ... regarding long cross-country trips ... if folks like Amtrak aren't missing an opportunity here.

You can take the Amtrak Auto-Train which runs between Washington DC and Orlando FL. It occurs to me that with electric cars, there might be a market for more Auto-Train segments.

 

[timbop]

I assume you're saying that the price will increase exponentially so that demand goes down inversely, ensuring the supply never goes to zero?

 

[MightyJawa]

Part of me wonders ... regarding long cross-country trips ... if folks like Amtrak aren't missing an opportunity here.

You can take the Amtrak Auto-Train which runs between Washington DC and Orlando FL. It occurs to me that with electric cars, there might be a market for more Auto-Train segments.

Never heard of this. As somebody who lives in Texas, this sounds like a great idea. It takes me at least a full day to drive anywhere interesting.

 

[dbsb3233]

Both are correct.

 

[Mach-E VLOG]

I don't know if this was posted earlier, but here is an interesting look at where our power will come from in an all EV future.

https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2021-opinion-renewables-will-power-future-of-us-energy/

 

[ARK]

I agree with the sentiment that if the private sector is already building out the charging network at rapid pace, it’s not really a good use of tax dollars to subsidize that. Maybe support it in underserved areas if needed, but hands off is better to the taxpayer and the market.

I think the more constructive role the feds can have is in setting standards so that, like with any ICE, you can pull into any gas station you want and be able to fill up without checking for compatibility, except obviously to be able to do this with chargers.

The cat may be out of the bag for current charging, but perhaps if L4 charging is a thing in the future, they can do this. Same with L2 charging in excess of 48 amps (which I understand does not yet exist). Finally, with wireless charging, if the feds can force a common standard to how that will work because there won’t even be a physical device to look at there to see if the charger is or is not compatible. I think this type of standardization is the most constructive role the feds can have, until/unless the private sector build out of charging stations starts to stall.

 

[ChasingCoral]

Also, can our electrical infrastructure support that?

Easily, especially as so much new renewables are coming online at the same time.

 

[ChasingCoral]

Why are our children going to foot the bill EV stations? They money isn't free?

When the switch from. Horses to cars happened, the Oil companies and Grocery stores paid for the pumps and infrastructure. Why isn't the same thing being allowed in the Electric Arena? Demand will bring more plac s to fill electrons and it won't be our children and grand children saddled with more debt.

Nowhere does it say this would be entirely funded with tax dollars. Many of these sorts of programs use multipliers, providing grants to states, cities, or private industry but requiring a match.

 

[dbsb3233]

Also, can our electrical infrastructure support that?

That kinda depends. If they just sit empty most of the time, yes. Which may very well happen, since most charging will take place at home, overnight. Which actually helps the grid by evening out demand, which usually bottoms out overnight.

The path we should avoid IMO is promoting public charging as the norm rather than the exception. We need public charging, yes, but it should be targeted to serve infrequent usages, like road trips, or very heavy users that drive hundreds of miles a day.

The primary method we should be promoting for 90% of charging is "set it & forget it" L2 where people live. Homes, apartment complexes, etc. The places where people stay for 10+ hours and can just park the car when they get home like normal. And leave 10+ hours later like normal. No running in and out every hour to play musical chairs with the cars. That's how this will be accepted for mass adoption - if it's that easy, and normal.

 

[shutterbug]

Part of me wonders ... regarding long cross-country trips ... if folks like Amtrak aren't missing an opportunity here.

You can take the Amtrak Auto-Train which runs between Washington DC and Orlando FL. It occurs to me that with electric cars, there might be a market for more Auto-Train segments.

Amtrak is all about missed opportunities.

 

[Mach-E VLOG]

That kinda depends. If they just sit empty most of the time, yes. Which may very well happen, since most charging will take place at home, overnight. Which actually helps the grid by evening out demand, which usually bottoms out overnight.

The path we should avoid IMO is promoting public charging as the norm rather than the exception. We need public charging, yes, but it should be targeted to serve infrequent usages, like road trips, or very heavy users that drive hundreds of miles a day.

The primary method we should be promoting for 90% of charging is "set it & forget it" L2 where people live. Homes, apartment complexes, etc. The places where people stay for 10+ hours and can just park the car when they get home like normal. And leave 10+ hours later like normal. No running in and out every hour to play musical chairs with the cars. That's how this will be accepted for mass adoption - if it's that easy, and normal.

Before I started research EVs, I was really worried about fast public charging. Then I looked at my own driving history and quickly realized, I will rarely use public fast charging. Ignoring the oddball 2020, the most I drove in one day in 2019 was 165 miles.

The other thing I hope takes off is charging at hotels. That would eliminate the need for one more charging stop and make it easier to top off by charging overnight. And it would be beneficial to the grid demands since that would be off peak as well.

 

[dbsb3233]

Before I started research EVs, I was really worried about fast public charging. Then I looked at my own driving history and quickly realized, I will rarely use public fast charging. Ignoring the oddball 2020, the most I drove in one day in 2019 was 165 miles.

The other thing I hope takes off is charging at hotels. That would eliminate the need for one more charging stop and make it easier to top off by charging overnight. And it would be beneficial to the grid demands since that would be off peak as well.

That's how better batteries changed the game, by enabling 250+ mile range. The old 70 mile BEVs were never gonna work for mass adoption. Most people weren't going to put up with ABC (Always Be Charging).

We talk a lot about how the public is going to have to learn and get used to a new paradigm for transitioning from ICE to BEV. Which is true to some degree. But honestly, I think that applies to the early BEV adopters of the last few decades as well, that adopted the ABC method because range was so short. Expecting the masses to ABC just isn't gona fly. Most people will want to do most of their charging overnight (or while at work for 8 hours, etc), not nickel-and-diming at every stop along the way. And not half hour DCFC stops.

That's why I always say getting L2 chargers into apartment and condos complexes will make the biggest difference in BEV adoption. Private homes can do their own. That's what most of us are doing now. The next mass wave will be people without their own homes, and that's gonna require L2 in the parking lots/garages of their residences to really work.

Sponsored