LYTMCQ

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There are several charging curves out there and no knowing what the baseline conditions they are based upon. You'll notice it actually goes over 250kWh p to 20% and less than 250kWh to 30%.

The one you posted is based on V3 250kWh Tesla. The Electrify America's are 350kWh built to handle the Porsche Taycan and other fast chargers from VW group.

https://forum.abetterrouteplanner.c...mage.png.3e56461ec054c08d0b14920863c86cbe.png

Current production Taycan's do not have the full 350kWh charge capability yet and are peaking 277kWh. Porsche has an update coming for that.
 
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dbsb3233

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Bottom line, put all your money into as much range as you can get.
Unless you aren't likely to use it. For instance, on the Mach-e AWD, it costs $5000 extra for the 270 mile battery vs the 210. If the extra 60 miles (more like 40 at high speed) isn't enough extra to make the difference in choosing to drive the Mach-e on a road trip instead of an ICE car, then spending the extra $5000 is a waste of money.

That's only if you have a 2nd (ICE) car in the household, or would consider renting one for infrequent road trips.
 

Billyk24

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I've heard anecdotes that PHEV cars get used like ICE cars or standard hybrid since people either don't have easy charging options or are just lazy about plugging in.

Any thoughts on how effective PHEV cars actually are at running battery electric most of the time?
Look.
20190816_161336.jpg
 

LYTMCQ

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Unless you aren't likely to use it.
Circumstances change. Resale value.

If you change jobs or housig and have to drive further and now you have an expensive car that can't practically do it and you'll take a hit on resale due range.

I can only tell you my experience and it is range, range, range wonderful range.
 

dbsb3233

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Circumstances change. Resale value.

If you change jobs or housig and have to drive further and now you have an expensive car that can't practically do it and you'll take a hit on resale due range.

I can only tell you my experience and it is range, range, range wonderful range.
With that approach, one should only buy a Ford Excursion, because you might have 4 kids and need the seating to haul them around one day.

Sure, life situations might change. Doesn't mean it makes sense to spend a bunch extra now just because you might be in a different situation years later. There's perfectly good and logical situations in which to buy the SR battery, just as there's perfectly good and logical situations in which to buy the ER battery.
 
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dbsb3233

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To this topic of the Rivian or F-150E with 400 mile range. That 5 minute charge is 132 miles of range.
Info on the Rivian is that it accepts a peak charge rate of 160 kW. That's 2.66 kWh/minute. 5 minutes at peak charge would be 13 kWh added.

The 400 mile version has a 180 kWh battery, which calculates to 2.2 miles/kWh efficiency. Maybe 2.4 if assuming a fair reserve in that calculation. 2.4 * 13 = 31 miles added in 5 minutes. Not anywhere close to 132.
 

pbojanoski

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With that approach, one should only buy a Ford Excursion, because you might have quadruplets and need the seating to haul them around one day.

Sure, life situations might change. Doesn't mean it makes sense to spend a bunch extra now just because you might be in a different situation years later. There's perfectly good and logical situations in which to buy the SR battery, just as there's perfectly good and logical situations in which to buy the ER battery.
I really hate to say it, but that guy always has an answer to everything and always has the "facts" to back it up. (Whether the "facts" are relevant is not important.) There is no reasoning or any logic to be used to overcome his brilliance. It just...is.

Getting punched in the face by Mike Tyson in his prime is a more enjoyable endeavor. 😵 🤪🥴

If you want to go another round with Mike (er, Lyt), I'm in your corner @dbsb3233!

(I feel bad about stooping to this kind of post, but every now and then I can't help it.)
 

LYTMCQ

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Info on the Rivian is that it accepts a peak charge rate of 160 kW.
"Rivian Truck Battery Patent Suggests Better, Faster Charging. Electric truck and SUV startup Rivian filed a patent application for fast-charging electric vehicle batteries at different voltages using a switch mechanism.

"The patent describes a configurable battery that when used in an electric vehicle can accept charging voltages of either 450 or 900 volts and use less expensive components.

"However, the absolute charging rates are unlikely to be of much value for the foreseeable future. There are no plans to go beyond 350 kW charging infrastructure, he said."

https://www.trucks.com/2019/05/07/rivian-truck-battery-patent-faster-charging/
 

dbsb3233

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From the same article:

"The company has said that its vehicles can use fast-charging stations up to 160 kW, which would provide about 200 miles of range in 30 minutes."

That just confirms what I said. At a peak rate of 160 kW, that's 2.66 kWh per minute going into the battery. Looks like they're assuming an efficiency rate of 2.5 miles/kWh (I estimated 2.4), as that would calculate to the 200 miles (2.66 x 30 minutes x 2.5 miles/kWh = 200 miles).

That assumes it charges at 160 kW for 30 minutes with no tapering. That's 44% of the battery (2.66 x 30 minutes = 80 kWh / 180 capacity = 44%).
 

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Well let's just be reasonable. The MME is the best choice of all EV to buy at this time.
I and you will pay 50K to 60K for the best EV available at this time. I am so tired of
all the MATH and SCIENCE and stupid charging ideas !! IF you can afford the MME
who the hell cares about nit-picking those things. Buy it if and when it becomes
available. I DO NOT CARE about the cost to charge or the curve of charging or
any other crap of science. I can afford it and can afford to charge it at any price.
I had the Tesla Roadster. Bought it, had fun with it, AND DID NOOOO math or
science before buying. This BS about saving a penny means maybe you really
should not buy something you can't afford. The "Know It All" BS has to stop.
Spend your money as you can't take it with you. And you will also help economy.
 

LYTMCQ

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From the same article:
Exactly. 160kWh to 350kWh charging range are both mentioned. Where Rivian ends up with the charging rate two years from now is a question mark. The 360kWh chargers become the "Diesel" pumps of the 21st century for the big battery F-150's, GMC Hummer Pickups and Rivians.

Even at the "gasoline" pumps at 150kWh, with 180kWh battery/400 mile range, 33% is 132 miles at 150kWh with no ramping down, the 60kWh in 20 minutes.

As with Porsche, the high end (and 180kWh F-150's are going to very high end) models charge at 350kWh. Lower end at 150kWh.

Rivian filing the patent for the super fast charging shows where they are going and Ford is part owner of Rivian with pickups being Ford's top selling model and export.
 

LYTMCQ

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I am so tired of all the MATH and SCIENCE and stupid charging ideas !!
I think it's called bliss.

On the other hand EV's are more products of the STEM school.

"STEM is a curriculum based on the idea of educating students in four specific disciplines — science, technology, engineering and mathematics — in an interdisciplinary and applied approach. Rather than teach the four disciplines as separate and discrete subjects, STEM integrates them into a cohesive learning paradigm based on real-world applications."

https://www.livescience.com/43296-what-is-stem-education.html
 

Sweetwater

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I think it's called bliss.

On the other hand EV's are more products of the STEM school.

"STEM is a curriculum based on the idea of educating students in four specific disciplines — science, technology, engineering and mathematics — in an interdisciplinary and applied approach. Rather than teach the four disciplines as separate and discrete subjects, STEM integrates them into a cohesive learning paradigm based on real-world applications."

https://www.livescience.com/43296-what-is-stem-education.html
Hey jerk face. I know those teachings. How do you think I became a very
good UNION Electrican?
 
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