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Charging FAIL & GREAT Surprise When We Compare The Model Y & Mach-E On The World’s Toughest EV Test!

Maric

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Yeah I think the Ford steering is a little slow and the it doesn't do as well of a job hiding its weight overall. It isn't as much fun on a twisty road but then again it is a MUCH better highway cruiser and an overall more comfortable commuter.
I think that will be much less obvious in an extended range model (hiding the weight). The MachE is a heavy car and that extra horsepower makes the car more nimble.
 

trutolife27

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Very interesting comparison! Throwing together info from the data that was said in the video, it shows that the range of these two vehicles is much closer than their DTE estimates (and EPA ratings) would suggest. Shows the Model Y has slightly better efficiency (to be expected since it's lighter, more aerodynamic, Tesla tends to have very efficient drive systems, heat pump), more gross battery capacity, but that only nets to about 50 more miles of range in these conditions.
TFL_ModelY_MachE.jpg


Biggest difference here is the DCFC rate and ease of operation, which definitely lands in Tesla's favor. Also much higher power, but that's not a fair comparison until you've got a MachE GT to compare.

Not a bad comparison for a car that is $20k cheaper with incentives, especially if you do not do a lot of 200+ mile road trips!
yep agree. I know they had to deal with what ford sent them. But could they have rented or got a model y long-range since many of them are out for the test?🤔

I did find it funny the post also talked about not needing to speed the money for the ext battery but they are driving a performance model y?

Again your testing pre-production to a model that has been out a while with updates, the grain of salt they can only test what given.

Also using the self-driving keep distance hurts range depending on if one car gets cut off more than the other. Real test gets on the road middle of the night on a Sunday no one on the road test the range. Like kyle will be doing.

Overall they did the best they could.
 
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dbsb3233

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I was hoping for a more exact summary of miles per kWh
Yep. But the few screenshots were helpful. Using only about 11% for climate control is good news, however I suspect he may have had the cabin heat off or really low. Didn't say though, so hard to tell.

Kyle's video showed 31% for climate when he said he has cabin heat on to about 70F.

I just drove up/down that route this morning. Temps were in the low teens (F). Looked maybe a little warmer on their day (didn't see much breath while they were talking). But even it were 35F, he probably has some cabin heat on to make it at least tolerable.
 

TFLtommy

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Yep. But the few screenshots were helpful. Using only about 11% for climate control is good news, however I suspect he may have had the cabin heat off or really low. Didn't say though, so hard to tell.

Kyle's video showed 31% for climate when he said he has cabin heat on to about 70F.

I just drove up/down that route this morning. Temps were in the low teens (F). Looked maybe a little warmer on their day (didn't see much breath while they were talking). But even it were 35F, he probably has some cabin heat on to make it at least tolerable.
I discussed it above, it was about 47kWh used on the Ford, about 40kWh used on the Tesla!
 

TFLtommy

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@TFLtommy love your series and love Blaze (my dog is horrible off lead)

Question I have is, do you envisage Ford provided Over the Air updates as they gain more data to improve range and performance like Tesla did in the early years?

Benefit for manufacturers to incrementally release new drops is it keeps their cars more current without the cost of mid-life facelifts. I wouldn't be surprised if this is Fords strategy as the stats from the battery suggests that performance could be better so maybe they are holding something back .

Any inside word or rumours from Ford?
Yeah I sure hope Ford is able to work it out! I am hopeful!
 

dbsb3233

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You noted a not so good mach-e consumption rate going up hill (2.41 mi/kw?) what were temps that day?
I'll be THRILLED if I get 2.4 miles/kWh going up I-70 to the Eisenhower Tunnel. I was impressed by that number. Although they appear to have a lot of traffic that day so speeds were probably slow. Also depends on cabin heat usage too (I suppose I should read the rest of the thread first, maybe it's mentioned). Still though, 2.4 is better than I expected for that climb.
 

Randy E.

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I really wonder why Ford gave them a SR version. Maybe it was just a matter of logistics, but they must have known that TFL would be doing range tests, so you would think they would have wanted to put their best foot forward.
I really wonder why Ford gave them a SR version. Maybe it was just a matter of logistics, but they must have known that TFL would be doing range tests, so you would think they would have wanted to put their best foot forward.
My best guess is going apple’s to apple’s would not be the best play for Ford. Thus, giving them a standard range vehicle eliminates the range comparisons....

What TFL should have done is shown some final data on final miles per kWh. Did they both set internal temps the same a d have like cabin features on, etc?... no clue, as it seemed less scientific data-based and more “let’s have some fun” based...
 

dbsb3233

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OK, so that comes out to 3 mi/kwh for the MME and 3.5 mi/kwh for the Y. Not bad for either given the conditions. It is definitely not a good sign that the EA chargers had so many issues, though.

Oh, and good to see you joining the discussions!
3.0 for the MME for that drive is very positive, IMO. EPA is 211 / 68 kWh usable battery = 3.1. They nearly matched EPA on a cold, often wet road highway drive with steep slopes.
 

trutolife27

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I discussed it above, it was about 47kWh used on the Ford, about 40kWh used on the Tesla!
The drag coefficient is playing a part also. Mache around .28 and the model y .23
One built for looks and the other more aero.
The biggest test will be trying to get perfect road conditions and temps and see how they compare to what each company says they should get.

Yes, I understand that is no way easy, but hopefully, when the mache is out everywhere and temps are warmer we will find out.

The large reserve in the mache and no aero well covers play a part also. The models you have had no aero covers on either, great job on that.
But with aero covers on a mache 15 to 20 more miles of range could be added.
Many things we know about the model y and mache well... still learning.
 

Randy E.

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What interests me here is that the MME got 97% of rated range in a real world test, where it had to run the heater no less, compared to the 84% of rated range that the MY got. Combine that with the miles-till-empty meter seeming to be MUCH more accurate on the MME and I would suggest even with DCFC hiccups that it might make a better trip car: less guesswork for inexperienced drivers. The downside is longer charging times based on current evidence.
The MME appears “smarter” or at least more transparent in factoring what you are truly going to get via what you’ve got in juice vs MY?
Tesla’s are know for much larger mileage claims than they actually pull off in real world driving.
What Tesla’s largest advantage over the competition to-date currently, is their charging station buildout and their efficient inverter solutions - they simply have that DC to AC inversion ar Max efficiency levels, while other players like Ford have a learning curve to still overcome.
 

trutolife27

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3.0 for the MME for that drive is very positive, IMO. EPA is 211 / 68 kWh usable battery = 3.1. They nearly matched EPA on a cold, often wet road highway drive with steep slopes.
yes, that is what we need. true info and hold ford and tesla to the flame about meeting what is said.
 

dbsb3233

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NOTE: Does anyone remember Woody Allen's movie, sleeper? Yes, those vehicles, that's what the Telsa vehicles always remind me of. Ha!
Funny you mention that movie. The Sleeper house is right along the route Tommy did on this test.
Charles-Deaton-house09.jpg
 

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I'll be THRILLED if I get 2.4 miles/kWh going up I-70 to the Eisenhower Tunnel. I was impressed by that number. Although they appear to have a lot of traffic that day so speeds were probably slow. Also depends on cabin heat usage too (I suppose I should read the rest of the thread first, maybe it's mentioned). Still though, 2.4 is better than I expected for that climb.
Looked warm 32 oF range? Darn you guys get a lot of snow there. Their was not enough info to draw too many conclusion.
 

dbsb3233

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I discussed it above, it was about 47kWh used on the Ford, about 40kWh used on the Tesla!
Thanks Tommy. Were you using cabin heat, or just heated seats & steering wheel? And if cabin heat, set to what temp? TIA!
 



 









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