Darren Palmer - Describing Team Edison & Human Centered Design

[dbsb3233]

Very good point. If you aren't able to charge at home or work then public charging suddenly becomes much more important. Still doable....but more thought goes into that decision for sure.

Exactly. It's a pretty big sacrifice to babysit the car at an L3 charger for 20-40 minutes once or twice every single week. It's one thing to do it 3-4 times a year for road trips, but it's quite another to do it 75 times a year around home.

Some of that can be double-dipped if you happen to have an L3 charger near home that's in the parking lot of a grocery store you shop at regularly anyway. Or restaurants you like. But even that's only partially helpful. That not only grows tiresome, it really limits your options. You feel "stuck" having to shop at that Walmart, or eating at that Taco Bell over and over and over. And then there's the issue of the chargers being full or broken when you need them, with few backups.

Some people will put up with that, but I don't think most will. And it's important for potential buyers to know what they're getting themselves into.

I've always said I expect BEV market share to top out at something like 30%, for just those reasons. It's a great fit for a family with a house and garage and 2 cars (one ICE + one BEV). Beyond that though the benefits start shrinking because of the charging time issues. Unless/until there's a quantum leap in charging technology along the way that brings the times down by 4x or something.

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[GoGoGadgetMachE]

One thing I thought was very interesting in that video was the very end - the reservation holders have a higher credit rating than the Lincoln portfolio. I am a little concerned that means it's missing the "performance for everyone" part of the Mustang name, which was already a concern at the price.

 

[macchiaz-o]

One thing I thought was very interesting in that video was the very end - the reservation holders have a higher credit rating than the Lincoln portfolio. I am a little concerned that means it's missing the "performance for everyone" part of the Mustang name, which was already a concern at the price.

When I heard that part I wondered how they would know our credit ratings. I don't remember authorizing any credit inquiry. Is this something they're able to get while taking a credit card payment from us? Or just from our name and mailing address, without explicit permission?

 

[hybrid2bev]

When I heard that part I wondered how they would know our credit ratings. I don't remember authorizing any credit inquiry. Is this something they're able to get while taking a credit card payment from us? Or just from our name and mailing address, without explicit permission?

I don’t know if this has happened, but it’s possible Ford did a ‘soft pull’ on reservation holders credit. A soft pull does not affect or reflect on your credit report nor does affect your FICO score (it does not show as an inquiry on your report). Soft pulls are done all the time for pre-approval offers by many companies. And yes, it can be done without your explicit permission, because a soft pull is invisible to both you and other creditors.

 

[silverelan]

One thing I thought was very interesting in that video was the very end - the reservation holders have a higher credit rating than the Lincoln portfolio. I am a little concerned that means it's missing the "performance for everyone" part of the Mustang name, which was already a concern at the price.

Well, truth be told, the price point is a bit self-selective.

When I heard that part I wondered how they would know our credit ratings. I don't remember authorizing any credit inquiry. Is this something they're able to get while taking a credit card payment from us? Or just from our name and mailing address, without explicit permission?

Companies do cursory profile checks all the time on potential customer credit scores. That is how and why you get unsolicited offers for all sorts of things. We are a bit off-topic now but the fact of the matter is consumer credit histories are not for consumers, they are for companies. Equifax, Experian, TransUnion, and whatever other credit scoring companies that are out there... you are not the customer for your own credit score data.

 

[jlauro]

That helps explain all the concern on this forum about public charging stations.
After you get your first EV, you will realize that almost all your charging occurs during your spare time when the vehicle isn't even being used. ie: At home, at work, while shopping etc....

For many people, it doesn't matter if it's not an issue for 98% of the time. People realize that, but they want to be covered 100% of the time, and when you are hundreds of miles away from home is when they are most concerned.

Many people can simply say I will not use this vehicle for that 2% of the time and will rent a vehicle or do something else. Other will say if I am spending $50K for a vehicle, I expect it to meet all my needs and not have to deal using something else for a long trip.

 

[dbsb3233]

Other will say if I am spending $50K for a vehicle, I expect it to meet all my needs and not have to deal using something else for a long trip.

That's a point that I still struggle to get past. For that kinda money, it's just hard to buy something that requires more compromise.

I partially justify that to myself by remembering I'd also have compromise if I were buying a pickup as a 2nd vehicle instead. While it wouldn't have fueling issues like a BEV, it would have other practical limitations. For road trips, we'd surely choose to drive the Escape instead of the pickup, just like we will to drive the Escape over the Mach-e. So it's kinda the same situation, just for a different reason.

Still though, is a bit frustrating to have to do a justification like that for a $50k+ vehicle.

 

[ChasingCoral]

My MachE will be my first Ford since I purchased a new 1971 Ford Pinto.

Right. I'd forgotten forgot my wife's Pinto I "inherited" when we married. It didn't last long after that -- engine seized up on the interstate.

We has a 1991-ish Ford Taurus. Good wagon.

 

[ChasingCoral]

Interesting statistic that said 62% of folks believe you can't take a BEV on a long road trip. Even a lot of folks here seem to feel that they can't or just won't (too much hassle).

 

[dbsb3233]

Interesting statistic that said 62% of folks believe you can't take a BEV on a long road trip. Even a lot of folks here seem to feel that they can't or just won't (too much hassle).

"can't take" would be an overreach in most cases (depending on the route, and how long "long" is). But the hassle aspect is very accurate (a result of long recharging times).

Gonna be interesting to see how fast the BEV segment grows, and where it'll top out in market share. And if/when new battery technology can improve enough to get charging times down close to ICE refuel times. I think most of the public is still underestimating what BEVs are capable of. But similarly, I think many of the enthusiasts are overly optimistic of how far they'll reach into the market, and undercount how real those charging time issues are for most mainstream buyers.

The good news is there's a ton of market share still to be had among the "low hanging fruit" area of the market. We're only around 2-3% now. 30% is well within reach IMO, which still represents a monumental shift. Plus, 30% of vehicles on the road will probably represent 50-60% of total miles driven, since they'll skew heavily toward being commuter cars.

 

[buzznwood]

Interesting statistic that said 62% of folks believe you can't take a BEV on a long road trip. Even a lot of folks here seem to feel that they can't or just won't (too much hassle).

I think like others state, can't take is more down to the hassle factor, sure you can but do you want to. One of my co-workers is a massive tesla fan but they gave up attempting the long range trips with it a long time ago and resorted to using the ice as it just turns into too much hassle.

If you have access to home charging the BEV is perfect for a lot of what people you get up in the morning with a full tank of gas and go about your business as long as your daily commute / tasks fit within the worst case range you are fine.

Once you start attempting a long range journey that goes out the window and it is nothing but compromises which a lot of people will just find unacceptable, it is not like this is the worlds first car where it is all new plenty of people do long journeys in ICE vehicles everyday and for the BEV to not be seen as some sort of novelty to blog about it has to do it the same or better.

For me the mach-e is going to purchased on a bit of blind faith, exterior dimensions are withing in my preferred c/d class size while it has space for a large battery pack as at the end of the day the electric motors don't care where the electricity comes from so at some point in the future battery tech will hopefully evolved to the point where I can replace the li-ion battery pack for a graphene battery pack that will offer faster charging with around 5x the density in the same amount of space so taking the potential range into the 800+ zone, once we get to that point then a long journeys will no longer be a hassle.

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