Marlin's Dead Low Voltage Battery (LVB) -- Followed by Stuck in Park

Badger_Prof

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BEVs, 30% coal fired.
Maybe your BEV in Florida is 30% coal fired but mine will be 0% coal fired by the end of the year. The following are approximate: 62% solar; 8% wind; 30% gas. For 1 cent per kw hour extra cost, I could opt for 100% sustainable with no price increase for 25 years. 50% of my current electricity comes from a shared community solar array with price locked at 10.9 cents kwh for 25 years.
 

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Friday evening update: Marlin won't be home this weekend.

I spent 20 minutes late this afternoon chatting with the Field Service Engineer who has been working with Marlin at Koons Ford all week. It looks like Marlin had a "common" (my word) problem followed by a unique problem.

First a correction. The FSE working on Marlin wasn't sent down from Dearborn as someone at Koons had told me. He's one of a couple of FSEs assigned to this area (makes much more sense).

The "common" problem:
I don't say this meaning it is common to all the early build Mach Es. However, it has been seen in multiple Mach Es (perhaps @eponyinIL and others here who have had drained LVBs) and is being solved with a software update. My understanding of the problem explains why it looks like there are two problems: a vampire loss from the LVB and the HVB isn't keeping the LVB charged. It is really just one problem: sometimes, after charging ends for whatever reason, a system related to the DC-DC converter is somehow remaining open and draining the LVB. That explains why the LVB is draining and the DC-DC converter isn't keeping it recharged off the HVB. The solution is a software upgrade with the latest version that should eliminate this situation. It sounds like the same solution applied to @eponyinIL's Mach E and is how they solved Marlin's battery drain issue.

The unique problem:
Unfortunately, when one of the Koons employees went to drive Marlin around from the shop for me to take him home, something activated the electronic parking brake pawl. This is not the drive problem other cars have had and has only been seen in a couple of EU preproduction models with very different control modules. The good news is there has been no sign the battery issue is still there and they managed to get the problem cleared today and test drove Marlin but they can't fully reproduce the issue or identify the problem, even with a bunch of sophisticated sensor equipment plugged into Marlin and the enhanced logging software. With a desire to give it more intense diagnostics to find and solve the second issue, the FSE asked my permission to move Marlin up to Ford's Washington, DC area Training Facility up in Frederick, MD. There, the FSE and regional service trainer, collaborating with the Dearborn team, can better work on Marlin to get to the bottom of the issue. They'll probably take him up there Monday.

I did volunteer to take Marlin over the weekend and do some driving so they can gather more data. I also offered to drive him up to Frederick. The FSE indicated such a decision was well over his head and suspects the answer will be no ?. It was worth asking, though :D.

The FSE was great to talk with, very apologetic this was happening but very reassuring that the Ford engineering team is doing everything they can to diagnose and solve the problem.

I definitely won't have Marlin back (for good) before next week. It looks like I may have to scratch the plan to get PPF and ceramic before heading to Florida. The Florida trip may still be possible. ?

I should get regular, perhaps daily, updates from them next week.
So good news with not so good news. But it’s great Ford offered to take it to their facility ... it’s more inconvenient for you but if they can get to the bottom of this then it’s a great outcome
 

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Friday evening update: Marlin won't be home this weekend.

I spent 20 minutes late this afternoon chatting with the Field Service Engineer who has been working with Marlin at Koons Ford all week. It looks like Marlin had a "common" (my word) problem followed by a unique problem.

First a correction. The FSE working on Marlin wasn't sent down from Dearborn as someone at Koons had told me. He's one of a couple of FSEs assigned to this area (makes much more sense).

The "common" problem:
I don't say this meaning it is common to all the early build Mach Es. However, it has been seen in multiple Mach Es (perhaps @eponyinIL and others here who have had drained LVBs) and is being solved with a software update. My understanding of the problem explains why it looks like there are two problems: a vampire loss from the LVB and the HVB isn't keeping the LVB charged. It is really just one problem: sometimes, after charging ends for whatever reason, a system related to the DC-DC converter is somehow remaining open and draining the LVB. That explains why the LVB is draining and the DC-DC converter isn't keeping it recharged off the HVB. The solution is a software upgrade with the latest version that should eliminate this situation. It sounds like the same solution applied to @eponyinIL's Mach E and is how they solved Marlin's battery drain issue.

The unique problem:
Unfortunately, when one of the Koons employees went to drive Marlin around from the shop for me to take him home, something activated the electronic parking brake pawl. This is not the drive problem other cars have had and has only been seen in a couple of EU preproduction models with very different control modules. The good news is there has been no sign the battery issue is still there and they managed to get the problem cleared today and test drove Marlin but they can't fully reproduce the issue or identify the problem, even with a bunch of sophisticated sensor equipment plugged into Marlin and the enhanced logging software. With a desire to give it more intense diagnostics to find and solve the second issue, the FSE asked my permission to move Marlin up to Ford's Washington, DC area Training Facility up in Frederick, MD. There, the FSE and regional service trainer, collaborating with the Dearborn team, can better work on Marlin to get to the bottom of the issue. They'll probably take him up there Monday.

I did volunteer to take Marlin over the weekend and do some driving so they can gather more data. I also offered to drive him up to Frederick. The FSE indicated such a decision was well over his head and suspects the answer will be no ?. It was worth asking, though :D.

The FSE was great to talk with, very apologetic this was happening but very reassuring that the Ford engineering team is doing everything they can to diagnose and solve the problem.

I definitely won't have Marlin back (for good) before next week. It looks like I may have to scratch the plan to get PPF and ceramic before heading to Florida. The Florida trip may still be possible. ?

I should get regular, perhaps daily, updates from them next week.
Kudos to you man - you have the patience of a saint. I know you’re doing your best to be a good advocate for the Mach E and Ford. I’m not sure if I would be able to handle it - I’d probably just tell them to give me a new one and keep the vehicle as a tester.

I hope it all works out for you and I know we all appreciate the info you’ve been sharing!
 
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ChasingCoral

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So good news with not so good news. But it’s great Ford offered to take it to their facility ... it’s more inconvenient for you but if they can get to the bottom of this then it’s a great outcome
Hey, it’s not like I’ve been able to visit Marlin in the hospital anyway.
 


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Kudos to you man - you have the patience of a saint. I know you’re doing your best to be a good advocate for the Mach E and Ford. I’m not sure if I would be able to handle it - I’d probably just tell them to give me a new one and keep the vehicle as a tester.

I hope it all works out for you and I know we all appreciate the info you’ve been sharing!
Your attitude is notable indeed Mark! I would like to say I would be as patient and see it as a partnership with a company that's been around since Horse and Buggies, but I don't know if I could. Huge Props to you for sure. I hope Marlin knows what a devoted owner it has.?
 

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I definitely won't have Marlin back (for good) before next week. It looks like I may have to scratch the plan to get PPF and ceramic before heading to Florida. The Florida trip may still be possible. ?

I should get regular, perhaps daily, updates from them next week.
I’m Impressed with the patience your showing over this whole situation as well as the care you appear to be getting from Ford.

Here is hoping you get Marlin back soon enough to take it on the road trip.?
 

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I didnt know this so thanks for sharing again. So, about 1 hr 15 minutes to charge the LVB? That is a long time. I wonder what the charge rate was in that case?
I do know the DCDC converter is variable. Seems to me it would want the shortest elapsed time possible to maintain the LVB that way all the related modules could go back to a low power state again. Thus wasting less energy compared to a longer duration event.

The module determines the LVB charge rate in part by looking at the ambient temperature. I would be very interested to see the map tables for that function. Maybe the PC/ED manuals have some more info.....will try to get access to those and report back......
AGM batteries are not happy if they are charged too quickly - above 13.8V, if I remember correctly. With ICE alternators, charge voltage is typically 14.4, but if you install an AGM, the voltage needs to be turned down to below 13.8V. The company I work for builds a vehicle with AGM battery because it often sits without being used for weeks at a time. However, a special 13.8V alternator is used. Anyone know what the DC-DC LV charging voltage is?
 

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Yea, I gotta say you are really taking one for the team here. At this point I would have wanted them to just escalate me a new one (an entirely unrealistic request I know.)

Glad to hear the "common" issue is resolved with the sw update. Sorry about the new issue.

Go Marlin!

Hey, it’s not like I’ve been able to visit Marlin in the hospital anyway.
 

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Mark, didn't someone here have a symptom of not being able to get the car in gear (out of park)? Seems like I read that recently here. Isn't that the same as what you are describing "went to park"?

here is one from HeySteve: (seems similar issue)

I could get in and "start" it, but it gave me all kinds of alerts and wouldn't let me put it into gear. It was basically running in accessory mode.
 
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ChasingCoral

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Mark, didn't someone here have a symptom of not being able to get the car in gear (out of park)? Seems like I read that recently here. Isn't that the same as what you are describing "went to park"?

here is one from HeySteve: (seems similar issue)

I could get in and "start" it, but it gave me all kinds of alerts and wouldn't let me put it into gear. It was basically running in accessory mode.
Correct. His issue seems similar but until the engineers diagnose it we don't know if this won't engage drive or is stuck in park. Both could show the same screen result.
 

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Maybe your BEV in Florida is 30% coal fired but mine will be 0% coal fired by the end of the year. The following are approximate: 62% solar; 8% wind; 30% gas. For 1 cent per kw hour extra cost, I could opt for 100% sustainable with no price increase for 25 years. 50% of my current electricity comes from a shared community solar array with price locked at 10.9 cents kwh for 25 years.
Would be great if more do their part by purchasing clean transportation as costs come down and the governments does theirs. One problem at a time and I think many understand one problem is fill up clean transportation with clean power. Yours is great info Wisconsin gets it ?

Mark; sure hoping mine goes into drive Monday. It is under observation for the weekend. Possibly we could go and look in the window of the maturity ward ?. Was nothing we could do about it. They grabbed them and now we are now blue.
 

dtbaker61

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Guess that depends where you live here 0% coal fired.
....and if you have Solar on your home, work, or school parking lot where you will be charging...
Sponsored

 
 




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