Edmunds: Mach E vs. Tesla Model Y comparison review

[Yoliber]

I don't think Ford can do this because of the type of motor it's using in the front.

I think benefits still exist when a permanent magnet motor is not being driven. IIRC a Ford engineer was explaining why the AWD still yields a lower range with the assumption that the front wheels aren't always driven.

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[silverelan]

the 3 and Y are 100% RWD unless there's traction loss to the rear tires and/or more aggressive throttle is applied. Generally the front motors aren't generating power until 20-25% throttle and even then, it's minimal.

Below is a graph showing when the front motors are active (pink). Teal is the torque from the rear motor. Blue is the throttle position percentage. This is a 33 minute drive, normal driving. Ambient temp 26F, motors and batteries are pre-conditioned for 18 minutes and were at normal operating temps for winter. Over 33 minutes, the front motors activated 15 times. Of the 15, 12 they barely made more than 5 lb-ft torque. The other 3 times were accelerating from a complete stop from 0 to 55 mph.

One thing going against the Tesla 3 and Y is how aggressive the stability and traction control is when traction is lost. This will be fixed on the MYP once they release track mode, but long range owners won't get that feature.

The MME is RWD biased. We know this because:
A) it's a Mustang
B) the Primary Drive Unit is in the rear.

 

[pt19713]

The MME is RWD biased. We know this because:
A) it's a Mustang
B) the Primary Drive Unit is in the rear.

I know. My response was to sockmeister giving him info on the Model Y setup.

"Mustang" <chuckle>

 

[trutolife27]

I guess the mache is not that bad Ehhhhhh.....?

 

[silverelan]

I know. My response was to sockmeister giving him info on the Model Y setup.

"Mustang" <chuckle>

lol, if Heiser and Palmer got $1 for every #notamustang, they'd retire and live like a king in Patagonia.

The Model Y is terrific and definitely has some advantages in EV specs in terms of range and charging speed. If the Biden Administration and Congress bring back the $7500 tax credit for Tesla, Ford is gonna have to do something aggressive on pricing.

 

[pt19713]

lol, if Heiser and Palmer got $1 for every #notamustang, they'd retire and live like a king in Patagonia.

The Model Y is terrific and definitely has some advantages in EV specs in terms of range and charging speed. If the Biden Administration and Congress bring back the $7500 tax credit for Tesla, Ford is gonna have to do something aggressive on pricing.

Once Tesla releases the 4680 cells, the other crossovers in the same segment will have some catching up to do, too. The current pack has over 4000 cells and the 4680 should drop that down to around 900. Less weight, lower production cost, and increased capacity (estimated to be around 130 kWh). Should be interesting. Any way, I don't want to sway too far off topic.

 

[ClaudeMach-E]

At this point it seems like the main real advantage for Tesla is its supercharge network. Wonder if Ford will continue to invest and partner with network providers to narrow this gap. I'd love for them to come up with their own "free" network down the road when EV's become a bigger part of the lineup, but I don't really see that as a reality. Maybe Biden's EV charging network will come sooner rather than later.

Nothing is free

 

[Maric]

I guess the mache is not that bad Ehhhhhh.....?

Ok now you're just being mean.

 

[silverelan]

You and I both know how accurate the Dragy, Vbox and other GPS acceleration devices. If you want to nitpick, add the +/- 0.1s margin of error. It's been proven multiple times to be equivalent to what you get at a drag strip. In my opinion it's a better indication due to not having a pre-treated surface for better traction.

Ford says they use 1ft rollout to get the 0-60 time of 4.8s but Edmunds tested their MME press car at 5.2s 0-60. It's not huge but the AWD ER will lose the stoplight stomp race to a Model Y.

Tesla Model Y has more powerful motors than the MME. The Mach-E's front motor is only ~50kW vs ~200kW for the Y's. So while Ford may benchmark the MME's performance to the Y, Tesla could turn the screws if they really want to improve their performance specs compared to the Mach-E's.

 

[buzznwood]

Maybe confirmation bias, but I can't remember any reviews that faulted the MME handling. Can you provide some examples?

I class steering as an import part of the overall handling package and having good steering feel is very important to me for others it may be a non issue. The Johnny Smith review commented on good steering , while Rory Reid called the steering vague hence I need to drive one ford can make a chassis with great steering feel, they can also make one with non existent steering feel.

While it doesn't tell the whole picture the model-Y has a faster steering rack ratio with a small 2.0 number of turns lock to lock, I don't know the number of turns lock to lock for the mach-e yet just the steering ratio and the GT unfortunately has the same ratio as every other model, which doesn't strike me as performance orientated, hence why I really want to test drive a premium, the weight means I don't expect to be able to throw it into corners, but as the mach-e is c2 based I want to see if it drives more like a c2 focus or a c2 escape.

Everyone is different but if the GT doesn't come across as a significant upgrade (I have driven cars with faster 0-60 times so this is of little interest to me) and the premium drives more like a c2 focus and less like a c2 escape it will be perfect for my needs and save me some coin , sure it would be nice if they all had the GT grill which looks the best to me but I can't see it when I am inside..

 

[Mirak]

I doubt you'll ever be willing to go back, though a serial hybrid gives you a lot of the same benefits.

I'm usually agnostic when it comes to the buy/lease question, and I dislike closed end leases, but you might want to lease. I know you said delivery was in a week so I'm assuming you still have time to do that.

Two main reasons for this. One is that the competitive landscape will likely force significant price cuts in the MY. (I'd expect the MME to see effective price cuts of at least $10K unless the tax credits are extended). Two is that the cost advantage of buying versus leasing doesn't materialize until years seven through ten, and I'm fairly certain that maintaining a seven or eight or nine year old Tesla will not be cheap.

Curious about the math used to arrive at a 7yr breakeven for lease vs buy. Is that assuming a minimal down payment?

 

[trutolife27]

Ford says they use 1ft rollout to get the 0-60 time of 4.8s but Edmunds tested their MME press car at 5.2s 0-60. It's not huge but the AWD ER will lose the stoplight stomp race to a Model Y.

Tesla Model Y has more powerful motors than the MME. The Mach-E's front motor is only ~50kW vs ~200kW for the Y's. So while Ford may benchmark the MME's performance to the Y, Tesla could turn the screws if they really want to improve their performance specs compared to the Mach-E's.

your saying the model y front motor is 200kw?

 

[silverelan]

your saying the model y front motor is 200kw?

That's what I'm reading, yes.

https://electrek.co/2020/04/01/tesla-model-y-more-power-than-model-3-test-shows/

 

[sockmeister]

I don't think Ford can do this because of the type of motor it's using in the front.

Yeah, it would have to be a hardware change. They would need a clutch to disconnect the motors from the wheels, similar to what the hyundai concept is doing.

 

[trutolife27]

That's what I'm reading, yes.

https://electrek.co/2020/04/01/tesla-model-y-more-power-than-model-3-test-shows/

well, that was for the model y performance. and last years. it all changed so the model y can have more range.

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