First Mustang Mach E Road Trip ?

[dbsb3233]

Chargers need a national standard, ASAP. The free market isn't some divine diety of perfection, it can be a damn mess a lot of the time. This is something that cries out for standardization, especially if the infrastructure bill goes through.

Actually, a standard has already emerged for North America (within the free market). It's CCS. I think Nissan has moved on from CHAdeMO for sales of new cars in NA. It's dead other than old vehicles, and Tesla adapters. Everyone else but Tesla (and their own proprietary network) is using CCS in new vehicles now.

At some point Tesla will likely switch to CCS when the field laps them in volume many times over. But as long as they own their own network, it's irrelevant what they do anyway if they continue to limit it to Tesla customers only.

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[deadduck]

Actually, a standard has already emerged for North America (within the free market). It's CCS. I think Nissan has moved on from CHAdeMO for sales of new cars in NA. It's dead other than old vehicles, and Tesla adapters. Everyone else but Tesla (and their own proprietary network) is using CCS in new vehicles now.

At some point Tesla will likely switch to CCS when the field laps them in volume many times over. But as long as they own their own network, it's irrelevant what they do anyway if they continue to limit it to Tesla customers only.

You can't even reliably pull up to a charger and know if it will work or how much power you'll get. There's a need for a lot more than that.

 

[buzznwood]

Also don’t forget when the EA chargers become more frequented you could end up with long waits. This will probably start happening late next year with the flood of new EVs. EA probably won’t keep expanding the way Tesla has once the $2 billion VW had to put in is used up.

While I can easily see this happening to be blunt I think when then masses all end up in EV's unless things drastically improve in charge times or ranges, a lot of peoples first road trip in the EV is going to end up the same as the OP and its going to be the last one they take

For road trips it really depends on your location and what you class as a road trip as some peoples idea of a long road trip is another persons short drive for a day out. For the mach-e the RT.1 and premium are really the only ones that are possible road trip contenders with the other trims the ranges are just to low sure it is possible with planning and patience but with the woeful charge rate above 80% on the mach-e you are going to be in for a lot of stops.

One rant I defiantly agree with the in straightpipes review is that if charging above 80% is not recommend then the advertised range should be adjusted accordingly, while I would also go one step further and make sure usable battery size should be adjusted accordingly, if manufactures are more concerned with avoiding warranty claims on the battery pack then claims about range need to be reduced as people transitioning from ICE dont care about buffer sizes they just want to fill it up and get the advertised range in a reasonable time.

 

[shadowsjc]

Their conclusions:

• Electric cars are fine for commuting, but the technology isn’t advanced enough to take them on road trips of any length (to quote one friend “Nobody is going to want to stop for an hour or more every 2-2 1/2 hours and wait while their car recharges! That’s stupid.” I tried to point out that you’re probably going maybe 4-4 1/2 hours between charges and he wasn’t having it. His attitude was that people get on the road at 6, drive straight through until noon, except for bathroom breaks, grab lunch and fuel, then continue on until they stop for the evening. He didn’t see how an electric car could do that. Oh well. Not my problem
• Sync navigation sucks - this is a religious battle and you’ll never win it. Yea, sadly, Sync was faced with an edge case it couldn’t cope with. I would have gotten annoyed with Sync’s answer and failed over to Apple Maps.
• 1-Pedal driving is very jerky like a roller coaster. I’m glad I finally have confirmation on that from people who are totally ignorant of electric cars in general and that complaint about the Mustang Mach E in particular. It is an issue. As soon as I switched off one pedal driving and drove the car “normally”, they were happy. So, it wasn’t my driving per se (unless you want to say it’s that I haven’t learned to to do 1-pedal driving

Charging stations; if you plan your trip beforehand around L3 chargers, it will go more smoothly (assuming you live or are driving near an area with abundant L3 chargers). Two days ago I stopped at a Walmart and charged my MME from 24% to 70% in 25 mins. That's more than acceptable for me. You don't need to charge it to 100% (or 90 or 80) at every stop.

Sync navigation: I've never opened it once. Stick to Google maps (via Android auto)

1 pedal: it's jerky at first if you're not used to how it's supposed to work. I have the benefit of having driven my MME for 1000 miles / 1 month and I can now stop fairly smoothly when driving in the city with 1PD.

Sounds like you had a terrible first road trip experience which sucks, but give it another go once you've had more practice with the car and charging network and it'll go much better the next time.

 

[Platitude]

Charging stations; if you plan your trip beforehand around L3 chargers, it will go more smoothly (assuming you live or are driving near an area with abundant L3 chargers). Two days ago I stopped at a Walmart and charged my MME from 24% to 70% in 25 mins. That's more than acceptable for me. You don't need to charge it to 100% (or 90 or 80) at every stop.

The planning's key until L3's get more popular across country. One site I've found useful is https://abetterrouteplanner.com/

 

[BadgerGreg]

If I’ve learned anything so far through 2,000 miles of MME ownership, it’s that road trip charging demands Electricity America; save the slower (50 kW) Level 3 chargers and Level 2 chargers for destination charging only. Follow that plan and you’ll be satisfied.

If your trip takes you beyond the reach of EA, then take an ICE vehicle.

Buy a Tesla adapter and a 50-foot 12 gauge wire extension cord (per EV Dave) and keep them in the car. As long as you have those extra tools, you’ll have more options on charging up at your destination which will make your return trip much easier. The bottom line is to have your car plugged in somewhere (ANYWHERE) for the time it’s sitting idle. Even if you’re plugged into a 120V outlet, you’ll add serious range after 24 hours. I did this on a recent road trip that took me outside the EA realm, and it saved my hide.

 

[BadgerGreg]

The following graph is a good reminder why, even with some additional issues we may deal with while on the road, it is good to not be relying on gas:

 

[cargo]

I was just about to start a thread but I'll respond to this. Right now I'm stuck at a Dunkin donuts waiting for my car to charge at a 50kw EVGO station. How much is it costing me even though it's"in network" ? $18.00 hour

Why am I doing this? Cuz my normal drive from Columbus Ohio to Cleveland which is normally 136 miles and I charged to 100% night before encountered freezing temperatures instead of rain as weather said and depleted battery down to 40 miles. Now my wife and I are limping home at an estimated 5 hours versus 2 if I filed up with gas in our other car. I can't justify taking trips on this car as much as I want to. This sucks and the charging network is pathetic and expensive

I'm trying to understand how you went from a full charge ~270 miles of range to 40

 

[dbsb3233]

You can't even reliably pull up to a charger and know if it will work or how much power you'll get. There's a need for a lot more than that.

Oh sure, there's different power levels offered. Older charger in particular tend to be lower power. That's not necessarily a bad thing though. High power chargers cost a lot more. It's better to have more chargers (even if many are lower power) than to not have those exist at all. Right now, quantity means more than quality.

There is already a standard on connectivity handshake protocol. But the process is a lot more technical and complicated than just pouring liquid fuel into a tank. When new models like the MME come out, it often requires software updates to the older chargers.

I agree it can be frustrating for drivers though. That's what we're getting ourselves into when choosing to buy a BEV.

 

[dbsb3233]

The following graph is a good reminder why, even with some additional issues we may deal with while on the road, it is good to not be relying on gas:

Perhaps, but a look at electricity prices around the country shows even wider variance from one place to another. Same way with retail chargers. Chargers can be priced anywhere from free to over 50 cents/kWh. So I'm not sure that's the best comparison.

 

[dbsb3233]

If I’ve learned anything so far through 2,000 miles of MME ownership, it’s that road trip charging demands Electricity America; save the slower (50 kW) Level 3 chargers and Level 2 chargers for destination charging only. Follow that plan and you’ll be satisfied.

If your trip takes you beyond the reach of EA, then take an ICE vehicle.

Buy a Tesla adapter and a 50-foot 12 gauge wire extension cord (per EV Dave) and keep them in the car. As long as you have those extra tools, you’ll have more options on charging up at your destination which will make your return trip much easier. The bottom line is to have your car plugged in somewhere (ANYWHERE) for the time it’s sitting idle. Even if you’re plugged into a 120V outlet, you’ll add serious range after 24 hours. I did this on a recent road trip that took me outside the EA realm, and it saved my hide.

Agree that EA is the gold standard. If the route if covered by that, it's a go. If not, then it takes a lot more research to see if other chargers look good enough to rely on.

Plugging in with my own charger out on the road is not something I really plan for anything other that emergency purposes though. In part because I don't trust leaving an EVSE worth hundreds of dollars (and a pricey heavy-duty extension cord) left unattended overnight in a parking lot. Usually we're talking 120V in such a case, and that just doesn't add enough juice to make it worthwhile IMO. Plus it's easy to pop a breaker pulling that much power on a 120V circuit that's not intended for that.

Plus I'm not totally comfortable with the ethical aspect of just stealing business' electricity. I know some people ask for permission first, but some don't. And even those that do are probably just getting the OK from some employee at the front desk that doesn't really care. Plugging in a phone charger that draws a penny of electricity is one thing, but an EV charging for 10 hours is quite another.

 

[buffasnow]

One rant I defiantly agree with the in straightpipes review is that if charging above 80% is not recommend then the advertised range should be adjusted accordingly, while I would also go one step further and make sure usable battery size should be adjusted accordingly, if manufactures are more concerned with avoiding warranty claims on the battery pack then claims about range need to be reduced as people transitioning from ICE dont care about buffer sizes they just want to fill it up and get the advertised range in a reasonable time.

I kind of philisophically agree with this idea as well. I know nothing about Straightpipes, but if you do, I wonder if they advocate for this across all EVs or just the MME?

This sort of issue begs for a few (independent) standardized tests that every new EV could take - around town stop & go at one warm and one cold outside temp, then two 70-75 MPH highway tests, one warm and one cold. There could be a set cabin temp for each test. People could easily extrapolate for battery size and SOC based on the reported miles/KWh from each test.

This list is meant to be more illustrative than comprehensive.....just one way to get some decent real life comparison data. This topic has been discussed in a couple of threads here already regarding EPA testing.

 

[dbsb3233]

One rant I defiantly agree with the in straightpipes review is that if charging above 80% is not recommend then the advertised range should be adjusted accordingly, while I would also go one step further and make sure usable battery size should be adjusted accordingly, if manufactures are more concerned with avoiding warranty claims on the battery pack then claims about range need to be reduced as people transitioning from ICE dont care about buffer sizes they just want to fill it up and get the advertised range in a reasonable time.

If advertising a practical "road trip range" like that, the 10% safety buffer at the bottom should be subtracted out too. It basically becomes the 10-80% baseline they advertise for charging speed.

Also, it needs to be adjusted for interstate speeds, since most road trips of much distance use highways.

But some people can start a leg from 100%. Or use slower roads. So it's hard to pick a single criteria. There just needs to be more education about all the degradation factors, since they make such an outsized difference vs ICE.

 

[Jimrpa]

Couple of quick notes:

• For those who keep saying “you just aren’t very good at doing road trips - you should have been using DCFCs the entire trip.” Hop into ABRP and take a look at the number of DCFCs between West Chester, PA and St. Michaels, MD ? For extra credit, check out the number of L2 chargers in St. Michaels! A 3/4 mile walk along a road with no sidewalks in the rain back from the “free” charger (where my car had to spend the night) really convinced my friends that electric cars were the future!
• For those who say “Ford’s Navigation is awful, Google products are the only products people should EVER use.!”, I never use Google products when I have a choice not to, and disable them whenever I can, when they’re built into products I buy. I don’t like Google or their business model. I am not their commodity to sell as they see fit. You may see this differently.

 

[agoldman]

There are two types of people. One's that like OPD, and those like me that hate it. Otherwise known as "Coasters".

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