FordPass & PAAK use cancelled unless you give away ALL personal and real-time driving data ?!

[dtbaker61]

- editted a little 1/28 after cooling down a little to clarify my concerns and reason for starting this thread.
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I got a message today (1/27/23) on my phone when I fired up FordPass prior to heading out the door to drive to a job site, that I HAD to 'accept' revised terms for continued use of FordPass, or discontinue use of Fordpass and delete the phone App, and FP account online immediately...

A quick scan down the LONG LONG LONG message on the FP screen revealed some 'red flag' language that gave me pause. I do not plan to 'Accept' the new terms, or decline and delete FordPass until I have more time to review in detail....

In the meantime, I thought I'd start a thread to see what other members think about this message and the specific changes that caught my eye as possible infringement on Privacy, and in the case of unsolicited 'auto-updates' delivered via OTA; possible side-effects from intended additional remote control or unintended software errors affecting operation of my vehicle.

I bought the vehicle with certain expectations of functionality, optional updates, and some degree of privacy as to my specific location, speed, and driving habits. The on-screen Settings enabling toggling on/off auto-updates and on/off of export of my data with the 'Privacy Settings' were acceptable to me when I bought the MME.

The new terms, at first read, over-ride my ability to turn OFF auto-updates and over-ride my desire to NOT export location, speed, or other data from car sensors real-time. More concerning, it looks to me like there is no way to opt-out of the use (sale) of my vehicle data tied to my personal data including name, address, email, and other information.

I can understand gathering aggregate car sensor data for Engineering, remote diagnostics, and 'rescue' control of door locks and such... but only with my permission or request.

The ONLY function of FordPass that I use is PAAK. If my phone will not work as Key without FordPass, then Ford is removing functionality that was present when I bought the vehicle. I don't want any updates to FordPass or Sync, so I feel that I *should* be able to continue using my current functionality 'in perpetuity' without updates if I want to under current terms and functionality.

Is anybody else concerned with the revised TOS we are being forced to accept?

Anyone else upset that our only option to blanket acceptance is to delete FordPass and discontinue use of current functionality available with PAAK?

What would be the appropriate Entity to complain to about invasion of Privacy? I don't want Ford to use MY location and real-time driving data combined with personal information for their profit without my permission.... But I also don't want to give up existing functionality of PAAK. But I will if there is no alternative to protect my data from resale and my car from remote control. The worst part about this new Agreement is that if I want to continue to use ANY connectivity (for PAAK or Navigation), then this new 1.7 TOS overides any and all on-board 'Privacy Settings' regarding data I would rather not export.

As far as I can tell, this version 1.7 of the TOS for FordPass over-rides ALL our choices on Privacy Settings screen in the vehicle, making the entire screen misleading and meaningless as well as obviating our choice in whether we want to accept auto-updates, or not.

I hope @Ford Motor Company will watch this thread and reverse their Policy on this.... before there is a class action lawsuit, or complaints to the FTC, or whoever is supposed to protect our rights to reasonable privacy and re-sale of personal information.

I want to hear from @Ford Motor Company that Privacy Settings I toggle off on screen actually disallow data export, and auto-update toggled off actually prevents OTA without my knowledge and consent.

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The full TOS is viewable as .html at
https://www.fordpass.com/content/ford_com/fp_app/en_us/termsprivacy.html#two

I printed to Word, reviewed, trimmed and annotated copy of TOS version 1.7 to note my specific areas of concern. You may or may not agree, but I think it's important to voice concern... maybe somebody can explain this language and make it easier to swallow, but I have reservations about clicking the 'Accept' button on this one...

In the meantime, I will probably start using a Fob instead of PAAK I guess since that is the ONLY feature of FordPass I find useful.

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[generaltso]

you MUST accept or discontinue use of FordPass.

Sounds like you do have a choice.

 

[hybrid2bev]

https://www.fordpass.com/content/ford_com/fp_app/en_us/termsprivacy.html#two

"We do not provide personal information we collect through FordPass to anyone for independent use without providing you a choice"

 

[dtbaker61]

Sounds like you do have a choice.

not if you want to use PAAK, which depends on FordPass

 

[dtbaker61]

https://www.fordpass.com/content/ford_com/fp_app/en_us/termsprivacy.html#two

"We do not provide personal information we collect through FordPass to anyone for independent use without providing you a choice"

the choice with the new TOS I read on my phone via the FordPass message is give them all the data by accepting new terms, or discontinue use of Functionality (PAAK) that existed when you bought the car and installed FordPass App on your phone.

I don't think that is a fair choice.... and maybe isn't even legal, but I'm not a Lawyer.

 

[generaltso]

not if you want to use PAAK, which depends on FordPass

Then it sounds like a fob will be your choice.

 

[dtbaker61]

Then it sounds like a fob will be your choice.

It certainly does. But I am pissed off about it because it is requiring me to give up functionality that was present when I bought the car

It seems like Ford is changing the terms of ownership after the fact to say that you must pay to play, and you must allow them to capture and sell personal data as they see fit and you must update hardware and software to match their software? Seems ridiculous

I don't care if I get a single additional software update. But I do not want to sign away my rights to my data to continue driving my car with all the functionality it came with when I bought it

 

[hybrid2bev]

the choice is give them all the data, or discontinue use of Functionality that existed when you bought the car.

My point is that Ford is the steward of your data and does not share it with 3rd parties without your consent. If they do share your data it's only with external companies under contract with Ford to enable delivery of the services and where they are subject to confidentiality and security obligations.

Ford takes customer data privacy very seriously as you can tell by reading the Privacy Policy.

 

[Gullwingdmc]

Kudos for reading the TOS, I’m guessing most people don’t even try.

 

[dtbaker61]

My point is that Ford is the steward of your data and does not share it with 3rd parties without your consent. If they do share your data it's only with external companies under contract with Ford to enable delivery of the services and where they are subject to confidentiality and security obligations.

Ford takes customer data privacy very seriously as you can tell by reading the Privacy Policy.

that is NOT the way it reads on the phone screen.... did you scroll thru it, or just 'Accept'?

...and is only part of my concern. I don't WANT Ford corporate to lock/unlock or start and stop my car remotely anytime they want. I do not want my location, speed, and other sensor data sold to 'authorized partners'... Thats why I turned off sharing in Settings which this Acceptance says they can overide.

...I also do not want forced updates OTA on modules, or Sync without my knowledge, which this new agreement also overrides if you read thru the VERY long screens of info on the phone.

It is presented in a 'no choice' way that says to me 'give us all you data all the time, and let us mess with your car anytime we want, or forget PAAK and other functionality that you bought the car with.'

 

[dtbaker61]

Kudos for reading the TOS, I’m guessing most people don’t even try.

did you get it on your version of FordPass?
Did YOU read it?
What's your opinion?

 

[theriddler]

I got a message today when I fired up FordPass, that I HAD to 'accept' and waive ALL privacy to my location, speed, sensor data, Wallet... even voice recordings! ....and Ford could sell any of it to anybody they want. AND they could update software without my knowledge or consent, lock/un-lock my car remotely and presumable change any settings they want whenever they want. There is NO recourse, you MUST accept or discontinue use of FordPass. By the way, you also re obligated to update phone and computer to be compatible with 'current version' of FordPass, and they get to force updates of FordPass that would basically require me to buy a new phone? There is SO much wrong with this.

There is an interesting exception in the fine print.... all this applies to individuals only; company vehicles are exempt. Gee.... wonder why?

How can this be legal?

I bought the vehicle with certain expectations of functionality, optional updates, and some degree of privacy as to my specific location, speed, and driving habits.

The ONLY function of FordPass that I use is PAAK. If my phone will not work as Key without FordPass, then Ford is removing functionality that was present when I bought the vehicle. I don't want any updates to FordPass or Sync, I *should* be able to continue using my current functionality 'in perpetuity' shouldn't I ?

Is anybody else pissed off about this?

What would be the appropriate Entity to complain to about invasion of Privacy? I don't want Ford to use MY location or other personal information for their profit without my permission.... But I also don't want to give up existing functionality of PAAK. But I will if there is no alternative to protect my data from resale and my car from remote control.

I hope @Ford Motor Company will watch this thread and reverse their Policy on this.... before there is a class action lawsuit, or complaints to the US General Attourney, or whoever is supposed to protect our rights to reasonable privacy and re-sale of personal information.

In the meantime, I am removing the wi-fi connection from my vehicle, and going back to using a Fob I guess. Which I just checked, and it has a dead battery (within 2 years of ownership), and it hasn't even been used! But now I'll have to ask my Dealership for the 2nd Fob that was authorized for those of us that were delivered only one.

"Audio/Visual (may also be referred to as Connected Voice Data, Digital Assistant, or Ford Assistant): Voice commands and other utterances captured when the vehicle's voice recognition system is in "active listen" state." - sounds like they only care about how you use voice commands to the vehicle itself. I do not see where they state they will require access to your voice recordings.

i also do not believe they are referring to the 'wallet' on your iphone (do not know how it is called on android devices). They specifically call it My Wallet which I believe refers to how you set up payment systems for connected services. Sounds like you can always not enter this information and thus not have the payment process for those services streamlined.

You probably have signed off on a lot of similar verbiage throughout your life and never realized it but as has been stated, you have the option to not agree and simply not use the app. No one is forcing anyone to do so. Good luck whichever way you go.

 

[hybrid2bev]

that is NOT the way it reads on the phone screen.... did you scroll thru it, or just 'Accept'?

...and is only part of my concern. I don't WANT Ford corporate to lock/unlock or start and stop my car remotely anytime they want. I do not want my location, speed, and other sensor data sold to 'authorized partners'... Thats why I turned off sharing in Settings which this Acceptance says they can overide.

...I also do not want forced updates OTA on modules, or Sync without my knowledge, which this new agreement also overrides if you read thru the VERY long screens of info on the phone.

It is presented in a 'no choice' way that says to me 'give us all you data all the time, and let us mess with your car anytime we want, or forget PAAK and other functionality that you bought the car with.'

I just click Accept. I know that Ford is protecting MY data.

Maybe wrap your car in tin foil? JK, you do you!

I'm not a spy or doing secret missions so I don't care about data sharing if it helps Ford provide me with services.

Besides, your smartphone is probably a conduit of more data collection than the FordPass app alone is.

 

[macchiaz-o]

What changed in this agreement since you agreed to the same in 2019 or whenever?

I haven't had a moment to diff the versions yet.

 

[Logal727]

App needs data from other data sources to work, either accept it or don't. There's so much more we give just by having a phone in general, not seeing the big deal here. Just the nature of things now.

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