FordPass & PAAK use cancelled unless you give away ALL personal and real-time driving data ?!

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dtbaker61

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You start a whole post, SOLELY to complain about the new TOS, citing things that make you not want to accept it.
I started this post because a notice popped up on my screen saying 'accept these terms, or delete FordPass'... and a quick read of the terms brought up a few red flags for me. I won't click the accept button until I have time to actually read thru in detail and try to understand the ramifications of the terms I'm being asked to accept.

I posted the thread to see if anyone else had taken the time to read, and had any similar concerns.

I do NOT have time this week or next to re-read in detail or redline specific concerns for a deep dive an debate. So, for now, I am choosing to neither accept new terms or delete FordPass because I'd like to continue to use PAAK under current terms, and hope that the Settings in sync where I can choose what data I want to share are respected by Ford.
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If you choose to not use the app, you're not missing out on much. Most things there seem to fail half the time anyways
🤷‍♂️
The ONLY functionality I use in FordPass is PAAK; because it *does work* 99% for me, and daily use reduces the risk of me being stranded with no recourse if I lose or damage the one Fob I was given upon delivery.

I plan to ask Dealer to get me a second Fob, and program for free since it looks like PAAK will not be available to me in the future if I choose not to accept the new TOS.
 

callmeac

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I may have clicked thru the first version when I bought my car and installed FordPass.... but I'm not planning on accepting the revised terms. I'd like to just stick with versions I have right now, and NOT allow OTAs without my knowledge or consent, and NOT allow any of my realtime data to be exported for any reason.

I would like to continue to use my PAAK, but I'll give that up if that's the only way to prevent unauthorized use of personal information.

I was willing to send aggregated sensor data for Engineering, I am not willing to send data tied to me specifically.

Trust me --- YOU are not that important that FORD wants your individual data.

If you don't want to accept it, don't but I will continue to use my PAAK feature.

Your loss!
 

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The ONLY functionality I use in FordPass is PAAK; because it *does work* 99% for me, and daily use reduces the risk of me being stranded with no recourse if I lose or damage the one Fob I was given upon delivery.

I plan to ask Dealer to get me a second Fob, and program for free since it looks like PAAK will not be available to me in the future if I choose not to accept the new TOS.
You should've gotten two unless that's changed. Seems odd dealer only gave you one. I know someone of the forums complained his/her charger didn't come with one of the adapters for the outlet so the dealer screwing up isn't new to me.
 


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dtbaker61

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You should've gotten two unless that's changed. Seems odd dealer only gave you one. I know someone of the forums complained his/her charger didn't come with one of the adapters for the outlet so the dealer screwing up isn't new to me.

early Owners only got one Fob
 

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You should've gotten two unless that's changed. Seems odd dealer only gave you one. I know someone of the forums complained his/her charger didn't come with one of the adapters for the outlet so the dealer screwing up isn't new to me.
The MME only came with 1 keyfob on 02/26/21. Ford authorized a 2nd keyfob under CSP 22B10.

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- editted a little 1/28 after cooling down a little to clarify my concerns and reason for starting this thread.
===================

I got a message today (1/27/23) on my phone when I fired up FordPass prior to heading out the door to drive to a job site, that I HAD to 'accept' revised terms for continued use of FordPass, or discontinue use of Fordpass and delete the phone App, and FP account online immediately...

A quick scan down the LONG LONG LONG message on the FP screen revealed some 'red flag' language that gave me pause. I do not plan to 'Accept' the new terms, or decline and delete FordPass until I have a couple hours to review in detail.... which I won't have for at least the next two weeks.

In the meantime, I thought I'd start a thread to see what other members think about this message and the specific changes that caught my eye as possible infringement on Privacy, and in the case of unsolicited 'auto-updates' delivered via OTA; possible side-effects from intended additional remote control or unintended software errors affecting operation of my vehicle.

I bought the vehicle with certain expectations of functionality, optional updates, and some degree of privacy as to my specific location, speed, and driving habits. The on-screen Settings enabling toggling on/off auto-updates and on/off of exposrt of my data with the 'Privacy Settings' were acceptable to me when I bought the MME.

The new terms, at first read, over-ride my ability to turn OFF auto-updates and over-ride my desire to NOT export location, speed, or other data from car sensors real-time. More concerning, it looks to me like there is no way to opt-out of the use of my vehicle data tied to my personal data including name, address, email, and other information.

I can understand gathering aggregate car sensor data for Engineering, remote diagnostics, and 'rescue' control of door locks and such... but only with my permission or request.

The ONLY function of FordPass that I use is PAAK. If my phone will not work as Key without FordPass, then Ford is removing functionality that was present when I bought the vehicle. I don't want any updates to FordPass or Sync, so I feel that I *should* be able to continue using my current functionality 'in perpetuity' without updates if I want to under current terms and functinality.

Is anybody else concerned with the revised TOS we are asked to accept?

Anyone else upset that our only option to blanket acceptance is to delete FordPass and discontinue use of current functionality we choose to use?

What would be the appropriate Entity to complain to about invasion of Privacy? I don't want Ford to use MY location or other personal information for their profit without my permission.... But I also don't want to give up existing functionality of PAAK. But I will if there is no alternative to protect my data from resale and my car from remote control.

I hope @Ford Motor Company will watch this thread and reverse their Policy on this.... before there is a class action lawsuit, or complaints to the US General Attorney, or whoever is supposed to protect our rights to reasonable privacy and re-sale of personal information.

In the meantime, I will probably start using a Fob instead of PAAK I guess since that is the ONLY feature of FordPass I find useful.
This is hilarious what else do you think that phone in your pocket is doing. You have no privacy already. All your personal information is already bought and sold many times over.
 
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This is hilarious what else do you think that phone in your pocket is doing. You have no privacy already. All your personal information is already bought and sold many times over.
my phone provider is not threatening me with denial of service if I opt-out, and it is possible to opt out...

This new TOS looks like Ford is not honoring Settings allowing opt-out of transmission of personal data while retaining existing functionality. That's not hilarious to me.
 

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my phone provider is not threatening me with denial of service if I opt-out, and it is possible to opt out...

This new TOS looks like Ford is not honoring Settings allowing opt-out of transmission of personal data while retaining existing functionality. That's not hilarious to me.
Maybe wait until you finish reading it in detail before jumping to these conclusions.
 
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Maybe wait until you finish reading it in detail before jumping to these conclusions.

...sigh...

ok, I read thru the whole damn thing. I still have concerns:
- I am uncomfortable that the Privacy Toggle Settings I turn off are being disregarded
- I really don't like that it looks like software update to Sync *may* get pushed to my car even if I toggle auto-update via OTA 'off'
- and I am a little uncomfortable knowing that Ford can basically do what they want to with my data and driving habits by aggregating (not bad) or combining (bad) to tie my personal location and real-time data and give the data to whomever they deem appropriate.

sure, chances of mis-use are slim, but I don't like the whole approach of 'sign, or we'll yank functionality you've gotten used to.'
 

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...sigh...

ok, I read thru the whole damn thing. I still have concerns:
- I am uncomfortable that the Privacy Toggle Settings I turn off are being disregarded
- I really don't like that it looks like software update to Sync *may* get pushed to my car even if I toggle auto-update via OTA 'off'
- and I am a little uncomfortable knowing that Ford can basically do what they want to with my data and driving habits by aggregating (not bad) or combining (bad) to tie my personal location and real-time data and give the data to whomever they deem appropriate.

sure, chances of mis-use are slim, but I don't like the whole approach of 'sign, or we'll yank functionality you've gotten used to.'
At least you now know WHAT you already agreed to though, so that's good.
 

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I believe the whole thing about gathering data regardless of your privacy settings refers to things like Usage Based Insurance via Ford Insure. If you sign up for that feature, your insurance company will still collect data according to the terms of the agreement even if you turn off share vehicle data in your connectivity settings.

It may also refer to tracking your vehicle if it has been stolen. Otherwise, there would be no recourse if you turned off vehicle location in the vehicle.

As for 3rd parties getting data. That pretty much parties contracted be Ford to deliver various services. Sirius/ State Farm / Amazon would be examples of that.
 

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I believe the whole thing about gathering data regardless of your privacy settings refers to things like Usage Based Insurance via Ford Insure. If you sign up for that feature, your insurance company will still collect data according to the terms of the agreement even if you turn off share vehicle data in your connectivity settings.

It may also refer to tracking your vehicle if it has been stolen. Otherwise, there would be no recourse if you turned off vehicle location in the vehicle.

As for 3rd parties getting data. That pretty much parties contracted be Ford to deliver various services. Sirius/ State Farm / Amazon would be examples of that.
The insure option is a wholly separate option / function. It's got its own slider. Ford does jack shit if your vehicle is stolen as others here have posted in regarding to a theft of their MME.
 

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- editted a little 1/28 after cooling down a little to clarify my concerns and reason for starting this thread.
===================

I got a message today (1/27/23) on my phone when I fired up FordPass prior to heading out the door to drive to a job site, that I HAD to 'accept' revised terms for continued use of FordPass, or discontinue use of Fordpass and delete the phone App, and FP account online immediately...

A quick scan down the LONG LONG LONG message on the FP screen revealed some 'red flag' language that gave me pause. I do not plan to 'Accept' the new terms, or decline and delete FordPass until I have a couple hours to review in detail.... which I won't have for at least the next two weeks.

In the meantime, I thought I'd start a thread to see what other members think about this message and the specific changes that caught my eye as possible infringement on Privacy, and in the case of unsolicited 'auto-updates' delivered via OTA; possible side-effects from intended additional remote control or unintended software errors affecting operation of my vehicle.

I bought the vehicle with certain expectations of functionality, optional updates, and some degree of privacy as to my specific location, speed, and driving habits. The on-screen Settings enabling toggling on/off auto-updates and on/off of exposrt of my data with the 'Privacy Settings' were acceptable to me when I bought the MME.

The new terms, at first read, over-ride my ability to turn OFF auto-updates and over-ride my desire to NOT export location, speed, or other data from car sensors real-time. More concerning, it looks to me like there is no way to opt-out of the use of my vehicle data tied to my personal data including name, address, email, and other information.

I can understand gathering aggregate car sensor data for Engineering, remote diagnostics, and 'rescue' control of door locks and such... but only with my permission or request.

The ONLY function of FordPass that I use is PAAK. If my phone will not work as Key without FordPass, then Ford is removing functionality that was present when I bought the vehicle. I don't want any updates to FordPass or Sync, so I feel that I *should* be able to continue using my current functionality 'in perpetuity' without updates if I want to under current terms and functinality.

Is anybody else concerned with the revised TOS we are asked to accept?

Anyone else upset that our only option to blanket acceptance is to delete FordPass and discontinue use of current functionality we choose to use?

What would be the appropriate Entity to complain to about invasion of Privacy? I don't want Ford to use MY location or other personal information for their profit without my permission.... But I also don't want to give up existing functionality of PAAK. But I will if there is no alternative to protect my data from resale and my car from remote control.

I hope @Ford Motor Company will watch this thread and reverse their Policy on this.... before there is a class action lawsuit, or complaints to the US General Attorney, or whoever is supposed to protect our rights to reasonable privacy and re-sale of personal information.

============
added trimmed and annotated copy of TOS version 1.7 to note my areas of concern. you may or may not agree, but I think it's important to voice concern... maybe somebody can explain this language and make it easier to swallow, but I have reservations about clicking the 'Accept' button on this one...

In the meantime, I will probably start using a Fob instead of PAAK I guess since that is the ONLY feature of FordPass I find useful.
But basically you are using a Android or Apple device for PAAK right ?

So this means that all data of you is already in the cloud. God knows what they do with it.
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