Hey, Ford. What’s the method to the madness?

[AKgrampy]

Somewhat.
I think through my writing. For example, the realization that the rails had enough rail cars to move vehicles at pre-COVID and pre-Chip shortage levels so there should be more than enough now…. That came to me while writing.

That said, I duly admit that I might be missing something. There may be a legitimate reason to give Ford a pass on not getting the job done, and maybe someone can explain that to me.

So, it’s thinking out loud, reasoning through it out loud, opening the idea for discussion, the possibility of learning from responses, the unlikely (but minutely possible) possibility that someone In power hears something said, etc.

Cathartic. Sure. I’ll take some of that too.

How do you know there were enough railcars? Customer orders and tracking basically started around the time of Covid so I am not sure the shipping process is better or worse. If you think about it 100 Mach e’s is worth about $6 million to Ford. I am sure there are quite a few more than that plus all the other vehicles being shipped. I am quite sure Ford, or any other company, does all it can to reduce the time between manufacture and sale.

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[Mach1E]

Mexico to KC is fine. Cars are stuck in KC waiting on rail cars. Here’s how I know.

1. My car was put on a Jack Cooper truck to take it from Richards-Gebaur rail yard to the Argentine rail yard in Kansas City, MO. It was released to Jack Cooper 11/10 and has yet to be checked in at Argentine. So it made it on a truck.
2. Many, many, many cars made after mine (on this site) have been delivered and owners have taken possession from Washington state, to Arizona, to Miami, to New York/New Jersey, to Illinois. Tricks were not an issue.
3. In conversation with my dealer and their Ford rep I asked about possible reasons for delay. Their response was:
“It’s not that. It’s waiting on a rail car to come available. What has most likely happened as that company has shipped cars all over the US and some cities are so far behind and backed up that they are slow to off load so now it’s waiting for cars to get offloaded and brought back to the yard for the next load. When Covid hit we had cars that the Kentucky plant used and trains stuck in Miami waiting to be offloaded because of labor shortage. While this is not to that extreme it is still a real problem and a huge issue for the transportation companies and the system in this economy.”
4. A member of this forum is a pilot and flew over the KC yards taking pictures of what appeared to be 100’s to 1,000 plus Mach-E’s sitting at the yards waiting for rail cars.
5. There was no rail strike, so you can’t tell me that’s the problem.

This whole thing that people are saying around,
“It’s out of their control.”
“There’s nothing they can do about it.”
“It’s xyz, which is out of their hands….”

Excuses.

The difference between a bad company and a good company and a great company is what they’re willing to accept…. What problems they say are or are not worth fixing…. Are they willing to accept a poor customer experience because it may cost them to create a positive customer experience…. Are they so complacent as to say “There’s nothing we can do about that.

Fix the problem.

I’ve written long somewhat detailed and reasoned diatribes above on this. Sorry. I’m a writer at heart.

Now you’re starting to sound like a broken record.

So you know what the problem is, there is no immediate fix, but you keep saying “fix it.”

This is a temporary shortage. Whose money are they going to spend to get more rail cars for a temporary shortage?

You did kinda answer your own question though. This isn’t their problem to fix. And they decided it’s not worth fixing or they can’t.

Ford not only wants a good customer experience, they want to ship and deliver cars as fast as possible. It is literally how they make money.

 

[mjs020294]

Cars have always spent weeks in holding yards, on railroad cars and trucks. Most of us have always bought a car off the lot so the transportation process was moot.

 

[DadzBoyz]

Now you’re starting to sound like a broken record.

So you know what the problem is, there is no immediate fix, but you keep saying “fix it.”

This is a temporary shortage. Whose money are they going to spend to get more rail cars for a temporary shortage?

You did kinda answer your own question though. This isn’t their problem to fix. And they decided it’s not worth fixing or they can’t.

Ford not only wants a good customer experience, they want to ship and deliver cars as fast as possible. It is literally how they make money.

I am a broken record. I know.
It’s the obvious nature of the problem that is mind boggling.

Now, to say that this is a temporary problem….. I disagree.

How long is temporary?
1 year?
2 years?
3 years?

The problem seems to be pretty clear. And if they have this problem now, at a time of reduced production, then it was also a problem at a time of higher production, and it will continue to be a problem as shortages and supply chain issues subside and production increases again.

That doesn’t sound temporary to me. That sounds like accepting a poor customer experience.

You also said:
“Whose money are they going to spend to get more rail cars for a temporary shortage?”

Whose money do they use for every other phase of the process?
Design, Engineering, Manufacturing, etc. Transport is part of the overall process of selling cars. So, I’d say that the same company that pays for Design, Engineering, Marketing, etc. also pay for to create a positive customer experience in the transport piece of the puzzle.

BTW, in Q3 they reported $32 billion, cash on hand. I think they can afford some problem sol

It amazes me how much people are willing to say “it’s too hard” or “it’s too much” or “they want to but they can’t”.
It’s a very defeatist, victimhood approach to things.

There are things they could do.
When Ford complains or comments about the customer experience, etc. this is one more pierce of that puzzle that they could actually handle.

Do I want the car? Y E S
Am I frustrated? Ummm. Yeah.
Am I alone???
I may be wrong, but I don’t think so.

 

[HGxxx]

Cars have always spent weeks in holding yards, on railroad cars and trucks. Most of us have always bought a car off the lot so the transportation process was moot.

I agree here, Ford is not used to people ordering and waiting for the car for months/year. So the customer expectation goal post has changed for them.

 

[Mach1E]

I am a broken record. I know.
It’s the obvious nature of the problem that is mind boggling.

Now, to say that this is a temporary problem….. I disagree.

How long is temporary?
1 year?
2 years?
3 years?

The problem seems to be pretty clear. And if they have this problem now, at a time of reduced production, then it was also a problem at a time of higher production, and it will continue to be a problem as shortages and supply chain issues subside and production increases again.

That doesn’t sound temporary to me. That sounds like accepting a poor customer experience.

You also said:
“Whose money are they going to spend to get more rail cars for a temporary shortage?”

Whose money do they use for every other phase of the process?
Design, Engineering, Manufacturing, etc. Transport is part of the overall process of selling cars. So, I’d say that the same company that pays for Design, Engineering, Marketing, etc. also pay for to create a positive customer experience in the transport piece of the puzzle.

BTW, in Q3 they reported $32 billion, cash on hand. I think they can afford some problem sol

It amazes me how much people are willing to say “it’s too hard” or “it’s too much” or “they want to but they can’t”.
It’s a very defeatist, victimhood approach to things.

There are things they could do.
When Ford complains or comments about the customer experience, etc. this is one more pierce of that puzzle that they could actually handle.

Do I want the car? Y E S
Am I frustrated? Ummm. Yeah.
Am I alone???
I may be wrong, but I don’t think so.

Temporary means not permanent.

They’re not going to invest in permanent infrastructure to fix a temporary problem. Even if that temporary problem does last a couple years.

It’s clear that you don’t think you’re wrong.

I just think that there’s information that neither of us have that explain WHY Ford isn’t just “fixing the problem.”

Why do I think that? Because Ford has the IDENTICAL goal that you do! They’re on your side! They want to deliver cars faster and there is a huge financial incentive to do so.

So why aren’t they “fixing it?”

I have Two theories:

1. it’s too expensive. The fix would raise the cost (and thus the price of the cars) so it’s not worth it.

2. it’s not possible. A shortage is a shortage. Just like they couldn’t make more computer chips “appear” they can’t make more workers and trains appear either.

3. No clue. Not sure what your theory is.

 

[4sallypat]

Now you’re starting to sound like a broken record.

So you know what the problem is, there is no immediate fix, but you keep saying “fix it.”

This is a temporary shortage. Whose money are they going to spend to get more rail cars for a temporary shortage?

You did kinda answer your own question though. This isn’t their problem to fix. And they decided it’s not worth fixing or they can’t.

Ford not only wants a good customer experience, they want to ship and deliver cars as fast as possible. It is literally how they make money.

Agree - the OP is complaining - yes we all hear that.

Has the OP checked to see if the delay is due to parts being needed for release ?

There was large batch of August / Sept Lightning builds that were delayed at the rail depots waiting for half drive splines for the motors that were discovered as faulty. The Ford tech had to wait for the parts, drive to various rail depots and install them. Those Lightning owners have started to receive their this month.

 

[DadzBoyz]

Agree - the OP is complaining - yes we all hear that.

Has the OP checked to see if the delay is due to parts being needed for release ?

There was large batch of August / Sept Lightning builds that were delayed at the rail depots waiting for half drive splines for the motors that were discovered as faulty. The Ford tech had to wait for the parts, drive to various rail depots and install them. Those Lightning owners have started to receive their this month.

Good question.
No parts or build delay. 100% complete cars waiting on rail cars.

@Mach1E , you and I have a very different definition of “temporary”. I’d say weeks to a few months is temporary. Years is a way of doing business that accepts a problem and refuses to fix it. And that’s a way that is inconsistent with a good customer experience.

 

[Mach1E]

Good question.
No parts or build delay. 100% complete cars waiting on rail cars.

@Mach1E , you and I have a very different definition of “temporary”. I’d say weeks to a few months is temporary. Years is a way of doing business that accepts a problem and refuses to fix it. And that’s a way that is inconsistent with a good customer experience.

Again, you’re assuming they’re “refusing” to fix it.

Based on what?

What makes you think it’s both fixable and not cost prohibitive to be fixed?

There is significant financial incentive for Ford to ship cars faster.

My point about “temporary” is that my definition would determine whether or not Ford would invest in additional infrastructure.

 

[Mike G]

Actually a permanent fix to ridiculously long wait times from order to delivery might be...oh...I don't know..building another frikkin plant in the US maybe?

 

[Mach1E]

Actually a permanent fix to ridiculously long wait times from order to delivery might be...oh...I don't know..building another frikkin plant in the US maybe?

We have a winner.

Doesn’t help the OP though.

Actually about the only thing that helps the OP (and what I would do in this situation) is look for another car that can be delivered in December. It’s not easy, but others have found them recently at MSRP.

 

[Bigfeets]

My MME story, so far, is just 1/63,345th (one out of total 2022MY production). Throughout the year-long wait for my 2022MY MME order to be delivered (9 months wait to be built, 3 months wait to be delivered), I've tried to figure out what was really happening by reading lots of macheforum.com threads and following Ford's occasional pronouncements. My conclusion: my MME order had to wait an additional 3 months just to be built, and 2 additional months to be delivered, e.g. 5 months of additional wait time, beyond the 7 months expected at time of ordering. (The latter is still an approximation because the MME I ordered in Dec 2021 has not yet been delivered to the dealer (as of 12/5/22).

 

[machefan2022]

It's definitely a complex problem. Even if you get more rail cars, how often do you cross a railroad track and there is more than 1 track? When was the last time new or additional railroad was laid in the US? What is the capacity of the rail system when so many tracks are only 1 way at a time and then also run passenger rail along them?

I wonder what the rhyme or reason is to when things are trucked vs rail? My MME was railed to KC then put on a jack cooper truck and driven to Michigan. Total travel time from plant to dealer took less than 3 weeks.

 

[steve.panse]

This is obviously a complex discussion, but I’ll chime in with a simple data point:
My car was built 10/11 and just made it to final rail destination (Miami) yesterday after sitting in KC for over a month. Another forum member less than 50 miles away, whose car was built >1 week later, received his car the week before last.
So I’ll be taking delivery at least two weeks later for a car built over a week earlier.

So, rail cars were available and the later-produced car made it from KC to Miami first. Why wouldn’t they use a first-in/first-out sequence? Is there dealer favoritism or special priority at play? Super-optimized economics? Given the inaccurate and volatile delivery estimates, I don’t believe there is logic behind it, I think it’s just incompetence and a poor system.

And yes, the transportation is done by other than Ford, but Ford is still responsible for action required to get the product to customer and meet their commitments.

You have to realize that this isn’t just impatience and whining. People are making financial and life decisions based on the estimates and expectations, like selling other vehicles or buying accessories. I’ve made a commitment to give our existing vehicle to a family member, and the delay is impacting them. I have $1500+ of accessories that I’ll now miss the return window on. And potential loss of the tax credit would be a significant hit.

I think it’s easy for those who’ve received their cars to minimize the frustrations of the OP. There’s a lot of opportunity for Ford to address this through improved transparency, delivery estimates, and process consistency.

 

[Mach1E]

People are making financial and life decisions based on the estimates and expectations, like selling other vehicles or buying accessories.

Oh you should know better than to do that! The experiences of all of us who got cars before now should serve as a warning to others. They’re called “estimates” for a reason. And many things can and frequently do go wrong to change the estimate.

I think it’s easy for those who’ve received their cars to minimize the frustrations of the OP.

Quite the opposite actually. We can empathize with the OP because we have already gone through the same stuff.

Maybe the only difference is the OP may not get the rebate based on timing.

But anyone ordering this year would have known that was a potential risk when ordering. Even if the law didn’t change there was a risk of the 200,000 running out.

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