Mach-E GT 5-second throttling discussion by Out of Spec

[silverelan]

Kyle Connor and the Out of Spec crew discuss the Mach-E GT/PE's 5 Second Rule.

Discussion begins at 21:40.

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[AstralLiving]

Great info; a lot more detail than I've seen on the issue, which confirms a lot of individual posts and possibilities mentioned on these forums.

The hosts call out that the GT Performance branding certainly will set different expectations for people who prioritize performance. I think I'll still enjoy the car, as 95% of the time the performance will be better than my current car (2013 Golf R) but the times I get less performance will stand out in my mind.

I hope I don't regret my purchase.

 

[silverelan]

This is the first I've heard in detail about the amp hour metering being the limiting factor. From the sounds of it, @OutofSpecKyle has had some in-depth discussions with Ford engineers on what is happening, Ford's philosophy on power limitations, and what may change in the near future.

 

[Kevin P]

Great info; a lot more detail than I've seen on the issue, which confirms a lot of individual posts and possibilities mentioned on these forums.

The hosts call out that the GT Performance branding certainly will set different expectations for people who prioritize performance. I think I'll still enjoy the car, as 95% of the time the performance will be better than my current car (2013 Golf R) but the times I get less performance will stand out in my mind.

I hope I don't regret my purchase.

I have done many hundreds if not thousands of 1/4 mile passes in V8 Mustangs, and hundreds of laps around road courses (Mid-Ohio, Watkins Glen, Road America, Putnam Park) in that same V8 Mustang, typically in the fastest street-car run group. Meaning, I know and love performance. I am aware of the MME GT limitations, but I still like driving it and rarely run into much power throttling. With that said, I am over 50 years old and not doing canyon bombing... Its shockingly fast around town and fine on the highway, but you aren't going to be outrunning any performance car at speed.

 

[Kevin P]

This is the first I've heard in detail about the amp hour metering being the limiting factor. From the sounds of it, @OutofSpecKyle has had some in-depth discussions with Ford engineers on what is happening, Ford's philosophy on power limitations, and what may change in the near future.

The good news to me is that its pretty clearly somewhat arbitrary, and definitely conservative. That means Ford likely could make it "better" and not risk much in the way of damage or longevity. Whether they WILL do so or not remains to be seen.

 

[SashaLondon]

Without the sensors as described in the video then I can’t see how they can improve this with an OTA.

 

[strangeengine]

I have done many hundreds if not thousands of 1/4 mile passes in V8 Mustangs, and hundreds of laps around road courses (Mid-Ohio, Watkins Glen, Road America, Putnam Park) in that same V8 Mustang, typically in the fastest street-car run group. Meaning, I know and love performance. I am aware of the MME GT limitations, but I still like driving it and rarely run into much power throttling. With that said, I am over 50 years old and not doing canyon bombing... Its shockingly fast around town and fine on the highway, but you aren't going to be outrunning any performance car at speed.

Agree. I already have a race car - I just need a fast and entertaining street car. ?

 

[Kevin P]

Without the sensors as described in the video then I can’t see how they can improve this with an OTA.

Sure they can, through testing and data gathering over time.

 

[AstralLiving]

I have done many hundreds if not thousands of 1/4 mile passes in V8 Mustangs, and hundreds of laps around road courses (Mid-Ohio, Watkins Glen, Road America, Putnam Park) in that same V8 Mustang, typically in the fastest street-car run group. Meaning, I know and love performance. I am aware of the MME GT limitations, but I still like driving it and rarely run into much power throttling. With that said, I am over 50 years old and not doing canyon bombing... Its shockingly fast around town and fine on the highway, but you aren't going to be outrunning any performance car at speed.

Thanks for this. I was reacting with anxiety to that video, but you're helping me feel better.

To add: looking back at The Smoking Tire's canyon run in the GTPE, Matt Farah had no comments about limiting there. I bet canyon runs will be mostly fine, especially at my skill level. I'm in Austin, TX where there are a few canyon-like roads but their speeds are well under 70. There are longer opening roads where some crazy speeds can be obtained, but I'll just have to accept that I won't be going crazy there (and besides, I'd rather not lose my license).

My current car is an example of similar critic response. The 2013 Golf R in the US was slightly detuned and had fewer tech features than the EU version. Critics hated the un-defeatable ESC. I love driving this thing, but those critics' legit concerns affected my love for the car at first. I'll try to avoid being so influenced this time.

 

[AstralLiving]

Without the sensors as described in the video then I can’t see how they can improve this with an OTA.

I think they'll just have to go about it differently.

Maybe it will be increased to 6 or 7 seconds before limiting once there's enough data. Or the limiting can come on more gradually.

 

[Pushrods&Capacitors]

Thanks for this. I was reacting with anxiety to that video, but you're helping me feel better.

To add: looking back at The Smoking Tire's canyon run in the GTPE, Matt Farah had no comments about limiting there. I bet canyon runs will be mostly fine, especially at my skill level. I'm in Austin, TX where there are a few canyon-like roads but their speeds are well under 70. There are longer opening roads where some crazy speeds can be obtained, but I'll just have to accept that I won't be going crazy there (and besides, I'd rather not lose my license).

My current car is an example of similar critic response. The 2013 Golf R in the US was slightly detuned and had fewer tech features than the EU version. Critics hated the un-defeatable ESC. I love driving this thing, but those critics' legit concerns affected my love for the car at first. I'll try to avoid being so influenced this time.

Well, don’t come at me in our 4X out on SH130 in the 80-85mph section because I’ll make you regret it all the way to 114mph where I’ll shut it down and flip the hazards on! ??. Kidding, kidding.

 

[Mach1E]

Well, don’t come at me in our 4X out on SH130 in the 80-85mph section because I’ll make you regret it all the way to 114mph where I’ll shut it down and flip the hazards on! ??. Kidding, kidding.

I know you’re kidding, but not really kidding. You still seem to think that there’s a race the 4x can win.

I don’t think one exists except the following bench race:

Start at zero, floor it to 80, but put the 4X 5 car lengths ahead to start so that they meet up right at 80mph.

But then the race only starts at 80 and ends at 110. And maybe the 4X noses ahead?

If you start a roll race at 80 instead? GT wins.

I am still shocked that in 5 months no one has lined them up yet.

 

[Pushrods&Capacitors]

I know you’re kidding, but not really kidding. You still seem to think that there’s a race the 4x can win.

I don’t think one exists except the following bench race:

Start at zero, floor it to 80, but put the 4X 5 car lengths ahead to start so that they meet up right at 80mph.

But then the race only starts at 80 and ends at 110. And maybe the 4X noses ahead?

If you start a roll race at 80 instead? GT wins.

I am still shocked that in 5 months no one has lined them up yet.

What I think is the fact we even talk about 4Xs running with GTs is flat out stupid. It’s all joking because it’s a joke. And I’m just not sure who would win from an 80 hit up to 110+, I really don’t know. And that’s pathetic. We don’t get gray bars ever, at 80 or 90 even, it just jumps out and pulls all the way up. So, saying a GT wins starting at 80ish is, so far, not demonstrable.

But, one of you GT guys please go get a dragy run from 30-100mph faster than 10.2-10.3, because I already have 2 in coolish weather (60s) at 75-80% SOC. I’ve posted them. I really want the GT to be faster. Because I’d like my wife to trade her 4X on a sweet GTPE, you know?

Aside from one YouTube video of a “good” GT run from 70ish to 110mph (where a rubbish wagon later passed it ?) there’s nothing but bad numbers after the 1/8th mile from Car and Driver, Edmunds, MT, owners on the forum etc.

From 0-110mph (per Car and Driver) a 4X is 2.3 seconds faster, that’s a fact, as preposterous as it may sound.

 

[Mach1E]

What I think is the fact we even talk about 4Xs running with GTs is flat out stupid. It’s all joking because it’s a joke. And I’m just not sure who would win from an 80 hit up to 110+, I really don’t know. And that’s pathetic. We don’t get gray bars ever, at 80 or 90 even, it just jumps out and pulls all the way up. So, saying a GT wins starting at 80ish is, so far, not demonstrable.

But, one of you GT guys please go get a dragy run from 30-100mph faster than 10.2-10.3, because I already have 2 in coolish weather (60s) at 75-80% SOC. I’ve posted them. I really want the GT to be faster. Because I’d like my wife to trade her 4X on a sweet GTPE, you know?

Aside from one YouTube video of a “good” GT run from 70ish to 110mph (where a rubbish wagon later passed it ?) there’s nothing but bad numbers after the 1/8th mile from Car and Driver, Edmunds, MT, owners on the forum etc.

From 0-110mph (per Car and Driver) a 4X is 2.3 seconds faster, that’s a fact, as preposterous as it may sound.

Ha! I knew you believed it!

That video where a wagon passed it was in below 40 degree temps. A 4X acceleration would likely suck too.

The only video I’ve seen that was near full charge and in decent weather is posted on the GT Facebook page. I wish I could post it but I did the screen shots instead. And I know you saw those since you commented.

I definitely agree that it’s silly it’s even a debate. I blame Ford.

I did see the C&D 0-110 thing. Just sad.

I believe that’s what they timed it at. But I would like to see them do it at the same state of charge and weather. We know how temperamental these cars are.

 

[Pushrods&Capacitors]

Ha! I knew you believed it!

That video where a wagon passed it was in below 40 degree temps. A 4X acceleration would likely suck too.

The only video I’ve seen that was near full charge and in decent weather is posted on the GT Facebook page. I wish I could post it but I did the screen shots instead. And I know you saw those since you commented.

I definitely agree that it’s silly it’s even a debate. I blame Ford.

I did see the C&D 0-110 thing. Just sad.

I believe that’s what they timed it at. But I would like to see them do it at the same state of charge and weather. We know how temperamental these cars are.

? I don’t believe it, I just don’t know, agnostic I suppose. Really.

And yeah, I saw the one guy run 12.1-12.2@105+ and yet no mainstream test has exceeded 101-102mph on a 12.5 or so. And they charge up to 80%+ SOC as a matter of course for best test numbers, because they say so.

And as far as 4X under 40F, sure it’s subject to the same laws of physics as any lithium ion EV, but, I’ve felt less difference in pull below 40 than I was expecting, range, not so much haha. I’ll get some dragy numbers in below 40F and see where they land.

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