Mach-E Highway and City range estimates from Window Sticker Label

[EVmodeler]

MPGe is AC energy from the grid to recharge the vehicle including parasitic energy losses, and is based on 33.7 AC kWh/Gal equiv.
Range is determined by the DC energy available from the battery system (also including other vehicle parasitic power demands).
The relationship between the battery DC energy discharged and the AC energy recharge is referred to as the charging efficiency, and can be estimated or derived from test data.
See also https://www.macheforum.com/site/thr...aled-in-window-sticker.2064/page-3#post-60907

Edit 12 Dec 2020
Added California Rt 1 sticker information, and also economy in Miles/kWh.

 

[ChasingCoral]

MPGe is AC energy from the grid to recharge the vehicle including parasitic energy losses, and is based on 33.7 AC kWh/Gal equiv.
Range is determined by the DC energy available from the battery system (also including other vehicle parasitic power demands).
The relationship between the battery DC energy discharged and the AC energy recharge is referred to as the charging efficiency, and can be estimated or derived from test data.
See also https://www.macheforum.com/site/thr...aled-in-window-sticker.2064/page-3#post-60907

That's awesome! Thanks for doing this.

 

[JellyBelly]

MPGe is AC energy from the grid to recharge the vehicle including parasitic energy losses, and is based on 33.7 AC kWh/Gal equiv.
Range is determined by the DC energy available from the battery system (also including other vehicle parasitic power demands).
The relationship between the battery DC energy discharged and the AC energy recharge is referred to as the charging efficiency, and can be estimated or derived from test data.
See also https://www.macheforum.com/site/thr...aled-in-window-sticker.2064/page-3#post-60907

Thanks for the details - excellent

 

[EVmodeler]

I just noticed (in my own work!) how close the Hwy DC Wh/mi are for the AWD and then RWD.
Not much impact of weight difference between ER and SR - somewhat expected for Hwy.
Many people work in economy rather than consumption, so for reference:
AWD Hwy ~ 2.85 miles/kWh and RWD Hwy ~ 3.15 miles/kWh

And note those are DC kWh from the battery. I am never sure if what is reported in EVs in the vehicle is miles/kWh from the battery or the wall - from the battery makes the most sense.

The city values are not too far apart, so to two sig fig
AWD City ~ 3.3 miles/kWh and RWD 3.6 miles/kWh (again, DC kWh from the battery)

 

[JamieGeek]

I just noticed (in my own work!) how close the Hwy DC Wh/mi are for the AWD and then RWD.
Not much impact of weight difference between ER and SR - somewhat expected for Hwy.
Many people work in economy rather than consumption, so for reference:
AWD Hwy ~ 2.85 miles/kWh and RWD Hwy ~ 3.15 miles/kWh

And note those are DC kWh from the battery. I am never sure if what is reported in EVs in the vehicle is miles/kWh from the battery or the wall - from the battery makes the most sense.

Its always from the battery.

 

[SnBGC]

And note those are DC kWh from the battery. I am never sure if what is reported in EVs in the vehicle is miles/kWh from the battery or the wall - from the battery makes the most sense.

I believe you are correct.

 

[dbsb3233]

I hate to be a broken record, but we should note that EPA "highway" speeds are still much slower than what most people (in the US/Canada) think of as highway speeds. EPA "highway" uses a range of speeds that still only average out to 48 MPH. That's more country road than highway.

A typical between-city interstate drive with a 75 MPH speed limit is likely to average around 70 MPH (with a little city/refuel slowness on each end averaged in).

So while still useful to see 250 AWD ER "highway" range (vs 286 city), 250 is still likely optimistic for a road trip on mostly interstates.

 

[EVmodeler]

I hate to be a broken record, but we should note that EPA "highway" speeds are still much slower than what most people (in the US/Canada) think of as highway speeds. EPA "highway" uses a range of speeds that still only average out to 48 MPH. That's more country road than highway.

A typical between-city interstate drive with a 75 MPH speed limit is likely to average around 70 MPH (with a little city/refuel slowness on each end averaged in).

So while still useful to see 250 AWD ER "highway" range (vs 286 city), 250 is still likely optimistic for a road trip on mostly interstates.

Yes the actual HwFET test avg speed is 48 mph, but label adjusted values no longer correspond to that actual drive cycle. The ~0.7 adjustment makes the Hwy values equivalent to a higher speed. Now - does that mean it actually matches your Hwy speed? No, but the label values are closer to average driving - that is the purpose of the adjustment for the label. Not perfect, but also good for comparison among vehicles.

 

[EVmodeler]

I hate to be a broken record, but we should note that EPA "highway" speeds are still much slower than what most people (in the US/Canada) think of as highway speeds. EPA "highway" uses a range of speeds that still only average out to 48 MPH. That's more country road than highway.

A typical between-city interstate drive with a 75 MPH speed limit is likely to average around 70 MPH (with a little city/refuel slowness on each end averaged in).

So while still useful to see 250 AWD ER "highway" range (vs 286 city), 250 is still likely optimistic for a road trip on mostly interstates.

And I am not disagreeing with you - I think highway range at 70-75 mph, probably with A/C on is very much of interest.

 

[dbsb3233]

Yes the actual HwFET test avg speed is 48 mph, but label adjusted values no longer correspond to that actual drive cycle. The ~0.7 adjustment makes the Hwy values equivalent to a higher speed. Now - does that mean it actually matches your Hwy speed? No, but the label values are closer to average driving - that is the purpose of the adjustment for the label. Not perfect, but also good for comparison among vehicles.

Interesting. I know there are two EPA cycles that both happen to average 48 MPH, but admittedly it's very confusing and the reports often conflict on what basis is actually used for EPA range.

Independent 70 MPH tests of various BEVs often show a bigger drop from EPA range too than what the EPA number shows. But I guess the only way to know is actually do some real tests. EPA numbers are just so frustrating. It would be nice to be able to ignore them completely in favor of something much better, but it just doesn't exist. At least until independent testers get their hands on them. And that, unfortunately, doesn't show up in vehicle specs.

 

[SnBGC]

.... But I guess the only way to know is actually do some real tests. ....

I would agree with you on this and even add that YOU have to do YOUR OWN test.
EVs are so MUCH more efficient than an ICE that differences in driving styles and conditions are amplified. Driver A on flat terrain will see a very different result compared to Driver B in the mountains for example.

For my driving style and conditions.....I am expecting 245 miles of range at freeways speeds in the valley. On the open road, between major metropolitan areas would be even less because my average speed will be about 5 mph higher than my average speed on the freeways in town. I may not even know that number for several months after I receive my car though. While I drive quite a bit compared to the average commuter.....it's almost exclusively in the valley.

 

[EVmodeler]

Interesting. I know there are two EPA cycles that both happen to average 48 MPH, but admittedly it's very confusing and the reports often conflict on what basis is actually used for EPA range.

Independent 70 MPH tests of various BEVs often show a bigger drop from EPA range too than what the EPA number shows. But I guess the only way to know is actually do some real tests. EPA numbers are just so frustrating. It would be nice to be able to ignore them completely in favor of something much better, but it just doesn't exist. At least until independent testers get their hands on them. And that, unfortunately, doesn't show up in vehicle specs.

The US06 cycle (whole) has an average speed of 48 mph. The US06 Hwy cycle alone has an avg speed just above 61 mph, but the cycle is only a little over 6 miles long; the middle part is above 66 mph avg with a max speed of 80 mph. The US06 is used for emissions and also as part of 5-cycle fuel economy adjustments for combustion vehicles. BEVs use 0.7.

 

[dbsb3233]

I would agree with you on this and even add that YOU have to do YOUR OWN test.

I'll definitely be doing that. But that's frustrating for anyone researching a vehicle to buy. Potential buyers have to rely on the best reports available. By the time you can actually do your own road test, it's too late.

My favorites are the YouTube snapshots of people recording the screen during a drive so we can see the active miles/kWh consumed along with the speed. Temperature and grade and climate control can still impact that, of course, but cruising at a specific speed takes most of the driving style subjectivity out of it (once up to speed, anyway). That's all I really care about for range -- interstate cruising. Around town near home range is irrelevant for me.

Just gonna have to wait and see what the earliest reviewers show. Hopefully we'll start getting some reports next week when the media can report drive experiences.

 

[SnBGC]

I'll definitely be doing that. But that's frustrating for anyone researching a vehicle to buy. Potential buyers have to rely on the best reports available. By the time you can actually do your own road test, it's too late.

My favorites are the YouTube snapshots of people recording the screen during a drive so we can see the active miles/kWh consumed along with the speed. Temperature and grade and climate control can still impact that, of course, but cruising at a specific speed takes most of the driving style subjectivity out of it (once up to speed, anyway). That's all I really care about for range -- interstate cruising. Around town near home range is irrelevant for me.

Just gonna have to wait and see what the earliest reviewers show. Hopefully we'll start getting some reports next week when the media can report drive experiences.

Yep. It's a leap of faith on the first EV. After that it isn't nearly as much of a concern when evaluating another EV for purchase. It's part of the process....just not usually a prime part.

 

[Plutoman15]

So how did the Porsche EV do so well on a highway drive test getting much more range than the sticker said?

also, when the embargo is lifted on the 15th, any chance some of the reviewers had a chance to a drive range test? Or are we looking at January after first delivers for someone to do a drive test?

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