Mach-E to gain access to Tesla Superchargers! Get standard NACS port starting 2025! [⚠️ ADMIN WARNING: NO POLITICS / SOCIAL / MUSK COMMENTARY]

[dbsb3233]

Sort of. At 8 NY and 2 CA sites, the Superchargers are equipped with Magic Docks that allow CCS1 vehicles to charge. The adapter for Fords would simply be a retooled Magic Dock designed into a smaller, simpler form factor.

As well as the locking mechanisms. I suspect the "magic" in the Magic Dock is really the software in the charger, not the dock itself. Other than the nifty locking capability. I assume the dock (and the new adapter) is really nothing more than pins passing the power through, plus the necessary locking mechanisms. It's the chargers that have to know what to do differently when an adapter is being used.

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[bbulkow]

with the two largest current suppliers of EV vehicles in the US now supporting the NACS connector there isn't much chance of NEVI's "CCS only" stance holding up - it will be revisited.

Really? GM said they would support NACS???

In Q1 '23 Ford lost the #2 spot to GM. I do like my MachE and love Ford's actions to gain my loyalty, but numbers don't lie.

Can Ford and GM hit their EV targets? Analysts weigh in (electrek.co)

 

[bbulkow]

There may not have been much outlay on Ford's part. This has the potential to give Tesla access to NEVI funds.

Yes. Underappreciated in the press that Ford'll be paying Tesla, and Uncle Sam will start paying Tesla a few billion here or there. Probably made the deal easy. Which is sort of the point of the NEVI funds: add a little grease to make the right thing happen.

 

[bbulkow]

Hopefully we'll just be able to go on Ford Accessories and buy one for $200 when the time comes. That's what I would like.

Especially with $3,000 of ford points burning a hole in my wallet. That might not be *free* but it's pretty close.

I'd like an adapter with a couple foot of cable or anything else they can do so I don't block three chargers, and I'd pay extra (out of my fordpass account ) to get that.

 

[kodiakng]

Really? GM said they would support NACS???

please point to where i said that.

In Q1 '23 Ford lost the #2 spot to GM. I do like my MachE and love Ford's actions to gain my loyalty, but numbers don't lie.

Can Ford and GM hit their EV targets? Analysts weigh in (electrek.co)

i am far from a ford fanboy - just stating what i see in the market. and yes, numbers don't lie but they do often fib when held in a particular way.

in january 2023 ford produced zero Mach-Es; february 2023 they produced 360. this was completely due to the factory being shutdown for capacity expansion. in march 2023 they produced 7,381; april 2023 it was 11,858. this shows a pretty healthy growth curve to meet farley's stated goals of 600k EV run rate annually.

also, they were not taking orders for a significant period during the first quarter in anticipation of their MY23.5 rollout. we'll see soon what the may 2023 production numbers were - and the ones i note above don't include the Lightning production.

finally, GM cancelled their only high production model (Bolt) so those numbers will dwindle to zero shortly.

so, i think ford is sitting fine in terms of the number 2 EV producer.

 

[AhardFSU]

please point to where i said that.



i am far from a ford fanboy - just stating what i see in the market. and yes, numbers don't lie but they do often fib when held in a particular way.

in january 2023 ford produced zero Mach-Es; february 2023 they produced 360. this was completely due to the factory being shutdown for capacity expansion. in march 2023 they produced 7,381; april 2023 it was 11,858. this shows a pretty healthy growth curve to meet farley's stated goals of 600k EV run rate annually.

also, they were not taking orders for a significant period during the first quarter in anticipation of their MY23.5 rollout. we'll see soon what the may 2023 production numbers were - and the ones i note above don't include the Lightning production.

finally, GM cancelled their only high production model (Bolt) so those numbers will dwindle to zero shortly.

so, i think ford is sitting fine in terms of the number 2 EV producer.

Sure and I love my Mach, but VW was also ahead of Ford. I don't think Ford will recapture the number 2 spot bc VW has ID4s readily available to where potential customers don't have to wait and GM will continue to make the Bolt thru year-end. I'd make a bet and come back here in 6 months, but I don't think Ford will surpass VW or GM for the #2 spot.

 

[dbsb3233]

Yes. Underappreciated in the press that Ford'll be paying Tesla, and Uncle Sam will start paying Tesla a few billion here or there. Probably made the deal easy. Which is sort of the point of the NEVI funds: add a little grease to make the right thing happen.

Only if Tesla adds credit card readers though, which is another of the requirements. Still unclear whether they'll mess up their efficient SC model to do that. They already decided it wasn't worth it to get California's subsidies. Granted, that was a much smaller pot of taxpayer money than the feds are throwing around. But still, I'm not convinced they'll do it for the fed money either.

 

[kodiakng]

Sure and I love my Mach, but VW was also ahead of Ford. I don't think Ford will recapture the number 2 spot bc VW has ID4s readily available to where potential customers don't have to wait and GM will continue to make the Bolt thru year-end. I'd make a bet and come back here in 6 months, but I don't think Ford will surpass VW or GM for the #2 spot.

i'll take that bet.

 

[kodiakng]

Only if Tesla adds credit card readers though, which is another of the requirements. Still unclear whether they'll mess up their efficient SC model to do that. They already decided it wasn't worth it to get California's subsidies. Granted, that was a much smaller pot of taxpayer money than the feds are throwing around. But still, I'm not convinced they'll do it for the fed money either.

from the NEVI proposed rule making:

Payment Methods
This final rule establishes a requirement that charging stations must provide a
contactless payment method that accepts major credit and debit cards and accept payment
through either an automated toll-free phone number or a short message/messaging system
(commonly abbreviated as SMS). Payment methods must be accessible to persons with
disabilities, not require a membership, not affect the power flow to vehicles, and provide
access for those that are limited English proficient.

tesla doesn't need to add actual payment terminals - just a toll-free or SMS payment method.

 

[EasyPass]

I assume that currently the MME can only SuperCharge at a Magic Dock facility but must use the Tesla App with a pre-defined credit card. The future software part might enable Fordpass/Plug-and-Charge protocols to replace/supplement the Tesla App, I expect. In that target scenario I fail to see a need for Ford or any other auto manufacturer to alter their current vehicle charge port strategy. Question is will Tesla be amenable to that in the long term or will there be many other alternatives (aka standards)?

The other way this can go is that Tesla balks on their commitment altogether on deploying Magic Dock across their infrastructure and pushes the action on to individual vehicle owners having to purchase an "A-Dapter" coupled with the vehicle manufacturer making the necessary software enhancement for it all to hand together. Me-no-likey!

 

[kodiakng]

The other way this can go is that Tesla balks on their commitment altogether on deploying Magic Dock across their infrastructure and pushes the action on to individual vehicle owners having to purchase an "A-Dapter" coupled with the vehicle manufacturer making the necessary software enhancement for it all to hand together. Me-no-likey!

i think balking on Magic Dock deployment is highly likely at this point.

however, vehicle integration for just using it isn't required though since you can activate the port in the app - that part is already in place. the vehicle integration is just for the plug&charge capability that farley promised.

 

[dbsb3233]

tesla doesn't need to add actual payment terminals - just a toll-free or SMS payment method.

Contactless payment commonly means tapping your credit card (or phone) to a terminal. I still think of that as a credit card reader (even if not the old swipe style).

I read the "and" there as meaning they have to offer BOTH methods, not just one (which would be an "or"). Although the legalese can always be tricky to interpret.

 

[kodiakng]

Contactless payment commonly means tapping your credit card (or phone) to a terminal. I still think of that as a credit card reader (even if not the old swipe style).

I read the "and" there as meaning they have to offer BOTH methods, not just one (which would be an "or"). Although the legalese can always be tricky to interpret.

agree on both points however another method for contactless payment is for tesla to add a "memberless" payment method to their app.

 

[ChasingCoral]

Really? GM said they would support NACS???

In Q1 '23 Ford lost the #2 spot to GM. I do like my MachE and love Ford's actions to gain my loyalty, but numbers don't lie.

Can Ford and GM hit their EV targets? Analysts weigh in (electrek.co)

That was a short-term slow down on Ford’s part, not a significant increase by GM.

 

[dbsb3233]

agree on both points however another method for contactless payment is for tesla to add a "memberless" payment method to their app.

Could be. Gets into the interpretation of what's meant by "contactless payment for credit/debit cards".

Frankly, I find their insistence that there be a "non-membership" (which I assume simply refers to the typical free account profile) method a bit silly. Yeah, we all get a little annoyed at having to put one more app on our phones (even though we already have 100 by choice), but I'd much rather do that than sit there and type in my credit card numbers standing in the sun trying to get a charge. First world problems. Far more important is just getting more and better DCFC covering travel routes across the country.

Too much "holding the good hostage to the perfect". (And ironically, the "good" network is much better than the "perfect" ones that meet the requirement.)

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