Model S/Model X prices heavily discounted *again*

[Mach1E]

Most of that has to do with EV market crashing and not Tesla. MME can trade above MSRP end of 22. Dealer sell them with markups. Now, you get 60% trade value with the car. I doubt the market will change as drastically again unless there is a war break out and cut oil production to half or something.

I don’t think the EV market crashed this year.

If anything, EV sales are still rising!

I blame Tesla’s huge price reductions along with the expanded tax credit for killing resale values.

On the plus side- it has made BEV ownership more affordable for now. I actually expected the opposite to happen (prices to rise this year). They did in January but since then it seems Tesla has complete control on the price of the entire BEV market right now.

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[ChehRob]

I suspect the very unstable price of new Teslas is going to do a fair amount of damage to the company.

 

[KevinS]

Tesla needs to sell vehicles to match their output and Musk's antics have definably affected demand. His erratic behavior and Twitter/X leadership has definitely become a distraction to the core business and I'm sure the Board would love to figure out a way to get him out as being CEO.

It does not take long for them to build up an inventory and they are doing everything they can to keep the lines running.

Their service facilities have never been scaled appropriately to their manufacturing output which I why I chose Ford over Tesla in 2021. All they need is a bad physical defect requiring immediate recall and they're doing to be in real trouble.

 

[Ghost Ryder]

The danger is with the extreme price games they’ve been playing this year……. People may be trained to wait instead of buying now.

$50,000 price drop on a model x plaid so far this year is crazy.

It also really burns the existing owners by crushing their resale values.

That's not just Tesla, that's the entire EV market. Tesla is just more visible because they get all the press. I mentioned earlier about the Audi GT. At it's height, MSRP was around 110k for a lightly optioned one, but dealers were asking 20k above. Assuming they got 10k, that would of put it at 120k. But just this summer, Audi gave 20k rebate on top of the 10% off MSRP that dealers were offering. So people were getting Audi GTs for 80k. That's not far off from the drop that Model S and X are experiencing.

 

[Ghost Ryder]

I suspect the very unstable price of new Teslas is going to do a fair amount of damage to the company.

The thing is, they're still making profit for every vehicle sold, just not as much. I don't think other OEMs can say the same.

 

[KevinS]

The thing is, they're still making profit for every vehicle sold, just not as much. I don't think other OEMs can say the same.

I think they mean reputation - people being hesitant to buy if they think the price will be different next week.

At least on a traditional dealership lot, you have the perception of being able to negotiate over price.

 

[Mach1E]

That's not just Tesla, that's the entire EV market. Tesla is just more visible because they get all the press. I mentioned earlier about the Audi GT. At it's height, MSRP was around 110k for a lightly optioned one, but dealers were asking 20k above. Assuming they got 10k, that would of put it at 120k. But just this summer, Audi gave 20k rebate on top of the 10% off MSRP that dealers were offering. So people were getting Audi GTs for 80k. That's not far off from the drop that Model S and X are experiencing.

Chicken or egg?

In my opinion, the above happened as a result of the Tesla extreme price drops.

Imagine BMW slashing prices $15-50k on every model.

What do you think would happen to the demand and prices for Mercedes in the following months?

 

[Ghost Ryder]

Chicken or egg?

In my opinion, the above happened as a result of the Tesla extreme price drops.

Imagine BMW slashing prices $15-50k on every model.

What do you think would happen to the demand and prices for Mercedes in the following months?

I just don't think there's a huge market for $100k+ auto, let alone $100k+ EVs. Once early adopters got their fill, the cars were just sitting on dealers' lots.

We're also forgetting that there were extreme price hikes also. Not too long ago, model s and x were 80-90k before they ballooned up to 130's. Tesla is just maximizing their profit like all dealers. Its just more visible with Tesla because they don't have a dealer network to shield them "dealer markups." And also because anything Tesla makes headlines, especially if it's negative news.

 

[Ghost Ryder]

I think they mean reputation - people being hesitant to buy if they think the price will be different next week.

At least on a traditional dealership lot, you have the perception of being able to negotiate over price.

Human psychology is interesting. On the opposite end of the spectrum is FOMO. Once prices start rising, people want to buy before it gets higher.

That's why day traders don't do well in the stock market.

 

[Mach1E]

I just don't think there's a huge market for $100k+ auto, let alone $100k+ EVs. Once early adopters got their fill, the cars were just sitting on dealers' lots.

We're also forgetting that there were extreme price hikes also. Not too long ago, model s and x were 80-90k before they ballooned up to 130's. Tesla is just maximizing their profit like all dealers. Its just more visible with Tesla because they don't have a dealer network to shield them "dealer markups." And also because anything Tesla makes headlines, especially if it's negative news.

I don’t think it’s an either or situation, it’s likely both (waning demand for the expensive cars AND everyone shifting demand to the cheaper Teslas).

 

[4sallypat]

I don’t think the EV market crashed this year.

If anything, EV sales are still rising!

I blame Tesla’s huge price reductions along with the expanded tax credit for killing resale values.

On the plus side- it has made BEV ownership more affordable for now. I actually expected the opposite to happen (prices to rise this year). They did in January but since then it seems Tesla has complete control on the price of the entire BEV market right now.

Agree - areas like California are increasing EV sales since CA has the highest EVs per state.

With gas prices near $6/gallon, EV sales are skyrocketing.

My Ford dealer is selling around 40 EVs per month which is pretty brisk since they also have to buy from other out of area dealers to make up for the volume.

 

[ARK]

I just don't think there's a huge market for $100k+ auto, let alone $100k+ EVs. Once early adopters got their fill, the cars were just sitting on dealers' lots.

We're also forgetting that there were extreme price hikes also. Not too long ago, model s and x were 80-90k before they ballooned up to 130's. Tesla is just maximizing their profit like all dealers. Its just more visible with Tesla because they don't have a dealer network to shield them "dealer markups." And also because anything Tesla makes headlines, especially if it's negative news.

To be fair, some people embrace Tesla for not playing games with dealer markups because there are no dealers.

Lo and behold, it turns out Tesla is better at implementing insane markups than anyone else. AutoNation, Penske, basically any dealer could only dream of convincing buyers to pay a $40K markup on every single $80K vehicle sold.

Meanwhile, an adventurous dealer listing a GTPE with a negotiable $20K markup in 2022 would have caused a seizure on this forum, while a $10K markup would itself also been universally criticized.

 

[Ghost Ryder]

To be fair, some people embrace Tesla for not playing games with dealer markups because there are no dealers.

Lo and behold, it turns out Tesla is better at implementing insane markups than anyone else. AutoNation, Penske, basically any dealer could only dream of convincing buyers to pay a $40K markup on every single $80K vehicle sold.

Meanwhile, an adventurous dealer listing a GTPE with a negotiable $20K markup in 2022 would have caused a seizure on this forum, while a $10K markup would itself also been universally criticized.

I like Tesla's Model. I can can decide whether I'm okay with the price or not. Rather than going into a dealer's showroom and wondering what the final price will be, and having to look at all the fine print to make sure the dealer didn't sneak in any "extras."

 

[Ghost Ryder]

I don’t think it’s an either or situation, it’s likely both (waning demand for the expensive cars AND everyone shifting demand to the cheaper Teslas).

Agreed. Just crazy that they're still making profit per vehicle even while dropping the price by 30+%. Crazy profit margins.

 

[nvabill]

Dude, this “race to the bottom” that Tesla is forcing is pretty sad. I never wanted a Tesla, much less a Model X, but now is the time to buy I guess if you were inclined.

There is absolutely nothing sad about this, the vehicle manufacturers have been sticking it to the American consumer and now they are having to be more reasonable in pricing, this is a win win for everyone!

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