cometguy

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Tesla is not really known for the car quality they build, but moreover a technology company and I'm seeing that part of the company become less valuable the longer I own the car. . . .

1) On long road trips, using autopilot causes me to feel tired and I find myself driving for majority of the trip. Overall, the value of autopilot to me isn't really that great. The model 3 is a long ways from autonomy, at least 5 years away in my opinion from FSD. . . .

3) Tesla service is not that great either, and the service center is always bumping full. They don't even do state inspections. . . .

I have never owned a Ford in my life - but the Mustang Mach E checks all the boxes (range, performance, tech, design, service, etc.) and it has me seriously considering Ford's Mustang Mach E in a few years when it is time for an upgrade. . . .

Additionally, the Mach-E will be able to receive over-the-air updates, which will include some self-driving features. No timeline was provided. . . .

The Electrify America Charging network also is starting to impress me. While it isn't as widespread as Tesla (750 locations, Electrify America has 400) the coverage is still really good and cross country travel should be a non issue in the Mach E.
I've selected some comments from the original post to respond to. Regarding car quality, I have owned one Ford in my life (a Ford Explorer), and it was by far the worst car I have ever owned. For me, it's a leap of faith to consider buying a Mach-E (and I am, despite my horrible experiences with my Explorer, with Ford salesmen, and with Ford service departments). Ford does not inspire confidence in me to have better quality and better service than Tesla does, but I would guess that it would be hard not to be better. What I'm afraid of, as others have stated here, is that not all Ford dealerships will care to have technicians/mechanics learn how to service Ford BEVs. So the verdict is still out, and I'm hesitant to be among the first buyers of a Ford Mach-E; I'll be watching other first buyers on this forum to see what kinds of problems arise. (As for state inspections, my finding among many brands is that few dealerships do them.)

Over-the-air updates: I've heard tons of problems from Tesla owners getting automatic updates that cause hassles. Over-the-air updates are only good if you can first review what the updates are and why they might be useful, and then CHOOSE to get them (or not), as we can do on our computers and smartphones.

Autopilot. Should never be used, in my opinion -- too many problems. They should be banned by federal regulators. ACC is fine, but anything involving a car steering on its own is bad bad bad. Software vs. real-world road conditions just isn't there, safety-wise, and won't be for a long long time.

As for "cross country travel should be a non issue in the Mach E": This is baloney. Any BEV cross-country travel is a HUGE issue, requiring a lot of patience and a lot of effort (when compared to ICEV travel). It'll be at least a decade or more before cross-country travel in a BEV is "a non issue" -- as simple as filling up on gasoline is today. I know lots of BEV owners and read lots of BEV forums; cross-country travel is anything but simple and fun; you have to be really dedicated to do drive cross-country in a BEV. Public chargers are not everywhere -- not by a long shot; they are frequently broken or take a lot of time to get to work via rebooting or whatever. Most BEV owners do not take their BEVs on long trips (or do so only rarely), preferring to use BEVs for local commuting and other forms of transportation (incl. ICEVs) for long-distance driving. When I buy my first BEV, it will be for local commuting only -- but it will be a daily driver and I'll be very happy to not be driving an ICEV locally.
 
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dbsb3233

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I'd be very happy if Ford was able to get the Mustang Mach-E AWD ER down to 4.8 seconds. That's quick enough to leave a RAV4 or even a Honda Accord behind and would not be embarrassing at a stoplight next to a Model Y.
I can't remember the last time I floored a car from a stoplight. Maybe the 1970's?
 

silverelan

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I can't remember the last time I floored a car from a stoplight. Maybe the 1970's?
Have you had a car worth flooring since Jimmy Carter?
I will punch the accelerator in my Outback and all 175hp complains about it. It's lame and I want to have a car that's fun. Ford is coming to yours and my rescue and I can't wait.
 

dbsb3233

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Have you had a car worth flooring since Jimmy Carter?
I will punch the accelerator in my Outback and all 175hp complains about it. It's lame and I want to have a car that's fun. Ford is coming to yours and my rescue and I can't wait.
Depends on what one's reason is for flooring it off a stoplight, I suppose. I really haven't had a desire to since I was in high school. For those that like to race, that's fine. To each his own. It's just not my thing. I guess that's why I'm much more interested in the Mach-e being more SUV than Mustang.

Not that I don't like the Mustang styling. It looks cool. And it performs like an EV, which is naturally more peppy than an ICE vehicle. But personally, 6 seconds is more than fast enough of a 0-60 for my needs. I'm not going to be racing for pinks. :cool:
 

silverelan

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Depends on what one's reason is for flooring it off a stoplight, I suppose. I really haven't had a desire to since I was in high school. For those that like to race, that's fine. To each his own. It's just not my thing. I guess that's why I'm much more interested in the Mach-e being more SUV than Mustang.

Not that I don't like the Mustang styling. It looks cool. And it performs like an EV, which is naturally more peppy than an ICE vehicle. But personally, 6 seconds is more than fast enough of a 0-60 for my needs. I'm not going to be racing for pinks. :cool:
You floor it in an EV because it's a rollercoaster on-demand. It's just so much fun.

Until the last month or so, Tesla had a monopoly on that such that it is called the "Tesla Smile".
The first time I experienced that thrilling exhilaration in a non-Performance Model S, I laughed so hard in glee that I gave myself an asthma attack. I can't wait for that thrill with a Mustang badge on it is sitting in my driveway.
 

LYTMCQ

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Over-the-air updates: I've heard tons of problems from Tesla owners getting automatic updates that cause hassles
They are bug fixes more than "updates" and its not that OTA's cause problems it's that much on the Tesla is Beta so it changes all the time with the update.
 

Billyk24

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Never been to a dealership that doesn't do state inspections. Ford dealerdhips that sell BEV including the large profit making F150 and its BEV option have to install level 2 chargers and have a trained mechanics.
 

dbsb3233

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Never been to a dealership that doesn't do state inspections. Ford dealerdhips that sell BEV including the large profit making F150 and its BEV option have to install level 2 chargers and have a trained mechanics.
Absolutely, they need them for internal purposes.

Whether they'll make any available as public chargers, though, it a whole different matter. That's what some people seem to be assuming that announcement of installing chargers means. Which I doubt (for most dealerships, anyway).
 

Billyk24

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My small town local female own Ford dealership confirm last October 2019 that one charger would be installed at the street and one for/at the service area. It won't mean too much for those that have a 240 volt/level 2 setup at home. It might help a little when traveling longer distances.
 

dbsb3233

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My small town local female own Ford dealership confirm last October 2019 that one charger would be installed at the street and one for/at the service area. It won't mean too much for those that have a 240 volt/level 2 setup at home. It might help a little when traveling longer distances.
If there's a hotel nearby, that could be quite useful. Or if one works nearby (assuming the dealer is fine with someone tying it up for 8 hours). Slightly useful if there's a restaurant or mall nearby. Beyond that though, seems like it would be more of a "OMG, my battery's almost dead and I need to stop in to add 10 miles to limp home" thing.

L2 charging speeds are fine if you have 8-12 hours to charge (like overnight). But for an hour lunch stop, it's not really gonna be of much use for traveling long distances. We're talking just 22-32 miles added for an hour charge on the Mach-e.
 
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Stickboy46

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Have you had a car worth flooring since Jimmy Carter?
I will punch the accelerator in my Outback and all 175hp complains about it. It's lame and I want to have a car that's fun. Ford is coming to yours and my rescue and I can't wait.
I think there is difference between punching the accelerator because you HAVE to and punching it because you want to. In the Outback, you have to in order to get around.

My previous cars in the last 15 years. 1998 Trans Am, 2002 Grand Prix GTP (heavily modified), 2006 GTO, 2014 Taurus SHO.

When I was in my early 20s, sure, having the fastest car on the road was fun. Since I had the GTO and the SHO, I can probably count on 1 hand the number of times I've really needed to floor it. Even when I wanted to have fun, I'd get on it from 20-60 getting on a ramp or something so the 5.3 0-60 of the SHO was plenty fast for that. I can't remember the last time, I floored it off a stoplight ....

To me, mid 5s is MORE than enough for normal driving where you can still have fun with it and not feel like you can't get out of your own way. As far as embarrassing next to the Model Y. I'd be embarrassed to be sitting in a car as ugly as the model Y so the 0-60 time doesn't matter there.
 

hybrid2bev

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If there's a hotel nearby, that could be quite useful. Or if one works nearby (assuming the dealer is fine with someone tying it up for 8 hours). Slightly useful if there's a restaurant nearby. Beyond that though, seems like it would be more of a "OMG, my batteries almost dead and I need to stop in to add 10 miles to limp home" thing.

L2 charging speeds are fine if you have 8-12 hours to charge (like overnight). But for an hour lunch stop, it's not really gonna be of much use for traveling long distances. We're talking just 22-32 miles added for an hour charge on the Mach-e.
I think of the Ford dealer as an opportunity charge. Follow the golden rule of BEVs, ABC: always be chargin'. You don't have to go for a full charge (80%) every time you plug in. Why not pick up a few free electrons here and there while you're out and about.

I agree that if your on a road trip the dealer could be an emergency backup that would enable you to reach the next fast charger.
 

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Autopilot. Should never be used, in my opinion -- too many problems. They should be banned by federal regulators. ACC is fine, but anything involving a car steering on its own is bad bad bad. Software vs. real-world road conditions just isn't there, safety-wise, and won't be for a long long time.
When I traded in my $17K Juke on a $55K Model 3, I was expecting a rather large increase in insurance premiums. Imagine my surprise when USAA dropped my rates 10%. I spoke to an USAA representative to figure out what was going on. I was informed that, "Yes, Teslas cost more to repair than other cars." However, I was then told that according to USAA's statistics that Teslas were dramatically less likely to be in involved in an accident when on autopilot. 1/6th as likely as in a regular car.

After having spent quite a few miles behind the wheel while on autopilot, I can say with complete confidence that the Tesla autopilot makes driving considerably safer than manual driving when used as intended. (Freeway driving.) Way safer than most of the bozos driving around today. Contrary to all of the FUD, it is quite a capable autopilot.
 

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I've selected some comments from the original post to respond to. Regarding car quality, I have owned one Ford in my life (a Ford Explorer), and it was by far the worst car I have ever owned. For me, it's a leap of faith to consider buying a Mach-E (and I am, despite my horrible experiences with my Explorer, with Ford salesmen, and with Ford service departments). Ford does not inspire confidence in me to have better quality and better service than Tesla does, but I would guess that it would be hard not to be better.
This is a kind of thinking that I have personally never understood. Whoever made that Explorer back in 1992 are not the same people who make the car today. Yes, the name is still Ford on the front, but they have gone through 5 CEOs since then. The management and leadership are different. Even the factory workers are different.

Also, it's possible that 99% of the Explorers could have been good and you just got the 1% bad.

I'm not trying to attack you or defend Ford. My point is to swear off a company forever or to have blind allegiance to a company forever (Apple, Tesla) just doesn't make any sense...but a lot of people do it.
 
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