New best 0-60 time in MME 4X (Dragy run)

[Pushrods&Capacitors]

Tomorrow morning before work I’ll go back to the deserted road and get some 30-100 times for you. Do you have the temp and SOC for your best time you mention above? If you do maybe I can just run the GT-PE and not have to do the 4X also.

Here is 1 I found. Approx. 80-85% SOC, no pre-conditioning. I’ll try to get a couple more 30-100s soon where the grade is closer to -1 to 1% range.

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[Mach1E]

Dozen? -40F? I’m talking 2-3 runs in whatever weather. Maybe even 1 30-100mph pull. We know the GT will gap a 4X initially, but, for how long?

If a 4X is 2 secs faster to 110mph (proven by CD test) and it gains about 20 mph from the 1/8th to 1/4 mile vs. the GTs gaining only 12-13mph (proven by multiple user Dragy runs), why is it far fetched that it can eke out a 30-100mph win? So far my best in our 4X is a 10.1-10.2 30-100mph Dragy run. Put up or shut up time.

BTW, I decided to keep the SS instead of selling for a GT350, but I’m doing the rest of the LMS 560hp package - heads, cam etc. only $3K to go from 115mph traps to 120-121s. I fear no MME

The C&D article didn’t prove anything except that two different cars on two different days in two different weathers performed differently.


It isn’t far fetched that the GT (same car more power) will always be faster. Even if that power only lasts 2-5 seconds, a lot happens in that short time. Doesn’t matter if from a stop or roll, the difference is huge for those few seconds.

 

[Mach1E]

Here is 1 I found. Approx. 80-85% SOC, no pre-conditioning. I’ll try to get a couple more 30-100s soon where the grade is closer to -1 to 1% range.

Have you been in a GTPE yet?

I think a single full throttle hit from 30 mph will dash your dreams of winning 30-100.

The acceleration at 30 is……. Obscene. 2 gray bars or less and I spin the tires when punching it from that speed. Significantly more peak acceleration than my SS was capable of.

 

[Pushrods&Capacitors]

Have you been in a GTPE yet?

I think a single full throttle hit from 30 mph will dash your dreams of winning 30-100.

The acceleration at 30 is……. Obscene. 2 gray bars or less and I spin the tires when punching it from that speed. Significantly more peak acceleration than my SS was capable of.

I’m your Huckleberry. I’ve been in faster - Model Y and 3 Performance among many others, my SS included. I understand the instant G effect but it dwindles precipitously thereafter. The GTPE problem is the speedo digits flipping slows to a crawl after 80ish mph. We’ve seen plenty of videos. The 4Xs don’t. Maybe the initial jump out is enough to sustain it’s lead to 100mph maybe not. And you keep framing the convo with my “dreams” and such, I’m just curious and I want Ford to fix it is all. I’ve stated that we would likely trade our 4X for a GTPE if the 5 sec limit went to 10 or no limit. I’m not a hater.

 

[Mach1E]

I’m your Huckleberry. I’ve been in faster - Model Y and 3 Performance among many others, my SS included. I understand the instant G effect but it dwindles precipitously thereafter. The GTPE problem is the speedo digits flipping slows to a crawl after 80ish mph. We’ve seen plenty of videos. The 4Xs don’t. Maybe the initial jump out is enough to sustain it’s lead to 100mph maybe not. And you keep framing the convo with my “dreams” and such, I’m just curious and I want Ford to fix it is all. I’ve stated that we would likely trade our 4X for a GTPE if the 5 sec limit went to 10 or no limit. I’m not a hater.

Yes, I keep framing it as in your dreams because you clearly hope it’s true. You say you don’t, but then give multiple reasons why you think it is. I have my theories as to why (you own the 4X, care about drag racing, and it helps justify not having gotten a GTPE).

I know you have faster cars, and have been in them. It’s just the 4X isn’t one of the faster cars.

But I’m sure you’ll keep coming up with different scenarios where you think the 4X will win. At least it keeps the discussion interesting!

On a related note- it’s also possible for a 4X to get to a speed in less time and still lose the race. Example- roll race from 30 to 110 mph. How? Same way you can have a higher trap speed and lose a drag race. Races are won based on distance not speed. Especially with extremely nonlinear acceleration like the GTPE has.

 

[Pushrods&Capacitors]

Yes, I keep framing it as in your dreams because you clearly hope it’s true. You say you don’t, but then give multiple reasons why you think it is. I have my theories as to why (you own the 4X, care about drag racing, and it helps justify not having gotten a GTPE).

I know you have faster cars, and have been in them. It’s just the 4X isn’t one of the faster cars.

But I’m sure you’ll keep coming up with different scenarios where you think the 4X will win. At least it keeps the discussion interesting!

On a related note- it’s also possible for a 4X to get to a speed in less time and still lose the race. Example- roll race from 30 to 110 mph. How? Same way you can have a higher trap speed and lose a drag race. Races are won based on distance not speed. Especially with extremely nonlinear acceleration like the GTPE has.

Your “theory” is false. My wife owns the 4X, I just like it and drive it some to keep miles off the SS, but trust me, I’m not the confirmation bias type. I told her to spend the extra $10K for the GTPE actually! The 4X is no GT in any shape or form. Except for 1/4 trap speed and ETs to 100+ mph.

I know well how drag races are won because I lost my share when I was younger due to traction issues and a lack of launch skills. Corrected that. ET is king. But I’m not talking about drag races because that’s obvious, right? Roll ons don’t give a shit about your 0-30 though, thats why I can pull on Model Y and 3 Perfs. in an SS that only does a 4.08 best ever 0-60.

So, as ever, I’m truly curious as to the 30-100 times for the 5 second neutered GTs because we haven’t seen them yet. That’s the extent of it. And, every Dragy roll-on I’ve ever recorded has the lowest ET matched with the shortest distance, because unless there’s lots spinning involved you can’t get to an identical speed slower and still be in front of the other car.

 

[Mach1E]

Your “theory” is false. My wife owns the 4X, I just like it and drive it some to keep miles off the SS, but trust me, I’m not the confirmation bias type. I told her to spend the extra $10K for the GTPE actually! The 4X is no GT in any shape or form. Except for 1/4 trap speed and ETs to 100+ mph.

I know well how drag races are won because I lost my share when I was younger due to traction issues and a lack of launch skills. Corrected that. ET is king. But I’m not talking about drag races because that’s obvious, right? Roll ons don’t give a shit about your 0-30 though, thats why I can pull on Model Y and 3 Perfs. in an SS that only does a 4.08 best ever 0-60.

So, as ever, I’m truly curious as to the 30-100 times for the 5 second neutered GTs because we haven’t seen them yet. That’s the extent of it. And, every Dragy roll-on I’ve ever recorded has the lowest ET matched with the shortest distance, because unless there’s lots spinning involved you can’t get to an identical speed slower and still be in front of the other car.

I agree with pretty much everything but your last sentence.

It goes back to what I said about nonlinear acceleration.

I’ll use an extreme example to prove the point.

Ever seen a top fuel dragster shut off right after the launch? They hit 100 mph in less than a second. (Still run like an 7 second 1/4 mile). Now imagine they barely touch the throttle and hit 104 mph in the same 13.5 seconds it takes your 4x.

At the end of 13.5 seconds, your 4x will be at 104 mph and just crossing the 1/4 mile mark.

The top fuel dragster will have passed the 1/4 mile in 7 seconds and by 13.5 when it hits 104? It’ll be almost to the 1/2 mile mark.

It’s because of the non-linear acceleration. Obviously the GTPE isn’t gonna be as extreme, but it will be ahead for the same reason.

 

[NewGuy]

The C&D article didn’t prove anything except that two different cars on two different days in two different weathers performed differently.

Not sure what they do for EVs, but for ICE cars they normalize for weather conditions.

https://www.caranddriver.com/features/a32018270/how-we-test-cars/

 

[Mach1E]

Not sure what they do for EVs, but for ICE cars they normalize for weather conditions.

https://www.caranddriver.com/features/a32018270/how-we-test-cars/

Doesn’t seem they do anything. And correction factors would actually be opposite for electric cars.

Higher altitude and hot air would be preferred for a BEV, but doesn’t seem any of the car magazines have figured out how to correct. It’s why all the winter months tests are worse.

 

[Pushrods&Capacitors]

Doesn’t seem they do anything. And correction factors would actually be opposite for electric cars.

Higher altitude and hot air would be preferred for a BEV, but doesn’t seem any of the car magazines have figured out how to correct. It’s why all the winter months tests are worse.

I have heard MT and CD state that they try to at least keep SOCs above 80% and not test EVs stone cold but that’s about it.

 

[Pushrods&Capacitors]

I agree with pretty much everything but your last sentence.

It goes back to what I said about nonlinear acceleration.

I’ll use an extreme example to prove the point.

Ever seen a top fuel dragster shut off right after the launch? They hit 100 mph in less than a second. (Still run like an 7 second 1/4 mile). Now imagine they barely touch the throttle and hit 104 mph in the same 13.5 seconds it takes your 4x.

At the end of 13.5 seconds, your 4x will be at 104 mph and just crossing the 1/4 mile mark.

The top fuel dragster will have passed the 1/4 mile in 7 seconds and by 13.5 when it hits 104? It’ll be almost to the 1/2 mile mark.

It’s because of the non-linear acceleration. Obviously the GTPE isn’t gonna be as extreme, but it will be ahead for the same reason.

I fully understand. We’re not that extreme here though. The GTs initial 1 second gapping combined with it’s total noseover after 80mph could make the 30-100 interesting and a 4X win possible. The GT gains about 12-13mph from the 1/8th to the 1/4 traps, the 4X gains 20-21mph, that is an absolutely epic reeling in difference there and I know you know it. But, Is it enough in a 30-100 hit? 40-110? We’ll find out soon enough I suppose.

Postscript: the fact that we’re once again even discussing this is ludicrous and a testament to how badly Ford fucked up with this 5 second crap. I mean for real. The GT should run 110+ 1/4 mile traps and that’s it. They better figure it out before the EV6 GT hits is all I know because it’s lights out against that thing.

 

[Pushrods&Capacitors]

Tomorrow morning before work I’ll go back to the deserted road and get some 30-100 times for you. Do you have the temp and SOC for your best time you mention above? If you do maybe I can just run the GT-PE and not have to do the 4X also.

Still waiting my friend…

 

[Murse-In-Airy]

Still waiting my friend…

Just getting my first moment of downtime in todays shift and

Well….. I dummied your this morning. it was 24° and both cars were at 90% SOC. GT-PE had 3 grey bars.
I was trying to hurry and dropped the dragy in the front door pull recess on the wife’s . I ran 4 good 1/2 miles. Went back to the house and grabbed my car. Ran my first 1/2 in my car and looked at the results. All 5 results were “invalid.” Appparently not a good enough GPS connection. Moved the dragy to the rear door as you told me about, and then had good connection.

I got curious when my first run in the GT-PE showed a 0-60 time of 9.06

I went ahead and ran 3 more 1/2 miles that way in quick succession but I don’t have the direct “same temp/same SOC” comparisons.

I do have the “invalid” results on 2-4 with the 4X. And the true results on runs 2-4 of with the GT. I was impressed with the consistency of the GT-PE despite doing nothing more than a 3 point turn and a screen shot before hitting it again. That short period was enough to reset from max grey bars to 3 again.

So with “invalid” data the 4X on 0-100 showed:
15.43, 16.77, 20.49, and 17.68
While the GT-PE showed:
22.34 (invalid), 17.45, 17.58, and 17.46

For 30-100 the 4x showed
(All invalid)
12.89,15.36, 12.13, and 12.06
While the GT-PE showed
13.45 (invalid), 15.60, 15.70, and 15.66

Time to fly I’ll try and back to this if I can.

 

[Thor2j]

Times on draggy are all over the place in general. Even when my say valid they can be really far off. Don't know if it's the mount, signal or what, but definetly not valid all the time when it says so. Need to keep playing.

 

[Pushrods&Capacitors]

Just getting my first moment of downtime in todays shift and

Well….. I dummied your this morning. it was 24° and both cars were at 90% SOC. GT-PE had 3 grey bars.
I was trying to hurry and dropped the dragy in the front door pull recess on the wife’s . I ran 4 good 1/2 miles. Went back to the house and grabbed my car. Ran my first 1/2 in my car and looked at the results. All 5 results were “invalid.” Appparently not a good enough GPS connection. Moved the dragy to the rear door as you told me about, and then had good connection.

I got curious when my first run in the GT-PE showed a 0-60 time of 9.06

I went ahead and ran 3 more 1/2 miles that way in quick succession but I don’t have the direct “same temp/same SOC” comparisons.

I do have the “invalid” results on 2-4 with the 4X. And the true results on runs 2-4 of with the GT. I was impressed with the consistency of the GT-PE despite doing nothing more than a 3 point turn and a screen shot before hitting it again. That short period was enough to reset from max grey bars to 3 again.

So with “invalid” data the 4X on 0-100 showed:
15.43, 16.77, 20.49, and 17.68
While the GT-PE showed:
22.34 (invalid), 17.45, 17.58, and 17.46

For 30-100 the 4x showed
(All invalid)
12.89,15.36, 12.13, and 12.06
While the GT-PE showed
13.45 (invalid), 15.60, 15.70, and 15.66

Time to fly I’ll try and back to this if I can.

Sounds like fun times! Nothing wrong with “invalid” runs - those are just runs where the road slope is less than -1%, in other words, gravity is helping you too much for the run to be “valid” and uploaded to the Dragy leaderboard. But, that doesn’t matter for our purposes since you ran both cars on the same roads. It’s a fair comparison. Very interesting #s. The 4X’s are much slower than the best I’ve gotten, but, mine were all above 45-50F with some in the 60s. Those GT runs though, I’ll leave it to @Mach1E to comment on those 30-100s . But, this is proving your earlier seat of the pants intuition that the GT isn’t always faster than your 4X when it’s cold out. Good stuff .

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