New Lithium Phosphate Batteries - Cheaper & ???

nvabill

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Dave-O

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And any car equipped with them will be excluded from Tax credits 🤣
 

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Need to change the title?

They aren’t lighter.

They’re less energy dense than Lithium Ion.

They’re also way worse in cold weather.

They are cheaper and more fire resistant though. It’s why they’re used in base models typically (cost).
 

Dave-O

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Need to change the title?

They aren’t lighter.

They’re less energy dense than Lithium Ion.

They’re also way worse in cold weather.

They are cheaper and more fire resistant though. It’s why they’re used in base models typically (cost).
Hopefully they get the ones with manganese added. Apparently those close the gap for energy density and performance.
 

Mach1E

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This is cost cutting, plain and simple. For the same range, roughly twice the battery weight. Ergo: worse acceleration performance.
I am not certain that the charging difference between an LFP vs an NMC means that the battery pack will last twice as long (20 years instead of 10). However, 9 years down the line, if my battery doesn't have the range needed to be useful, I think battery tech might have improved to the point that replacing the battery might make sense.
 

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CATL holds the patents for this technology so it’s unlikely we are going to see these batteries in cars sold in the USA, especially following the recent EV tax legislation that is likely to get passed and excludes materials made in China
 

roamtheworld

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roamtheworld

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CATL holds the patents for this technology so it’s unlikely we are going to see these batteries in cars sold in the USA, especially following the recent EV tax legislation that is likely to get passed and excludes materials made in China
It’s said Tesla has agreements to use the batteries at least in China. Some reporting says EU is possible.
 

Dave-O

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Correct until US plants are operational you can forget tax credit.
here is the new tech that CATL is building now.
https://electrek.co/2022/07/22/catl-m3p-batteries/
Another advantage is charging to 100% is no problem for LFP batteries.
Interesting few years ahead for battery technology.
An interesting decade ahead for sure! I’m practically bouncing in my seat waiting to see what unfolds.
 

Billyk24

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Less range, 50% drop during true cold winter weathet os bad news for those of us in the UP of Michigan and Northern Wisconsin where 140 mile distance between dcfc exist.
 

Mach1E

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That article doesn’t mention LMFP.
Neither does the video. It does mention lithium iron phosphate, which they seem to be using, which is heavier.

Either way, the video doesn’t mention “weight” as an advantage.

If it was, they wouldn’t gloss over it since energy density is one of the most important factors for battery tech.
 

roamtheworld

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Less range, 50% drop during true cold winter weathet os bad news for those of us in the UP of Michigan and Northern Wisconsin where 140 mile distance between dcfc exist.
I can’t find the study and story about testing in Norway but I know LFP batteries tested well in that cold climate. Range on new formulas is on par with Ternary batteries so shouldn’t be an issue in a year or so. Just need to get US manufacturing going on LFP.
 

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Neither does the video. It does mention lithium iron phosphate, which they seem to be using, which is heavier.

Either way, the video doesn’t mention “weight” as an advantage.

If it was, they wouldn’t gloss over it since energy density is one of the most important factors for battery tech.
LFP has been coming a long way. I’m holding my breath that Ford is getting the more up to date chemistry’s. Even if not, I’d personally be happier than a pig in shit to have LFP in a Lightning.
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