November 3rd 2021 Revised Tax incentives for EVs from House of Reps.

[Draconfier]

I believe it is only based on last years Modified AGI if you elect to take the 7500 as a credit at closing, which most people will do.

not based on tax liability as you say

but still has to go thru reconciliation with the senate version.

Yep Senate and House must both agree on final terms. This provision with the $80k MSRP is much closer to the Senate version.

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[samev]

How about the 1-vehicle limit for tax credit purposes? If I buy 1 qualifying EV *before* the bill is passed (say, purchase in Feb 2022, bill is passed Mar 2022), can I still buy another qualifying EV in 2022 and avail of a 2-car tax credit for 2022?

 

[Mach1E]

Using MSRP is pretty stupid because in normal times all sorts of discounts are available so MSRP is almost meaningless

Yes and of course manufacturers will figure out how to game the system. But at least Msrp is an even line.

If they used “selling price,” then the dealers would just game the system. They would lower the selling price if you agreed to take a really low price on your trade in.

No need to freak out yet though.

 

[Mach1E]

How about the 1-vehicle limit for tax credit purposes? If I buy 1 qualifying EV *before* the bill is passed (say, purchase in Feb 2022, bill is passed Mar 2022), can I still buy another qualifying EV in 2022 and avail of a 2-car tax credit for 2022?

Per taxpayer, but likely the answer is no because it’s per tax year.

 

[Draconfier]

Per taxpayer, but likely the answer is no because it’s per tax year.

If both vehicles were purchased prior to 12-31-21 yes. Or up to 10 if so inclined. If after the bill was ratified in both the House and Senate and it was after 12-31-21 then No. You are only allowed 1 vehicle per taxable year.

 

[kennethjk]

How about the 1-vehicle limit for tax credit purposes? If I buy 1 qualifying EV *before* the bill is passed (say, purchase in Feb 2022, bill is passed Mar 2022), can I still buy another qualifying EV in 2022 and avail of a 2-car tax credit for 2022?

New rules seem to apply to any purchase after 12/31/2021. Again subject to senate and house reconciliation but I suspect that date will hold.

and if course that’s assuming this thing ever gets passed.

 

[Mach-Lee]

I'm pretty worried about this, the federal definition of an SUV seems to be found here:

https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/40/600.315-08

and here:

https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/49/523.5

A vehicle has to satisfy either paragraph (a) or (b) to be considered a non-passenger vehicle (a truck, which SUV falls under). If a vehicle meets the 523.5 requirements except for having a GVWR less than 6000 lbs, it can be called a small SUV per the 600.315 definition.

Comparing to something like an Escape that is considered a small SUV, I think it comes down to the Mach-E not having enough ground clearance or high enough approach/departure angles to be considered an SUV, which is why it gets classified as a small station wagon.

The only saving grace would come down to this paragraph in 600.315-08:

(ii) All automobiles which possess features that could apply to two classes will be classified by the Administrator based on the Administrator's judgment on which class of vehicles consumers are more likely to make comparisons.

Perhaps Ford could petition the EPA to have the Mach-E reclassified as a small SUV based on the way it has been marketed.

I've been waiting for 6 months, I was supposed to have my car by the end of the year but because of the delays it will be Feb 2022 now. If I miss out on $7500 because the law changed while I was waiting it's going to make buying a lot tougher for me. Really not fair. I hope they delay implementation for 6 months to allow the existing orders made before the new rules were announced to be fulfilled.

 

[samev]

If both vehicles were purchased prior to 12-31-21 yes. Or up to 10 if so inclined. If after the bill was ratified in both the House and Senate and it was after 12-31-21 then No. You are only allowed 1 vehicle per taxable year.

I see. So regardless of when the bill is passed (assuming prior to Dec 2022), the 1-car limit rule will apply retroactively to the entire 2022 tax year.

Thanks.

 

[Draconfier]

I'm pretty worried about this, the federal definition of an SUV seems to be found here:

https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/40/600.315-08

and here:

https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/49/523.5

A vehicle has to satisfy either paragraph (a) or (b) to be considered a non-passenger vehicle (a truck, which SUV falls under). If a vehicle meets the 523.5 requirements except for having a GVWR less than 6000 lbs, it can be called a small SUV per the 600.315 definition.

Comparing to something like an Escape that is considered a small SUV, I think it comes down to the Mach-E not having enough ground clearance or high enough approach/departure angles to be considered an SUV, which is why it gets classified as a small station wagon.

The only saving grace would come down to this paragraph in 600.315-08:

(ii) All automobiles which possess features that could apply to two classes will be classified by the Administrator based on the Administrator's judgment on which class of vehicles consumers are more likely to make comparisons.

Perhaps Ford could petition the EPA to have the Mach-E reclassified as a small SUV based on the way it has been marketed.

I've been waiting for 6 months, I was supposed to have my car by the end of the year but because of the delays it will be Feb 2022 now. If I miss out on $7500 because the law changed while I was waiting it's going to make buying a lot tougher for me. Really not fair. I hope they delay implementation for 6 months to allow the existing orders made before the new rules were announced to be fulfilled.

Your first link applies here and not your second link. The second link is non-passenger vehicles. (Think buses, cargo Van's, semi's, farm implements, etc.)
Your first link would also designate the vehicles as a Special Purpose Vehicle Section 3 subsection i.

In which case the Administrator can classify the vehicle as they see fit, i.e. Ford lobbies to have the vehicle classified as an SUV. (Likely)
However the Administrator probably wouldn't classify the Model S or the Roadster as an SUV.

 

[Unexplainedbacon]

So this still reads like a tax credit? That's disappointing as I was hoping for it to be a point of sale rebate like the $750 in California (formerly $1500). Or am I reading it incorrectly (I only read the linked article not the bill verbiage)?

what? When did it go from 1500 to 750? What a rip

 

[Draconfier]

what? When did it go from 1500 to 750? What a rip

Point of sale credit if you qualify under the MAGI limitations, you can have it applied immediately towards the purchase if you elect to take the credit.

 

[kennethjk]

According the what is currently written they are supposed to use the same criteria as the EPA and Dept of Energy to determine size and class of vehicle

 

[Ma9573]

what? When did it go from 1500 to 750? What a rip

I believe it happened on November 1st, but I may be wrong. Check the California board.

 

[Draconfier]

According the what is currently written they are supposed to use the same criteria as the EPA and Dept of Energy to determine size and class of vehicle

No

See attached picture from Bill
"Similar" it does not say using EPA designations.

 

[ChuckA]

To make matters worse, the Model Y (a car I would consider the direct competitor of the MME), is classed as an SUV.

The VIN says that the MME is an SUV. The tax credit form uses the VIN for establishing eligibility.

Per the fordvinlookup.com website:

Body Class

Sport Utility Vehicle (SUV)/Multi-Purpose Vehicle (MPV)

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