Over-the-top anti EV propaganda piece

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corradoborg

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Strangely, his '5%' claim doesn't actually show up in the report he links to (at least not that I could find):
https://www.cas.org/sites/default/files/documents/{653f1a27-cad6-41ad-b065-c6e0bfb38ebf}_CASGENENGWHP100560220101-LIB_Recycling-White-Paper.pdf
I don't see it, either. I do see a section discussing how recycling capacity is increasing to 25% with planned infrastructure being built. There's no reason why it can't keep climbing from there, too.

Aren't quite a lot of Tesla batteries, at least, reused as Powerwalls? That's even better than recycling in the "reduce, reuse, recycle" hierarchy, and wouldn't be included in that white paper.
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AliRafiee

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The parts about zero emissions kill me. As if oil pumps and gas pumps don’t use the same electricity. Not to count the transportation emissions. If you count that, we are pretty much zero emissions.

I can safely say that I’m really close to zero emissions since a lot Washington’s electricity comes from damns.
 

superdave80

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https://www.futuretracker.com/post/electric-vehicle-battery-recycling#:~:text=Because of the complexity of,lithium-ion batteries are recycled.

This is the first link when I searched "What percentage of EV batteries get recycled." They article says 5%. I didn't delve into whether the source is bias or not. Just one data point.

This is the source they quote:

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-56574779
And the source in THAT is literally a guy saying, "Yeah, this is what I heard":
"Currently, globally, it's very hard to get detailed figures for what percentage of lithium-ion batteries are recycled, but the value everyone quotes is about 5%," says Dr Anderson. "In some parts of the world it's considerably less."
I have no idea if that is right or wrong, but that's really nothing more than a guess.
 

DennisD

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The is what is so frustrating about EV advocates. They really don't understand how the world's energy industry works, especially how petroleum fuels are created. They think by replacing ICEV with EV the demand for gasoline shrinks and therefore the oil industry shrinks and eventually will die out.

What most people don't understand is fuels and petroleum chemicals are produced in strict ratios to each other, which are fixed based on the processing infrastructure used to distill them. So that means if you want to keep the current and future levels of commercial aviation flights you get the same amount of gasoline and diesel in ratio to jet fuel. The petrochemical industry just can't switch production ratios overnight. It will take numerous decades and tens of trillions of dollars to re-ratio the industry. All of that will drive the costs up of your daily life.

Short-sidedness is expensive.
The Oil Industry has a shelf life. Granted, it will not be shelved tomorrow but it's days are numbered.

Some will try everything under the Sun to keep it propped up except ironically, the Sun.

They do have hope though. There is enough of you to buy their BS and that gives them more time but it will die sooner than you think.
 
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Blue highway

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Well let's look at what he said:

1) Hertz selling 20k Tesla. True.

2) Hassle of EV charging. True

3) Longer to charge during cold weather. True

4) Downside of Cobalt. True.

5) Few recycled Battery, True.

6) Less than 25% Energy used to charge EVs come from non renewable resources. He's being generous. Apparently the number is closer to 13%.

https://www.eia.gov/energyexplained/us-energy-facts/#:~:text=The United States uses a mix of energy sources&text=Primary energy sources include fossil,produced) from primary energy sources.

7) US gov't is subsidizing EV purchases. True.

The article is clearly bias because it doesn't list the positives of EV ownership, but it would be hard to deny the negatives that he laid out. And say that they are made up.
Things can be true... but out of context... which is what a fair number of facts in these opinion pieces are. Here is an extreme example to make the point:

Your boss asked how you were doing... I told him that it was good to see that you were not drunk at work today.

completely true... what's the problem?
 


corradoborg

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I shouldn't go here, but the climate changes whether you want it to or not and whether you think you cause it or not. Believe ALL the science, just not the made-up part someone got you scared about.
Correct, you shouldn't go there because you're showing us that you are the one believing made-up science. Yes, the global climate changes over time in cycles measured in geologic ages. The made-up part is that the current, vastly accelerated change is part of that natural cycle.
 

corradoborg

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Sorry, but I understood how the climate works well before it became politicized.

They told us young kids in the 1970's oil was going to run out in 25 years and mass starvation would be the order of the day. The world's population was 4B then. The population of the Earth is now 8B. Gasoline is still around $2.50/gal. (adj. for inflation) despite a 14-cent increase in the Federal gas tax since the 1970's.

I don't live in fear.
You claim to understand how the climate works, yet your example is one of economics and continued oil discovery, wholly unrelated to climate.
 

stealthytolkien

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I am not going to lie - at a high level, the opinion is stating some obvious issues we all know are hindering EV adoption so I was okay with the writer regurgitating that with some more color, whatever, I said…until I got to this point: “ And that is based on 20202 numbers, from before “Bidenflation” had hit Americans’ pocketbooks.” and that’s where I stopped reading because it essentially became a Trump 2024 piece after that point onward. Not about EV.
 

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Ghost Ryder

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Things can be true... but out of context... which is what a fair number of facts in these opinion pieces are. Here is an extreme example to make the point:

Your boss asked how you were doing... I told him that it was good to see that you were not drunk at work today.

completely true... what's the problem?
I was responding to old Norm's post:

Old_Norm said:
But everyone isn't allowed their own facts.

I was pointing out that the author was not making up facts in his article.
 

Blue highway

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I was responding to old Norm's post:

Old_Norm said:
But everyone isn't allowed their own facts.

I was pointing out that the author was not making up facts in his article.
yes and I was pointing out that there is not necessarily the implied So-What to any fact.

The author cherry picks facts and assumes there is an obvious action or conclusion simply because something is a fact... in may ways this is worse than having your own facts.
 

DennisD

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Sorry, but I understood how the climate works well before it became politicized.

They told us young kids in the 1970's oil was going to run out in 25 years and mass starvation would be the order of the day. The world's population was 4B then. The population of the Earth is now 8B. Gasoline is still around $2.50/gal. (adj. for inflation) despite a 14-cent increase in the Federal gas tax since the 1970's.

I don't live in fear.
I am close to 60 years old and I never heard that what you are suggesting as a kid back in the 70's. I do remember the fuel crisis though and that would be another reason why it couldn't come soon enough to get our self away from the addiction of oil.

I think your "conspiracy" theories that you listened to followed you up to the 21st. Century.:D

Sounds about right that you would hear those things back in the day. 🤫
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