Mach1E

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 5, 2021
Threads
76
Messages
7,717
Reaction score
9,595
Location
Florida
Vehicles
Mach 1, Chevy SS-sold, GTPE delivered oct 2021
Country flag
Most glaringly, in my opinion, is that the tow agreement is between the driver and Ford as part of the vehicle purchase contract. Ford can subcontract performance of that agreement to anyone it chooses but the agreement is with Ford. Ford agreed to provide roadside tows, Ford provided a roadside tow, and the tow damaged the car. I am not a lawyer, but this clearly appears to be Ford’s liability.
It’s clearly not Ford’s liability. That’s why they essentially told the OP he’s out of luck.

The tow company doesn’t work for Ford, they’re a 3rd party with their own insurance policies (also not paid by Ford).

Again, you technically could go after Ford, but that would be the most difficult of the legal battles. You’d have to prove some sort of negligence on Fords part in terms of who they let tow.

Or you could go directly after the people who actually caused the damage! (Path of least resistance for sure).

Ford typically has very detailed and very clear legal language for this kinda thing that states a lot of “we cannot be held liable, blah blah” in their terms and conditions.

If you have trouble sleeping tonight, read these terms and conditions. It’s a cure for insomnia:

https://www.ford.com/help/terms-conditions/
Sponsored

 

yngwenli

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 8, 2021
Threads
3
Messages
1,033
Reaction score
719
Location
So California
Vehicles
2022 MME Premium RWD SR
Country flag
I get it but it’s a shame they wouldn’t reimburse you. Most of these tow companies that cause damage and tow incorrectly and give the tow community a bad rep are the ones doing cheap motor club tows. As a consumer you should be able to pick your own company that has good reviews and knows what their doing and that should be included in the free roadside. If you called me directly and I had no idea how to tow your car I wouldn’t take the job, but agero pressures companies to accept as many jobs as they can or they won’t give them any more work lol.

So the AAA tow requests are bad for you guys too generally?
 

yngwenli

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 8, 2021
Threads
3
Messages
1,033
Reaction score
719
Location
So California
Vehicles
2022 MME Premium RWD SR
Country flag
If not too much trouble, could someone take a picture of the bottom side of their car where the tow point should be? I was wondering if it has those yellow arrow points as in the picture. Maybe it's worth putting some paint and a "don't jack here" on the inner section as well since a simple tire rotation at Costco can totally damage it. Maybe it's time I get a torque wrench finally and do my own rotations.

Also, looking at the 2021-Wrecker-Towing-Guide-MCS-5717.pdf, which points in the front can a winch be attached to (diagram seems to be in front of the front wheels).
 

RickMachE

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 1, 2021
Threads
200
Messages
13,122
Reaction score
17,835
Location
SE MI
Vehicles
2022 Mach-E Premium 4X, 2022 Lightning Lariat
Country flag
If not too much trouble, could someone take a picture of the bottom side of their car where the tow point should be? I was wondering if it has those yellow arrow points as in the picture. Maybe it's worth putting some paint and a "don't jack here" on the inner section as well since a simple tire rotation at Costco can totally damage it. Maybe it's time I get a torque wrench finally and do my own rotations.

Also, looking at the 2021-Wrecker-Towing-Guide-MCS-5717.pdf, which points in the front can a winch be attached to (diagram seems to be in front of the front wheels).
There are no yellow arrows on the bottom of the car.

I already asked the manager at Discount TIre if they could handle the Mach-E, and he said yes. They will use their bay without a lift, use handjacks, and pucks on the outside only. I plan on standing there watching as I always do.
 

scoopman

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 30, 2021
Threads
60
Messages
2,769
Reaction score
5,797
Location
Bay Area
Vehicles
2023 KIA EV6 GT, 2021 VW ID.4 Pro S
Occupation
former electric pony jockey
Country flag
If not too much trouble, could someone take a picture of the bottom side of their car where the tow point should be? I was wondering if it has those yellow arrow points as in the picture. Maybe it's worth putting some paint and a "don't jack here" on the inner section as well since a simple tire rotation at Costco can totally damage it. Maybe it's time I get a torque wrench finally and do my own rotations.

Also, looking at the 2021-Wrecker-Towing-Guide-MCS-5717.pdf, which points in the front can a winch be attached to (diagram seems to be in front of the front wheels).
I ordered a roll of "no hook" stickers from ebay that are showing up in the coming days. Going to see what I can do to stick some under the car in the bad places. Should be easy to find some green paint perhaps for the right holes.

I still cannot believe that Ford didn't think to stamp anything into the metal of the battery rail saying no tow. Also why not have that diagram on the infotainment screen when you put it in tow mode.... This really was stupid.

How does Brand T handle such issues? Are they just as prickly underneath? I imagine Teslas get towed frequently enough....
 


SpringsMarty

Well-Known Member
First Name
Marty
Joined
Jul 10, 2021
Threads
1
Messages
58
Reaction score
33
Location
Colorado Springs CO
Vehicles
2021 Mach-E Premium ER AWD
Country flag
It’s clearly not Ford’s liability. That’s why they essentially told the OP he’s out of luck.

The tow company doesn’t work for Ford, they’re a 3rd party with their own insurance policies (also not paid by Ford).

Again, you technically could go after Ford, but that would be the most difficult of the legal battles. You’d have to prove some sort of negligence on Fords part in terms of who they let tow.

Or you could go directly after the people who actually caused the damage! (Path of least resistance for sure).

Ford typically has very detailed and very clear legal language for this kinda thing that states a lot of “we cannot be held liable, blah blah” in their terms and conditions.

If you have trouble sleeping tonight, read these terms and conditions. It’s a cure for insomnia:

https://www.ford.com/help/terms-conditions/
I am not an attorney. You may be right. Then again, one of the things I bought with my vehicle was roadside assistance. Ford has an obligation to provide that to me, whether a Ford employee provides the service, a Ford dealer employee provides the service, or some random 3rd party acting as an agent of Ford provides the service. This is Ford's obligation to me. If the service is botched somehow, Ford has not provided that service as it has agreed to do, whether a Ford employee botched it, a Ford dealer employee botched it, or some random 3rd party acting as an agent of Ford botched it.

Ford agreed to provide a service then outsourced it without any knowledge or consent of the vehicle owner. Ford still must complete the service and compensate for the damage done by the outsourced party. The vehicle owner had no knowledge nor control over who was hired to tow the vehicle. The vehicle owner could not assess the tow person's competence. Ford was in a position to assess that competence and put Ford's faith in that tow person.

The tow person was acting as an agent (on behalf) of Ford. The tow person was chosen by Ford (or one of Ford's agents), dispatched by Ford (or one of Ford's agents), and paid by Ford (or one of Ford's agents) to fulfill Ford's obligation to the vehicle owner.

I cannot imagine that a jury will accept Ford claiming it has zero liability here.
 

Mach1E

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 5, 2021
Threads
76
Messages
7,717
Reaction score
9,595
Location
Florida
Vehicles
Mach 1, Chevy SS-sold, GTPE delivered oct 2021
Country flag
I am not an attorney. You may be right. Then again, one of the things I bought with my vehicle was roadside assistance. Ford has an obligation to provide that to me, whether a Ford employee provides the service, a Ford dealer employee provides the service, or some random 3rd party acting as an agent of Ford provides the service. This is Ford's obligation to me. If the service is botched somehow, Ford has not provided that service as it has agreed to do, whether a Ford employee botched it, a Ford dealer employee botched it, or some random 3rd party acting as an agent of Ford botched it.

Ford agreed to provide a service then outsourced it without any knowledge or consent of the vehicle owner. Ford still must complete the service and compensate for the damage done by the outsourced party. The vehicle owner had no knowledge nor control over who was hired to tow the vehicle. The vehicle owner could not assess the tow person's competence. Ford was in a position to assess that competence and put Ford's faith in that tow person.

The tow person was acting as an agent (on behalf) of Ford. The tow person was chosen by Ford (or one of Ford's agents), dispatched by Ford (or one of Ford's agents), and paid by Ford (or one of Ford's agents) to fulfill Ford's obligation to the vehicle owner.

I cannot imagine that a jury will accept Ford claiming it has zero liability here.
Again, that’s just not how liability works.

For one thing, you DID consent to Ford using whatever tow company (it’s gonna be buried somewhere in the terms and conditions).

Let me try a different way to explain.

IF there is some liability, there will be liability insurance for it.

Who has the liability? It’s whoever needs to buy insurance to protect against that liability.

You have it for your car. The tow truck company has it for their trucks and workers. Ford has it for their own employees.

Ford does NOT have insurance for 3rd party vendors. Why? Because they aren’t liable for what the vendors do.

I’ll give an example of an even closer relationship that Ford is not liable for:

Dealerships.

Even though they say “Ford dealership,”
They aren’t owned by Ford. And the employees? Not Ford employees.

If a dealership wrecks your car, you can’t go after Ford for squat. You can go after the dealership though.

Side note- for roadside assistance, Ford even lets you PICK your own tow company and will reimburse you! These are NOT Ford employees https://www.ford.com/support/how-to...claim-a-refund-with-ford-roadside-assistance/

If that tow company damages your car? It’s between you and the tow company.
 

JerryL

Well-Known Member
First Name
Jerry
Joined
Dec 13, 2021
Threads
12
Messages
117
Reaction score
84
Location
Philly
Vehicles
2019 Alfa Romeo Stelvio Ti Sport
Country flag
Why wouldn’t your insurance company subrogate the claim? Let your insurance company sue the towing company. It is a claim for damage to your vehicle. That is why you pay for insurance. They should pay the claim and get reimbursed from the offending party insurance company.
 

jlauro

Well-Known Member
First Name
John
Joined
Dec 29, 2019
Threads
7
Messages
1,069
Reaction score
842
Location
Owosso, MI
Vehicles
2021 Infinite Blue AWD ER Mach-E
Country flag
It’s clearly not Ford’s liability. That’s why they essentially told the OP he’s out of luck.
Although you state that, it doesn't make it so and as the party marketing and selling the 5 year towing protection, it's clear Ford has liability.


Ford typically has very detailed and very clear legal language for this kinda thing that states a lot of “we cannot be held liable, blah blah” in their terms and conditions.
In many states, terms like that are often illegal or limited, and only apply as allowed by law, and could depend on the state even if Ford claims jurisdiction in Michigan, where the contract is signed can overrule that in some states despite Ford claiming otherwise. Best to get legal advise from the same state the vehicle was purchased.

I think we all agree the tow companies insurance is who should be the responsible party, but that does not mean Ford has no liability if that proves to be insufficient as they are selling the service, and what Ford can claim in their terms as liable may be limited by the state the car was sold.

Not to mention that bad PR could cost Ford more than the repair cost...

I just noticed the OP is in Canada... not sure if that is better or worse legal wise...
 

Mach1E

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 5, 2021
Threads
76
Messages
7,717
Reaction score
9,595
Location
Florida
Vehicles
Mach 1, Chevy SS-sold, GTPE delivered oct 2021
Country flag
Although you state that, it doesn't make it so and as the party marketing and selling the 5 year towing protection, it's clear Ford has liability.




In many states, terms like that are often illegal or limited, and only apply as allowed by law, and could depend on the state even if Ford claims jurisdiction in Michigan, where the contract is signed can overrule that in some states despite Ford claiming otherwise. Best to get legal advise from the same state the vehicle was purchased.

I think we all agree the tow companies insurance is who should be the responsible party, but that does not mean Ford has no liability if that proves to be insufficient as they are selling the service, and what Ford can claim in their terms as liable may be limited by the state the car was sold.

Not to mention that bad PR could cost Ford more than the repair cost...

I just noticed the OP is in Canada... not sure if that is better or worse legal wise...
I feel like we are at a dead end. You don’t have to believe me, it’s fine.

So you have two options to find it out for yourself:

1. We can hope we have an attorney on our forums that can clear things up

2. Google it.

FWIW, I already did #2. All the attorney advice websites said the same thing: go through your insurance or the tow companies insurance.

What Ford advertises is the tow. They don’t offer a protection plan or insurance during the tow. They promise to get you to the closest dealer within X number of miles.

edit- let me clear up what I mean by “no liability.” I don’t mean they’re blameless nor that you couldn’t sue them. You could try. What I mean is that they didn’t do the damage, they don’t own the tow company, so you could try, but you won’t get any money out of Ford.
 
Last edited:

Caliroute1

Well-Known Member
First Name
Scott
Joined
Sep 6, 2021
Threads
14
Messages
161
Reaction score
104
Location
Wesley Chapel,FL
Vehicles
2021 Mach E GT
Occupation
Operations Manager
Country flag
Just got mine back for the Stop Safely I could not put in neutral or anything. I had to go into the screen to unlock the car and put in L so the wrecker could load it up with the winch. I hope they just did not drag it....
 

J5hort

Well-Known Member
First Name
JS
Joined
Mar 6, 2020
Threads
19
Messages
343
Reaction score
209
Location
MA
Vehicles
2021 Mustang Mach-E Select AWD
Country flag
Seems like this will be a big legal fight, but this is just another case of recovery vehicle/service not keeping up with the times. The more I talk to people, it is more clear that EV education is not happening on the service side of things. I'm wondering how many tow operators pulled early front and all wheel drive vehicles incorrectly only to cause issues with drivetrain.

This post makes me hesitate to even try to jack up my MME to do a tire rotation/brake inspection. I am a DIYer and have not even checked what maintenance schedule looks like, but the last thing I want is to risk damaging a very expensive battery to save wear on a hundred dollar tire.
 

crownmountain

Well-Known Member
First Name
Dave
Joined
Aug 5, 2020
Threads
10
Messages
174
Reaction score
160
Location
Durham NC
Vehicles
2021 Mach-E Premium 2WD ER, 2022 MINI Cooper S EV
Occupation
Industrial network architect
Country flag
Well for sure from the pictures they did not follow this guide from Ford:
2022 MY WRECKER TOWING MANUAL which then refers to another document "Towing, Recovery and Storage of Damaged Ford Motor Company Electric and Hybrid – Electric Vehicles". They did not know what they were doing is evidenced in the photos. Likely never looked at the documentation at all.
 

LadyGator

Member
First Name
Brittany
Joined
Jun 4, 2021
Threads
1
Messages
13
Reaction score
15
Location
Houston
Vehicles
Mach E, Ext. Range
Country flag
Would someone be able to post a picture of exactly where a tow truck would connect a j-hook or other appropriate device to, under the car? I have seen the provided diagram and read through this thread, and I'm still not sure where I would tell a tow truck river to attach to, to haul up onto a flatbed. Thanks!
Sponsored

 
 




Top