Auto Motive

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If the tax credits are so critical to EV adoption, why is it that every single EV built gets sold right away or they are all on back order? That includes all the Tesla and GM EVs. The problem is not a lack of customers, it is a lack of capacity to build them.
Tax credits will be important to those
in the middle class that have children and expensive day care, high local taxes, increased utility bills etc. Our daughter has a chance now to buy a electric when the new GM blazer and equinox come out msrp around $30-35000 putting it at in the mid $20s which they can afford.

 
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voxel

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Read it again. 30% would qualify for the partial credit. 0 cars would qualify for the full $7,500 credit. Manchin was adamantly against EV credits. Why is he all of a sudden fine with EV credits? It’s because he knows none of them would qualify for the full EV credit.
It’s more complicated than that “None would qualify for the full credit when additional sourcing requirements go into effect” because the exact battery mineral rules are yet to be finalized and it’s NOT true none would not qualify immediately (have you read any of the bill’s text?). There’s some phasing in of percentages.


The two most likely to fully qualify in 2023 are the Bolt and US built ID.4 (cars rolling off assembly now).

A key thing I missed is the credit/rebate is max 30% of a vehicles value. Guess you can’t have EVs too cheap.
 

Mach1E

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It’s more complicated than that “None would qualify for the full credit when additional sourcing requirements go into effect” because the exact battery mineral rules are yet to be finalized and it’s NOT true none would not qualify immediately (have you read any of the bill’s text?). There’s some phasing in of percentages.


The two most likely to fully qualify in 2023 are the Bolt and US built ID.4 (cars rolling off assembly now).

A key thing I missed is the credit/rebate is max 30% of a vehicles value. Guess you can’t have EVs too cheap.
As written……

Are there any BEVs who have at least 40% of their materials and 50% of their components made here? And with nothing coming from China?
 

Caulk-E

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It’s more complicated than that “None would qualify for the full credit when additional sourcing requirements go into effect” because the exact battery mineral rules are yet to be finalized and it’s NOT true none would not qualify immediately (have you read any of the bill’s text?). There’s some phasing in of percentages.


The two most likely to fully qualify in 2023 are the Bolt and US built ID.4 (cars rolling off assembly now).

A key thing I missed is the credit/rebate is max 30% of a vehicles value. Guess you can’t have EVs too cheap.
Where can I find the minerals % for the bolt or id4 battery? Pretty sure both of these cars don’t have 40% of the battery minerals coming from North America or a Free Trade Country.
 

voxel

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As written……

Are there any BEVs who have at least 40% of their materials and 50% of their components made here? And with nothing coming from China?
Since Nickel is the most common mineral I suspect 40% is possible since Canada and Australia supply the bulk of it. See Tesla suppliers

https://cdn.motor1.com/images/mgl/0...rs-from-the-company-s-2021-impact-report.webp

Lithium is hit and miss. It’s plentiful and can be mined from various sources around the world. Cobalt for sure is primarily from the Congo.
 


Mach1E

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Since Nickel is the most common mineral I suspect 40% is possible since Canada and Australia supply the bulk of it. See Tesla suppliers

https://cdn.motor1.com/images/mgl/0...rs-from-the-company-s-2021-impact-report.webp

Lithium is hit and miss. It’s plentiful and can be mined from various sources around the world. Cobalt for sure is primarily from the Congo.
It’s not a question of if it’s possible.

Just a question of whether or not ANY manufacturer currently qualifies.

And for vehicles built/delivered for Jan 1, 2023, it seems the answer is “no.”

Just points to more cluelessness from the government if so. Create a standard that no one meets.

You get a $7500 credit if you buy your car on February 30.
 

voxel

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It’s not a question of if it’s possible.

Just a question of whether or not ANY manufacturer currently qualifies.

And for vehicles built/delivered for Jan 1, 2023, it seems the answer is “no.”

Just points to more cluelessness from the government if so. Create a standard that no one meets.

You get a $7500 credit if you buy your car on February 30.
As it is written currently… 40% “of the value of the applicable critical minerals” must be "extracted or processed in any country with which the United States has a free trade agreement in effect".

The two most likely as I’ve said before are the Bolt and Leaf. TN built ID.4 could also but I know nothing about where they are assembling their batteries or where their minerals are from. The EVs are just rolling off the assembly line now.
 

generaltso

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It’s not a question of if it’s possible.

Just a question of whether or not ANY manufacturer currently qualifies.

And for vehicles built/delivered for Jan 1, 2023, it seems the answer is “no.”

Just points to more cluelessness from the government if so. Create a standard that no one meets.

You get a $7500 credit if you buy your car on February 30.
In the end, it may not matter since it appears that the different agencies involved can just issue waivers to get around the rules.

https://www.politico.com/news/2022/08/06/manchin-electric-vehicle-china-00050145
 

Caulk-E

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As it is written currently… 40% “of the value of the applicable critical minerals” must be "extracted or processed in any country with which the United States has a free trade agreement in effect".

The two most likely as I’ve said before are the Bolt and Leaf. TN built ID.4 could also but I know nothing about where they are assembling their batteries or where their minerals are from. The EVs are just rolling off the assembly line now.
"The Democrats have crafted an electric vehicle tax credit not a single car on the market would qualify for."

https://www.politico.com/news/2022/08/06/manchin-electric-vehicle-china-00050145
 

Auto Motive

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It’s not a question of if it’s possible.

Just a question of whether or not ANY manufacturer currently qualifies.

And for vehicles built/delivered for Jan 1, 2023, it seems the answer is “no.”

Just points to more cluelessness from the government if so. Create a standard that no one meets.

You get a $7500 credit if you buy your car on February 30.
Ok. Buy it then and get 7500 credit. That was easy.
 

Caulk-E

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Ok. Buy it then and get 7500 credit. That was easy.
February 30 does *not* exist. It would be impossible to purchase a car on a date that does not exist on the calendar. Would not be possible to buy.
 

voxel

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"The Democrats have crafted an electric vehicle tax credit not a single car on the market would qualify for."

https://www.politico.com/news/2022/08/06/manchin-electric-vehicle-china-00050145

After 2023, yes.. zero EVs will eligible because of the "foreign entity of concern" (aka China, Russian) rule (for battery minerals) but 2023 will have multiple EVs eligible.

That's what the article is focusing on IMO. I still think you should read the bill's text :)

Pages 381 onward:

https://www.democrats.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/inflation_reduction_act_of_2022.pdf
 

Mach1E

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After 2023, yes.. zero EVs will eligible because of the "foreign entity of concern" (aka China, Russian) rule (for battery minerals) but 2023 will have multiple EVs eligible.

That's what the article is focusing on IMO. I still think you should read the bill's text :)

Pages 381 onward:

https://www.democrats.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/inflation_reduction_act_of_2022.pdf
Clearly we have read this more closely than the people who are voting on it.

“Make sure we aren’t doing anything to help China.***”

***ignores where all the battery materials come from.

 

 
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