The truth about Electrify America's progress and Traveling with the Mach E

[Scufflegrit]

Alabama looks to be another charging black hole. EA doesn't show 1 charger in Alabama. I live near Atlanta and I looked at driving to my parent's house on EA's website. If I go my normal route the first EA charger I would pass is in Forrest City, AR which is 468 miles from my house. That poses 2 problems. The first is that no EV has that kind of range at 80 mph. The second is what am I supposed to do in Forrest City? Just chill in Walmart for an hour? A better route planner takes me on a much longer route - hours longer to route around Alabama and Mississippi.

I'll be putting most of my daily miles on the Mach-E, but I'll be taking an ICE on vacation for the near future.

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[ChasingCoral]

they've got 200+ mile gaps in some spots (UT, NV) and dead ends in others (Minneapolis, Flagstaff).

A look at where electric cars are popular sort of explains these holes:
https://electrek.co/2020/03/02/ford...kHB_VKrJlAMJ62BvMUJcHai4_yGeyM_pmEPMsO9-W0iL4

 

[Scufflegrit]

A look at where electric cars are popular sort of explains these holes:
https://electrek.co/2020/03/02/ford...kHB_VKrJlAMJ62BvMUJcHai4_yGeyM_pmEPMsO9-W0iL4

Cool map. I wonder if those reservation holders in Alabama have looked at EA's map yet.

 

[cometguy]

Yep, we really need to separate them into two major categories: road trip chargers, and local chargers.

EA is going mostly after the ROAD TRIP market. That's DCFC where people need near-full charges in less than an hour as a stop toward a distant destination. That also includes some chargers in cities too as people on road trips still go through cities, or need fast chargers when they get there on a visit. It makes sense that DCFC charges a premium price because it's for customers that rarely use it and are willing to pay a premium to enable the road trip.

The LOCAL market is people commuting and running around near home (routine daily charging). Most of those people will charge at home (their house, or apartment/condo). Or at their workplace/school/hotel. That's typically L2 charging where workers/customers are parked for many hours.

Some people don't have somewhere they can charge overnight or at work or school. Frankly, those people probably aren't good fits for getting a BEV in the first place, as they'd be stuck relying on retail charging all the time, and scavenging wherever they can along the way. Most people won't put up with that. I don't expect that to be a big share of the market. And I think it would be a mistake to waste a lot of resources building chargers to fit that segment.

EA should continue to focus on ROAD TRIP chargers, IMO. And cities/developers/businesses should focus on getting more private L2 chargers in place in homes, business, and schools reserved for their residents/customers.

I generally agree with what you're saying here.

I think that most people buying BEVs today are NOT doing so to do long road trips, but rather to use them for local commuting, and doing all (or almost all) of their charging at home. Until the public-charging infrastructure is VASTLY better, most BEV owners won't be using their BEVs for long road trips (or only occasionally so). Key problems that I see BEV owners reporting over and over and over again regarding public charging are: (1) not enough charging stations (meaning that one often has to drive out of the way to find one); (2) charging times vary a lot by charging port/"pump", and can be frustrating; (3) all too often, all chargers are taken, requiring longer waits; (4) all too often charging "pumps" are broken or not working; (5) accessing charging pumps can be aggravating because each company owning the pumps has its own access procedure (there should be one single system, or it should be possible to just insert your credit card); (6) charging costs can be exhorbitant (way more than gasoline costs sometimes). When I buy my first BEV, it will be for local commuting only, and charging only from home, at least for the first few years, but I'll still buy one as a daily driver because of the advantages that BEVs give when not worrying about public charging.

Another reason why I'd not want to do road trips in my BEV is that I'd not want to use the high-charging DC pumps because of how they are known to degrade battery life. Yes, I know that doing it only occasionally should not be a big deal, but people who do lots of long-distance road trips in their annual lives are not going to want to deal with all the hassles and degradation that comes from high-intensity public charging.

The big charging issue for now is NOT highway public charging, but rather local public charging -- for those many many drivers who do not have a way to charge at home (i.e., no garage, park on the street in cities, etc.). The masses are not going to buy BEVs until **local** public-charging infrastructure is in place first, so that charging is as easy as going to a gas station in the cities and suburbs and towns. The only way I see this working in cities is having every parking place have a charging station (maybe combined in places with parking meters) -- but this is hugely problematical because of the high costs of installing so many charging stations, unless power companies agree to underwrite the costs in working with cities and towns (and then the charging costs at urban public-charging sites must be kept low for the masses who will possibly not pay more than gas costs for electricity).

 

[ChasingCoral]

The big charging issue for now is NOT highway public charging, but rather local public charging -- for those many many drivers who do not have a way to charge at home (i.e., no garage, park on the street in cities, etc.).

My wife spoke with a friend who has a BEV and parks it at the local organic market to charge at night for this very reason. Of course, that requires a charger within walking distance.

 

[JamieGeek]

I thought Ford had said they will be partnering with more than just EA. Indeed if you use Ford's website to locate a charger map:
https://www.ford.com/buy-site-wide-content/overlays/try-the-tech/
Click on Charging and search for local Ford Pass fast chargers you can find some that aren't EA (the one near me is a ChargePoint charger).

Thus you shouldn't be looking only at EA's chargers. Look at https://www.plugshare.com/ (I say go here because there are far more chargers on Plug Share's map than there are on A better route planner. In addition to that Ford has, in the past, imported Plug Share data into their plugins and apps).

Along those lines:
https://insideevs.com/news/401558/evgo-opens-800th-dc-fast-charging-location/

 

[silverelan]

EA is important because they're the only charging provider that has committed to enabling cross-country travel. All of the other providers seem to be making their presence in just local or regional markets.

@JamieGeek, you are correct. FordPass is intended to consolidate network memberships and payments into a single app. This functionality will enable the seamless plug & charge functionality that every non-Tesla owner is waiting for since billing will simply be on your linked FordPass credit card.

Insofar as # of stations, EVgo and Chargepoint probably have over 1,000 stations between them. Unlike EA's strategy of placing 4+ chargers at a site, EVgo and Chargepoint usually have just 1-3 charging pedestals. Frankly, I will skip 1-stall locations on road trips since I need better redundancy for my trip planning.

 

[JamieGeek]

EA is important because they're the only charging provider that has committed to enabling cross-country travel. All of the other providers seem to be making their presence in just local or regional markets.

@JamieGeek, you are correct. FordPass is intended to consolidate network memberships and payments into a single app. This functionality will enable the seamless plug & charge functionality that every non-Tesla owner is waiting for since billing will simply be on your linked FordPass credit card.

Insofar as # of stations, EVgo and Chargepoint probably have over 1,000 stations between them. Unlike EA's strategy of placing 4+ chargers at a site, EVgo and Chargepoint usually have just 1-3 charging pedestals. Frankly, I will skip 1-stall locations on road trips since I need better redundancy for my trip planning.

You may still make use of them, even if they are only one stall. The Chargepoint app, for example, will let you know if the station is in use or not:

Nonetheless: You can simply check the app as you approach and if available go for it. Sure you can't depend on a 1-stall station without a backup but it will work in a pinch.

 

[ChasingCoral]

Insofar as # of stations, EVgo and Chargepoint probably have over 1,000 stations between them.

Per their websites, EVgo is over 800 and ChargePoint is over 400. Both claim to be adding new stations as well. While they are the two largest, there are others as well (plus EA, of course).

 

[silverelan]

You may still make use of them, even if they are only one stall. The Chargepoint app, for example, will let you know if the station is in use or not:

Nonetheless: You can simply check the app as you approach and if available go for it. Sure you can't depend on a 1-stall station without a backup but it will work in a pinch.

While the app may tell you if the stall is in use, it will not tell you if it's broken/out of order. That's why redundancy is so important.

Tesla owners go to Supercharger stations all the time with say 3 out of 8 stalls available. However, the app doesn't say that those 3 stalls are ICE'd, have a broken charging connector or are otherwise unavailable.

 

[mark360]

While the app may tell you if the stall is in use, it will not tell you if it's broken/out of order. That's why redundancy is so important.

Tesla owners go to Supercharger stations all the time with say 3 out of 8 stalls available. However, the app doesn't say that those 3 stalls are ICE'd, have a broken charging connector or are otherwise unavailable.

Yeah that is a hurdle that must be overcome. Typically, they are good about it as long as someone calls. Again the downside to charging any EV is the possibility of being ICED or stalls INOP.

 

[Billyk24]

Here's EA's progress so far in February of live stations:

Feb 1, 2020 - 398; 77
Feb 6, 2020 - 399; 76
Feb 10, 2020 - 400; 76
Feb 14, 2020 - 401; 74
Feb 20, 2020 - 403; 73
Feb 22, 2020 - 406; 70
Feb 24, 2020 - 407; 68

March 3, 2020-409-72

 

[Dmcerm]

So, the numbers are excellent, however, someone (not me) should make a chart.
It'd be nice to see this chart with Charging Location totals as well as Stalls/'Pumps' Totals.

And just an initial look, seems the EA is in a good spot with 'more' locations of chargers, but Tesla is hitting it out of the park when it comes to more chargers at their locations. EA needs to do a better job at more-chargers-per-location.
However, in the grand scheme of things, Tesla is a very niche car at the moment and in some locations (urban areas with high percents of Teslas) have major issues with chargers being crowded but in other parts of the country, there is rarely that issue.

EA is in a good spot to be increasing their locations/stalls at a much faster rate than 'other EVs' cars are hitting the road (more chargers for less cars, unlike Tesla), so they are making progress and I also find it interesting that 'we' (other EV drivers) 'share' our locations with everyone and yet, us 'little peons' can't use the Tesla Network... and here I thought they wanted to save the planet from the fictitious, existential "crisis" scam of Man-Made Global Warming/Cooling/ClimeChange etc. etc. etc. (I know, I know, some of you believe the hype... we can have another thread on that somewhere else... I won't join, but feel free to complain about me and 'people like that' there, LOL)

But we also have to be aware that this EA growth is do to their Dieselgate scandal and once they fulfill that penalty, I'm not sure if the growth will continue at the same pace. Hopefully it does but.

 

[silverelan]

The number of stalls at EA stations isn't a big deal. They just need enough to ensure redundancy and availability. Four chargers seems appropriate.

Right now it is common for drivers to find out of order chargers but they can still get a charge at EA. However, it's rare for drivers to ever encounter another EV while charging. That'll change once MME and ID.4s hit the road but it'll be awhile before we see massive lines like Tesla does at their Supercharger stations.

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