Why aren't Ford dealers required to have fast chargers?

[Ride_the_lightning]

Makes more sense for gas stations to install them than car dealers. Most dealers should be fine with level 2. A DC fast charger is a $150,000 or more expense.

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[delacruz.c5d]

Dealer is supposed to charge it to 100%. You paid for a full charge.

Agreed. When I took delivery of mine, it was 100% charged when I got in it. Just like a full tank of gas.

DC fast charging is EXTREMELY expensive. The equipment starts in the 5 figure range, and it needs frickin' three phase power, which is nuts.

I think that KIA/Hyundai are requiring the certified EV6/Ioniq5 dealers to have DC Fast chargers. My buddy that is connected to a few dealerships told me that they had to put in a whole different panel for the DC Fast charger in the Kia dealership. Unreal. And I'm betting that those DCFCs that they are putting in are "probably" not the 800V variety that can do a 70%-80% charge in 18 minutes...but I could be wrong.

Either way, I work in IT. Anything over 24V scares the livin' bejeezus outta me. No thank you. I'm surprised that I can handle the EVSE cable without breaking into a sweat...

 

[AZBill]

I have seen several dealerships in the Phoenix area with low end DC chargers. They are usually 24kw units tht actually run on 240V. There is one Ford dealer in Wickenburg that has one and the public can use it. A real DC charger of 50kw or more requires a 480V transformer, that is expensive. There is a new 115kw unit in Goodyear at a GMC dealership that is selling Hummers.

 

[delacruz.c5d]

Here's a really good example of how much electricity is required for DCFC. This is a bit of a crazy example, but this is a EA DCFC in a Walmart parking lot in WI:

The station has 4 CSS plugs. Look at the size of the transformers, service, etc. to the SW in the picture. I'm sure it makes a pleasant humming sound too...

 

[ARK]

I think it is worth remembering, these are still early days in terms of EV adoption. In 10 years, you’d probably pass a handful of DCFC stations between any given place and the nearest Ford dealer.

DCFC costs way too much for this to only be useful to the dealer for next few years before it starts gathering dust.

 

[Cptmorgemaker]

I think it'll be a smart business move for Ford. Just add chargers at all. Dealerships. Ford could kick the dealer some cash and also there's this big thing call government subsidies which are about the only thing pushing EVs I thought it would be a great business move to get you into the dealership and knowing that every dealership would have one. That's awesome as there's so many dealerships being there's not a single charger by me. There's about 6 to 8 dealerships near me.

 

[agdad]

The dealership Ive ordered from has 2 in front and 1 in back by the vehicle prep area ! But the gate is closed and locked at 7pm

 

[val8728]

Probably because when they signed up the dealership it wasn't a requirement. But you'd think they would help at least to verify customer charging problems. Ford should probably cut a deal a deal with their dealers and partially cover the cost.

 

[Kamuelaflyer]

Yeah, I have ALL the apps. Hwy 29 from Saint Paul to Green Bay is a EV dead zone. Wausau WI is about half way and has NOTHING, fast outside of Tesla.
240v is about as good as it gets. Green Bay is also empty for fast chagers, luckily I can stay overnight and get back to fully charged.

As has been pointed out, your car should be at 100% when you pick it up. Remind your dealer that you need that charge.

Also be sure to use both FordPass and A Better Route Planner for pre trip planning. Keep in mind that the fastest route may not be the shortest. If there’s a route to Green Bay with DCFC that is a bit longer, that may be worth your while. In the unlikely event you haven’t already done so, check the EA charging stations along all routes towards your destination. You’ll have at least 250 kWh in charging available as part of your purchase.

The lack of chargers is not as simple as it might sound. Not all Ford dealers are EV dealers. If they’re not, they don’t have to have any EVSE, let alone a DCFC.

DCFC's at Chevy dealers are about 50kW...not exactly fast.

Not only that, some are below 30 kW. Further, the cost of DCFC stations for hardware and installation can easily reach into six figures. Not cheap is an understatement.

 

[Ride_the_lightning]

Agreed. When I took delivery of mine, it was 100% charged when I got in it. Just like a full tank of gas.

DC fast charging is EXTREMELY expensive. The equipment starts in the 5 figure range, and it needs frickin' three phase power, which is nuts.

I think that KIA/Hyundai are requiring the certified EV6/Ioniq5 dealers to have DC Fast chargers. My buddy that is connected to a few dealerships told me that they had to put in a whole different panel for the DC Fast charger in the Kia dealership. Unreal. And I'm betting that those DCFCs that they are putting in are "probably" not the 800V variety that can do a 70%-80% charge in 18 minutes...but I could be wrong.

Either way, I work in IT. Anything over 24V scares the livin' bejeezus outta me. No thank you. I'm surprised that I can handle the EVSE cable without breaking into a sweat...

Yep. I design DCFC projects for a living. 480V 3-phase at a minimum, and many we run 4 or 12kV service from the utility. You start getting more than a few DCFC units and the cost of the unit isn’t even the expensive part. The electrical switchgear and transformers alone can run half a million, plus any upgrades the utility has to do on their lines.

 

[delacruz.c5d]

Yep. I design DCFC projects for a living. 480V 3-phase at a minimum, and many we run 4 or 12kV service from the utility. You start getting more than a few DCFC units and the cost of the unit isn’t even the expensive part. The electrical switchgear and transformers alone can run half a million, plus any upgrades the utility has to do on their lines.

OMG...that's terrifying. I'll stick to my wimpy UTP cat6 copper and fiber optic cables and transceivers, ThankYouVeryMuch.

 

[TheVirtualTim]

I just punched in St. Paul -> Greenbay route (I just did center of town since I don't have any addresses) into ABRP.

Make sure you use the car's in-car nav system to generate your route home. When any route exceeds the car's range it will automatically add charging stops.

There are two Electrify America DC Fast Chargers en-route. In Appleton there is a 24kW charger ... that's not great ... but it's faster than a level 2 AC charger -- especially since most public level 2 AC chargers are not at the 48 amp level that the car supports.

Make sure the car is fully charged and warm before departing. My dealer (I picked up my car a year ago -- next week) kept my car inside in a service bay ... plugged in. If your dealer does that for you then it'll really help the range in the winter cold.

Charging will be a little slower in extreme cold. ALSO... if the batteries get too cold, when you plug in to charge it will divert a lot of energy to the battery heaters ... rather than to charging. This is normal. So don't panic if it doesn't seem like the car is charging very fast at first.

I primarily use seat heater and steering wheel heater ... and set the cabin temp to 65°. But ... dressed for winter ... 65 is actually pretty warm when for winter.

If you are worried about range DO NOT SPEED. Every 5 mph above 50 mph costs something like an extra 7% energy (this isn't just an EV thing ... it's true of ICE cars.)

 

[joes723]

Yep. I design DCFC projects for a living. 480V 3-phase at a minimum, and many we run 4 or 12kV service from the utility. You start getting more than a few DCFC units and the cost of the unit isn’t even the expensive part. The electrical switchgear and transformers alone can run half a million, plus any upgrades the utility has to do on their lines.

yes!!!!!! Love this!!!! People really underestimate the reality that, if the grid/utility doesn’t have the infrastructure in place, you can’t just say “all dealerships must have…”. If there’s no way to deliver the actual power to said charging stations, where’s the incentive for anyone to add a charging station. This is why public/private investments in electric infrastructure is one of the most important initiatives of this time in order to get full EV adoption across America. ??????

 

[SaintPaulMustangMach-E_GT]

I'm not saying that the little dealerships should be force to do this on their own. Just the opposite, Ford should be subsidizing this. Just like Tesla did, the business model worked out for them.

Probably because when they signed up the dealership it wasn't a requirement. But you'd think they would help at least to verify customer charging problems. Ford should probably cut a deal a deal with their dealers and partially cover the cost.

 

[iankellogg]

DCFC's at Chevy dealers are about 50kW...not exactly fast.

don't discount 50kw chargers
thats still an 60% charge in an hour. Thats still way way way better than a 12KW L2 50A charger or a 7kW 30A L2.

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