Charging Rates

[MrClean]

I currently have a GTPE on order. Just received an email from Ford trying to build anticipation/excitement over the car while I wait, touting their charging times:

Are they blissfully unaware of what the competition is doing? Kia/Hyundai/Genesis are getting 60 miles worth of charge in 3-4 minutes. They are literally tens of miles behind the competition, on virtually every metric except current availability, and possibly style, which is subjective. Aim higher, guys. The technology exists.

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[BMT1071]

Are they blissfully unaware of what the competition is doing? Kia/Hyundai/Genesis are getting 60 miles worth of charge in 3-4 minutes. They are literally tens of miles behind the competition, on virtually every metric except current availability, and possibly style, which is subjective. Aim higher, guys. The technology exists.

Not with L2 charging.

 

[JohnnyForensic]

I currently have a GTPE on order. Just received an email from Ford trying to build anticipation/excitement over the car while I wait, touting their charging times:

Are they blissfully unaware of what the competition is doing? Kia/Hyundai/Genesis are getting 60 miles worth of charge in 3-4 minutes. They are literally tens of miles behind the competition, on virtually every metric except current availability, and possibly style, which is subjective. Aim higher, guys. The technology exists.

Yeah, you're confusing level two chargers (like at home) with level three DC fast chargers out in the world.

 

[Tbird]

Yeah, you're confusing level two chargers (like at home) with level three DC fast chargers out in the world.

That is a good home level 2 charging rate. I put in the chargepoint home flex with 60 amp breaker and getting slightly above 30 miles in an hour of charging.

 

[MrClean]

Yeah, you're confusing level two chargers (like at home) with level three DC fast chargers out in the world.

Duh - that was stupid. I actually knew that but forgot. I was just sort of annoyed at the marketing ploy. That’s what I get for typing before thinking…. Thanks for the clarification. I’m brand new to the EV world.

Still, they are behind the curve for charge-times at high-speed chargers, yes?

 

[generaltso]

Still, they are behind the curve for charge-times at high-speed chargers, yes?

Everyone is behind Hyundai’s new E-GMP architecture. It’s an 800v system, so can charge much faster than any 400v system.

 

[BMT1071]

Everyone is behind Hyundai’s new E-GMP architecture. It’s an 800v system, so can charge much faster than any 400v system.

Any idea what the infrastructure currently looks like for 800V charging? I've never looked into it.

 

[generaltso]

Any idea what the infrastructure currently looks like for 800V charging? I've never looked into it.

All those 350kW EA stations support 800v. I think the full 350kW is actually calculated at 1000v.

@OutofSpecKyle did a full charging test of a preproduction Kia EV6 in Europe. It’s interesting to watch.

 

[GoGoGadgetMachE]

Everyone is behind Hyundai’s new E-GMP architecture. It’s an 800v system, so can charge much faster than any 400v system.

the Taycan is also 800V.

 

[generaltso]

the Taycan is also 800V.

Yeah, that’s how it gets to 270kW. But Hyundai’s system will be the first “affordable” option.

 

[GoGoGadgetMachE]

Yeah, that’s how it gets to 270kW. But Hyundai’s system will be the first “affordable” option.

fair.

 

[engnrng]

the Taycan is also 800V.

The 2 year old Wiggins eBull 36,000 lb capacity forklift also requires 800V charging (not available for public roads, though!). I convinced ChargePoint to move up their CPE-250 1000V charger development about 3 years ago, since Wiggins was delivering 18 units to the Port of Stockton and ABB was the only company offering 800V DCFC capabilities back then in the olden days (2018), and they had 6+ month lead times. ChargePoint came through in time.

First unit was placed in service late 2019. Lots of truck and vehicle companies are following my lead now! LOL! The right side of the forklift used to be a diesel fuel tank, now has 2 of the 4 large battery boxes on board behind that sheet metal. The other two are in the center behind the operator. Each battery box weighs over 600 lbs.

 

[AZBill]

All those 350kW EA stations support 800v. I think the full 350kW is actually calculated at 1000v.

All EA chargers support up to 920V, including the 150Kw chargers. The CCS connectors are limited to 500A, but some EA chargers are limited to less than that. The ABB 350KW chargers are limited to 450A and the 150KW chargers are limited to 350A. The Signet chargers used by EA are rated to the full 500A.

For 400V systems, you are generally limited to about 200KW charging, due to the 500A limit, and that assume a 400V nominal battery. An 800V system could pull 350KW with 438A. For the Signet chargers I described above, at 700V and 500A they can produce 350KW, at 920V they would limit to 380A.

 

[SnBGC]

Any idea what the infrastructure currently looks like for 800V charging? I've never looked into it.

The EA out by 101 and Camelback has the capability to charge 800v EVs. I think it's just one of the dispenser units though. That one in the back, right hand side I think.
I think the way it works is the amps are about the same but since the voltage is higher than it can deliver more kW to the vehicle.

There are battery modules for each dispenser unit. They are located behind the enclosure. As best as I can tell, the battery modules are all 460 nominal units so in order to charge an 800V vehicle they need to pair two modules together. Not sure how they accomplish that exactly. There must be some massive contactors inside those modules stored inside the enclosure.

 

[SnBGC]

All EA chargers support up to 920V, including the 150Kw chargers. The CCS connectors are limited to 500A, but some EA chargers are limited to less than that. The ABB 350KW chargers are limited to 450A and the 150KW chargers are limited to 350A. The Signet chargers used by EA are rated to the full 500A.

For 400V systems, you are generally limited to about 200KW charging, due to the 500A limit, and that assume a 400V nominal battery. An 800V system could pull 350KW with 438A. For the Signet chargers I described above, at 700V and 500A they can produce 350KW, at 920V they would limit to 380A.

Helpful info. Thanks!
Doesn't 920v rating indicate around 460v nominal for the battery modules in the enclosure? I know in LVB world.....in order to charge a 12v system you need (prefer) around 14v so I presume it's similar for HVB. Charging an EV with 400v nominal battery would require 10-15% more voltage (in theory anyway...)

Am I close?

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