The myth about electric car owners

[dtbaker61]

Cost is a major factor, to be sure. Maybe the primary one. But I don’t think we can discount that most Americans don’t want to be inconvenienced by even sporadic public charging.

I don’t think many EV enthusiasts realize this, but the reality of public charging is on full display to everyone who makes a quick stop at Target / Walmart, and it ain’t pretty. They see EV owners trying to activate chargers. Broken chargers. And the same nerds sitting in plugged in cars for the duration of their shopping trip. And these normies think “no thanks.”

Until the tech allows public charging to be faster and easier, that’s gonna be a major bar to mass adoption.

I will agree that 'difficulty or lack of DCFC' is slowing adoption.... but I think it is mostly a PERCEIVED problem than a real one that can be solved with education, outreach, and infrastructure improvements.

Typically when I talk to someone who is holding off on buying, their first concern is cost to acquire, second is maximum range, third is lack of DCFC.

My typical responses are questions:

1. Did you know that Base Trim MME is $42k, even without the Fed tax credit (because of chinese batteries)... That's basically the same price I paid after tax credit in 2021....

By the way, did you know that 2 and 3 year old EVs are coming into dealerships off Lease, and you can pick them up for around $25k ?


2. What new ICE SUV would you buy instead? MSRP?

3. What's your longest daily commute/errand distance? (knowing that 90+% of daily driving is <200 miles, the followup response is "great, thats super easy to recharge at home in a couple hours with a L2 charger that costs <$500).

4. The conversation usually leads to "So how much does it cost you to fill up?" Which is highly variable on current price of gas/diesel to compare to, but L2 charging at home always wins. The easy math is
$x.xx gallon of gas gets you about 25 miles in your current SUV, right?
that same 25 miles / 3 = 8 kWhr x $.12/kwhr (in my area) = $.96, or about HALF that if you have solar any are producing your own electricity for about $0.07/kwhr


5. How many times a year to you take a Roadtrip of more than 200 miles? (leading to the next question.... "How many hours to drive between stops to pee and eat/drink?" For me, I find it best for my legs and bladder to stop every two hours or so. Would you agree?)

6. If you stop every 2 hours or so anyway, if you could grab the fast-charge you need in 20 minutes and get back on the road, would that be good?

....Chances are that the "Normie" you are talking to has just convinced themselves to take a closer look at making their next vehicle an EV.

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[SonicBlue]

Of course it's minimal, but it's not nothing. And, sometimes the little things are enough. I sat outside waiting for a table at a restaurant last night and was surrounded by idling cars waiting for their take-away to be brought out. Had they been electric cars I wouldn't have had to move to avoid the exhaust. And, there wouldn't have been exhaust.

And, as you say, it's enabling. We're helping normalize better approaches.

You do what you can, you don't have to be perfect (you were looking for 'vegan', I think.) Keep at it.

If “doing what you can” extends exactly to your level of comfort, then that seems a bit… disingenuous.

And the “it’s minimal, but it’s not nothing” is not a rational approach to policy. Very similar to the “if it saves one life” hysteria during Covid. Everything comes at a cost. We tolerate all manner of things that entail some risk because the cost or alleviating that risk far exceeds the risk itself. You buying an EV is carbon-positive in the short term, and in the long term it’s so minimally carbon-negative as to be pointless.

 

[johnmark]

One could argue that carbon alarmists, and the models they rely upon, have been really bad at projecting into the future - the impact on global temperatures of an increase of a trace gas in the atmosphere from 200ppm to 400ppm. That it point zero four of one percent.

A realist would also acknowledge that full-scale replacing ICE with EV based on wind and solar is pie in the sky fantasy.

These are the conversations I hate ...

1. Predictive climate models have tracked emission increases very closely. They are extremely good at predicting future outcomes.

2. Battery tech enables exponential wind and solar growth (although I have to add that nuclear should play a larger roll). In fact, batteries are now responsible for 10% of our total grid output and growing fast. It's a matter of political will, not technology. The tech is there today.

No one should be arguing these points, because they shouldn't be political. The science and tech are there and well understood.

 

[DYohn]

I didn’t take it as caring about the world is BS, just that the self-congratulatory part was. Maybe I read things funny. ?‍?

You read it correctly.

 

[Mach1E]

The irony of the environmentalists posting on this thread just proving the article wrong. ??

Or is it everyone else posting here proving it right?

 

[67 Stang Convertible]

Why did I go EV:

1. Something new and different.....Cool
2. Love the Smooth Drive and Instant Torque
3. It's a Sporty Looking Car ( I don't have the same angst agains Elon these other people do just felt like his cars looked like tadpoles to me.)
4. Yes, the enviromnent played a roll in my decision.
5. Minimal Maintenance
6. Don't have to go to the Gas Station Weekly.

 

[jdpdx]

My first "car" was an '85 Ranger. It was a standard cab, RWD 4-cylinder that had the most finicky clutch you could imagine. It wouldn't do more than 55MPH unless it was going downhill.

I've always lusted for a tire shredding, snarling small block like the Mustang or the Pontiac GT(Old Holden import) and drool over a Blackwing.

But I have limited space. Kids. Don't want to deal with the maintenance, drama and insurance of a true sports car.

The Mach-E checked all the boxes of comfort, quiet, functional, balls out stoplight launches and it only costs me $10 or whatever to fill up at home.

EV's with 1 pedal mode let me get some of that engine braking feel of a manual transmission without the leg pain I'd have in stop and go traffic at nearly 50 now.

My wife loves how fun it is vs any other vehicle she's owned and it's just a cool car.

It's our first car in a lot of cars owned that was one where emotions and practicality were both able to have a seat at the table.

 

[Sikkun]

The ability of our individual choices to impact the environment are so minuscule, that we might as well not make them.

Times 8 billion people.

 

[Jerrytball]

People get that stereotype only because it’s true for the “loudest” EV drivers.

Kinda where a lot of stereotypes start.

Helen Reddy EV drivers lol

 

[Jerrytball]

Why did I go EV:

1. Something new and different.....Cool
2. Love the Smooth Drive and Instant Torque
3. It's a Sporty Looking Car ( I don't have the same angst agains Elon these other people do just felt like his cars looked like tadpoles to me.)
4. Yes, the enviromnent played a roll in my decision.
5. Minimal Maintenance
6. Don't have to go to the Gas Station Weekly.

Pretty much all six of your reasons are my reasons. Number four didn’t really do it for me, but I had just ordered a loaded out California special Mustang GT gas version and because it took two months for it to start to be built. I accidentally wanted to drive the electric version of the car and I’m like wow, I’ve driven plenty And own many mustangs and this was just crazy fun because one I love golf carts and this is kind of like a hopped up golf cart to me.

 

[HuntingPudel]

My first "car" was an '85 Ranger. It was a standard cab, RWD 4-cylinder that had the most finicky clutch you could imagine. It wouldn't do more than 55MPH unless it was going downhill.

I've always lusted for a tire shredding, snarling small block like the Mustang or the Pontiac GT(Old Holden import) and drool over a Blackwing.
<SNIP>

My first car was a 472 powered Cadillac. ?? I actually bought my first new car (my '79 T/A) before that, but pulled the engine in order to install a Pontiac "regular block" (there's no such thing as a Pontiac "small block") high-compression 455 in it (along with pulling the suspension to really make it handle). Mod after mod on the T/A since then. ??

I still lust after a CTS-V wagon. That might get me out of the Blazer. Anyhow, keep drooling and make the dream come true. ??

 

[Jerrytball]

My first car was a 472 powered Cadillac. ?? I actually bought my first new car (my '79 T/A) before that, but pulled the engine in order to install a Pontiac "regular block" (there's no such thing as a Pontiac "small block") high-compression 455 in it (along with pulling the suspension to really make it handle). Mod after mod on the T/A since then. ??

I still lust after a CTS-V wagon. That might get me out of the Blazer. Anyhow, keep drooling and make the dream come true. ??

you know the other day I had to stop and think about it and I’m like wait, do they even make Pontiac anymore lol. Then I just realize the other day I don’t see a lot of hornets on the road and someone said yeah cause that’s electric car and I’m like what I didn’t realize that was electric car and I guess they don’t sell very well.

 

[HuntingPudel]

you know the other day I had to stop and think about it and I’m like wait, do they even make Pontiac anymore lol. Then I just realize the other day I don’t see a lot of hornets on the road and someone said yeah cause that’s electric car and I’m like what I didn’t realize that was electric car and I guess they don’t sell very well.

GM let C#@vy turn Pontiac into a cookie-cutter division. Then they axed Pontiac for lack of sales in 2010. ?‍?

 

[jdpdx]

If I want to get really mushy on the environmental aspect of EV's... I'm paying for renewable energy to my house. A lot of my power is from the Columbia River.

Energy to EV's is just going to get greener and more sustainable over time. And you don't have to do anything as a car owner except advocate for it as a utility policy. Then everyone benefits from cleaner energy immediately.

Having a ton of autonomous ICE generators out there are only going to be as clean as the day they are made. Generally speaking...

You can't just make an ICE motor immediately a more sustainable or clean burning vehicle.

EV 's start out zero emissions (I can run it in a garage) and the power that just goes in the just gets better.

I'm not going to handwave precious metals and the materials needed to make an EV. Or their weight and added impact on roads. That's a thing.

But I have a lot less guilt when I mash the pedal on this than some far more obnoxious and gas guzzling alternative.

I just want to go fast and giggle. I'm not there to be a dick to everyone else.

 

[dtbaker61]

The irony of the environmentalists posting on this thread just proving the article wrong. ??

Or is it everyone else posting here proving it right?

interest may be 'sparked' by environmental concern.... but in my experience as an EV advocate and years selling/installing Solar, the final decision for EVs and Solar always boils down to whether or not the investment is financially sound for the individual.

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