What’s the point of 350kw DC fast chargers?

[gnaark]

This might be a noob question but are there EVs out there that charge at 350kw?

or is that EA future proofing their infra

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[generaltso]

It's mostly for future proofing, but the Porsche Taycan can charge at up to 270kW today with it's 800v architecture. The Hyundai Ioniq 5 and Kia EV6 will charge even faster.

 

[TheCats]

This might be a noob question but are there EVs out there that charge at 350kw?

or is that EA future proofing their infra

The Taycan currently seems to have the highest production charging rate at a nominal 225 or 270 kW.

Current Teslas nominally accept 250 kW at Tesla v3 Superchargers, with expectation that the next generation Superchargers will enable up-rating the new Model S and X.

Others have claimed higher power in near-future cars (or "coming next year since 2016").

Various trucks in early stage testing will accept higher power but most seem to anticipate multiple cord sets.

 

[ChasingCoral]

I have found that the Mach E peaks at ups to 160kW during the first few minutes of charging at a 350kW charger. It only peaks at around 140kW when charging at a 150kW charger. The 350kW only provides a significant charging improvement during zap-and-dash sessions. Otherwise, the 150kW chargers is fine.

 

[Maquis]

The 350kW only provides a significant charging improvement during zap-and-dash sessions.

"Zap-and-Dash" - you should trademark that!

 

[KAustin]

I have found that the Mach E peaks at ups to 160kW during the first few minutes of charging at a 350kW charger. It only peaks at around 140kW when charging at a 150kW charger. The 350kW only provides a significant charging improvement during zap-and-dash sessions. Otherwise, the 150kW chargers is fine.

I do remember one of the Ford people saying something like "what's the point of all this wire if we couldn't allow faster charging." Hopefully, it will improve.

 

[generaltso]

I do remember one of the Ford people saying something like "what's the point of all this wire if we couldn't allow faster charging." Hopefully, it will improve.

Yeah, but it was later pointed out that he could have meant it as "why would we put a bunch of extra wire in the MME if we're not using it?", meaning they didn't. He never clarified any further, so we really don't know.

 

[RyZt]

I have found that the Mach E peaks at ups to 160kW during the first few minutes of charging at a 350kW charger. It only peaks at around 140kW when charging at a 150kW charger. The 350kW only provides a significant charging improvement during zap-and-dash sessions. Otherwise, the 150kW chargers is fine.

The 150kW EA chargers max amp is 350A. That means you can get at most 140kW at 400V. The 350kW EA chargers max amp is 500A. That means you can get at most 200kW at 400V.

are there EVs out there that charge at 350kw?

Current and future 800V EVs. Available or announced are: Taycan, Ioniq 5, EV6.

 

[EV Lab]

The CCS standard actually describes the highest current as 350A, with a max pack voltage of 1000V, hence the 350kW limit. Anything beyond 350A will require cooling of the charge cable all the way to the off-board charger. 350A x 800V is 280kW, so that explains why 270kW-ish is the highest possible in today's best EVs. You're also not going to be putting max current into the pack when it's near the top of charge, so really 250kW or so is the highest realistic number that can be achieved.

1000V is not really realistic at the moment for other system level reasons... 800V-ish is the current state of the art.

 

[DBC]

The 350kW EA chargers max amp is 500A.

My understanding is that, as @EV Lab indicates, the CCS standard maxes out at 1000v and 350A.

In any event, how long you can maintain the charge rate is more critical than the peak rate, the latter not being all that important.

 

[EV Lab]

My understanding is that, as @EV Lab indicates, the CCS standard maxes out at 1000v and 350A.

In any event, how long you can maintain the charge rate is more critical than the peak rate, the latter not being all that important.

It's all about the area under the curve...

 

[mixduptransistor]

It's all about the area under the curve...

Not necessarily. Most people will not be charging starting at zero, and won't be charging to 100%, so the curve being wide but short is worse than it being narrow but tall in the middle. The same area under the curve can be much better or much worse, depending on the shape because of the nature of fast charging during a road trip

 

[RyZt]

My understanding is that, as @EV Lab indicates, the CCS standard maxes out at 1000v and 350A.

In any event, how long you can maintain the charge rate is more critical than the peak rate, the latter not being all that important.

I found the 500A rating written on a placard in the corner of a 350kW EA charger. Also, Mach E pulling 156kW from 350kW EA charger is proof that the charger can go over 350A.

 

[DBC]

I found the 500A rating written on a placard in the corner of a 350kW EA charger. Also, Mach E pulling 156kW from 350kW EA charger is proof that the charger can go over 350A

The SAE standard is 350A at 500V and 1000V. Note that even the lower limit is 175 kW.

If you are referring to the Signet Chargers, both the input and output are rated at 500A and 200-920VDC, but that's not the standard.

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