Ford Mobile Charger and 14-50 -- GFCI

[Maquis]

The green wire goes to a strip inside the panel where all the other green wires go which I assume to be the ground "bus" you're talking about. I think that strip is grounded but actually I don't know where it goes because I'm scared of getting close to the inside of our 200 amp service panel and I don't want to get electrocuted. The ground rod outside is is connected to a bar that goes inside the service into the house and I cannot see how it is connected to my electric service coming in. It passed two separate building code inspections so I know it was done correctly. The wires to the 14-50 outlet are 2 hot wires and 1 neutral wire and 1 green ground wire. Anyhow, it was done correctly according to code here in Frankfort Illinois. The 50 amp GFCI breaker WAS very expensive too.

Sounds like it is wired properly. I intrepreted your original description of the install incorrectly - sorry.
I'd rather it be this way - get clarification that it's OK, rather than take a chance on someone getting hurt in case it wasn't right.

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[OttawaGuy]

That is an interesting extra layer to the issue. No, it won't bother the charger at all because the circuit doesn't push 50A down, it just allows the charger to pull anything it wants up to 50A before tripping the breaker. The charger won't care at all. It could be on a 100A breaker/wire/plug and it would be just as fine because it only pulls 32A.

However, a 40A breaker instead of a 50A could add a little extra protection in case the charger went haywire and tried to draw 43A or something and start to melt down. A 40A breaker would trip, while a 50A would keep the juice flowing.

But that's a pretty quirky situation. It would require a serious malfunction of the EVSE, and a weird one that would drawn more than 40A but less than 50A. More likely, such an overdraw would probably be a short that would push it over 50A too, and still trip.

Totally agree

And it might just be a way to reduce the cost on his side

But that's all fine for me

He was asking a really cheap price for all he did

 

[Illinibird]

Sounds like it is wired properly. I intrepreted your original description of the install incorrectly - sorry.
I'd rather it be this way - get clarification that it's OK, rather than take a chance on someone getting hurt in case it wasn't right.

That's OK I'd rather check things out and be safe. This topic always generates a lot of discussion and disagreement as to which way the outlet should be installed. I am not an electrician so I don't know personally but I have done some reading especially about the building codes. This topic also generates a lot of different interpretations. I came away from it that local code trumps national code but you wouldn't think that is true (I would think the opposite) and I'm not sure myself. At the end of the day, my dedicated 50 amp circuit to my garage gets the job done with no tripping and it's done correctly as far as I know.

 

[dbsb3233]

Totally agree

And it might just be a way to reduce the cost on his side

But that's all fine for me

He was asking a really cheap price for all he did

Yep. Certainly nothing wrong with doing it that way. I assume the outlet will only be used for that EVSE. Odds of you needing to plug in a welder or a friend's EVSE that goes over 32A are presumably small. And if you ever went with a bigger EVSE in the future, it's easy and cheap to swap out the breaker (as you said). They're only like $20 or something (non-GFCI).

 

[BMT1071]

Totally agree

And it might just be a way to reduce the cost on his side

But that's all fine for me

He was asking a really cheap price for all he did

Just checked the Home Depot site and the 40A and 50A Square D breakers are the same price. Maybe he had a 40A on hand that he wanted to get rid of? It seems weird to run the proper gauge wire and then use a lower rated breaker. If it works for you, that's all that matters.

 

[Maquis]

Just checked the Home Depot site and the 40A and 50A Square D breakers are the same price. Maybe he had a 40A on hand that he wanted to get rid of? It seems weird to run the proper gauge wire and then use a lower rated breaker. If it works for you, that's all that matters.

That's normal....20 through 50A, 2 pole are all the same price.
Availability has been an issue, but it seems to be getting better.

 

[OttawaGuy]

That's normal....20 through 50A, 2 pole are all the same price.
Availability has been an issue, but it seems to be getting better.

You're right about that, a few weeks/months ago getting a new house wired was become a challenge for many electricians!

I guess mine had some 40A on hand andknew that I was going to use it as a back up for a 32A charger, so he threw that one in. If ever I need to have a 50A breaker, it will be an easy swap.

Right now the 14-50 outlet is on the same circuit as my 48A hardwired charger. It's there in case something doesn't work and I need to use the mobile charger. And in the future it could become handy if I have a 2nd EV and install another charger in load sharing!

 

[Illinibird]

You're right about that, a few weeks/months ago getting a new house wired was become a challenge for many electricians!

I guess mine had some 40A on hand andknew that I was going to use it as a back up for a 32A charger, so he threw that one in. If ever I need to have a 50A breaker, it will be an easy swap.

Right now the 14-50 outlet is on the same circuit as my 48A hardwired charger. It's there in case something doesn't work and I need to use the mobile charger. And in the future it could become handy if I have a 2nd EV and install another charger in load sharing!

What gauge wire did you use for the 48 amp charger? My electrician used #6 gauge wire for my Ford Mobile Charger (50 amp CGFI breaker as per Ford) for 2 hot wires and 1 neutral wire; #8 gauge for green ground wire. I would like to know just in case I want to hard wire a 48 amp charger in the future. Would I have to run an even larger diameter conduit? Larger gauge wires (#4 gauge)? Larger breaker (60 amp)?

 

[ZuleMME]

To be safe and in the rules for 80% of the rated capacity you really need 4awg wire for 48A. Sucks, but 6awg is only rated to 55A (you need 60A at 100% to give 48A at 80%). Though temperature adjusted (per NEC tables) and in proper conditions (local code allowing) *SOME* installations might pass inspection with 6awg. ensure a licensed contractor makes this call or the insurance company will eat you alive when it burns to the ground!

 

[OttawaGuy]

What gauge wire did you use for the 48 amp charger? My electrician used #6 gauge wire for my Ford Mobile Charger (50 amp CGFI breaker as per Ford) for 2 hot wires and 1 neutral wire; #8 gauge for green ground wire. I would like to know just in case I want to hard wire a 48 amp charger in the future. Would I have to run an even larger diameter conduit? Larger gauge wires (#4 gauge)? Larger breaker (60 amp)?

48A charger is on a 60A breaker and that requires a 6AWG wire (unless your building code is different where you live).

If the distance is far between the breaker and the charger, you might need to go to 4AWG

 

[OttawaGuy]

To be safe and in the rules for 80% of the rated capacity you really need 4awg wire for 48A. Sucks, but 6awg is only rated to 55A (you need 60A at 100% to give 48A at 80%). Though temperature adjusted (per NEC tables) and in proper conditions (local code allowing) *SOME* installations might pass inspection with 6awg. ensure a licensed contractor makes this call or the insurance company will eat you alive when it burns to the ground!

6AWG is rated for 65A if I'm not mistaken. The 80% rule is between the breaker and the usage. In my case the 6AWG is what is required on a 60A circuit

 

[Illinibird]

48A charger is on a 60A breaker and that requires a 6AWG wire

So I'd only need to change my breaker then since I already have #6 gauge wire. Good to know.

 

[OttawaGuy]

So I'd only need to change my breaker then since I already have #6 gauge wire. Good to know.

Yes, unless the distance between breaker and charger is like 150ft! Then you would need 4AWG.

Just wondering why there's a different size for your ground, didn't he used a "all in one electrical wire"?

 

[Illinibird]

6AWG is rated for 65A if I'm not mistaken. The 80% rule is between the breaker and the usage. In my case the 6AWG is what is required on a 60A circuit

OK, a different opinion here. Back to the drawing board! To run #4 gauge wire I'd need to run a conduit even larger in diameter than what I'm using now which would mean the job essentially has to be redone. I don't think the time saved charging will ever pay for the cost of another installation.

 

[Illinibird]

Yes, unless the distance between breaker and charger is like 150ft! Then you would need 4AWG.

Just wondering why there's a different size for your ground, didn't he used a "all in one electrical wire"?

I don't know what "all in one" is but no, each wire was on it's own spool.

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