Free Public Level 2 Charging Etiquette

[Deleted member 16048]

You mean like ChargePoint?

More like a consulting company that configures and manages their EV charging installations. ChargePoint only supplies the tools, but most companies have their IT department manage the platform and configuration. Most also need consulting of the design, location, and vendor to select to install them. (Like which company to purchase the chargers themselves from ect.)

It just seems like there is an opportunity here as companies usually have people who are not EV owners making the decisions without having any idea on how it all works.

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[Logal727]

The audacity of the Tesla guy to use the free L2 instead of the SC is what really gets me. What an a-hole

 

[Mirak]

Here's how I view it:

• Follow the rules that are posted (if there are any)
• If no rules posted, use the charger but try to be mindful of others. IE Don't charge for 8 hours at shopping center because your work is across the street.
• Never unplug someone else with few exceptions (if they are at 100% or you can verify they exceeded a posted limit)

Hopefully karma will take care of people that abuse free charging or unplug others. We have a hard enough time dealing with people that park in handicap spots because they "were just running in."

I agree. My three rules for using free L2 are:

1. Is it really free for public use? Check the signs. And if it is obviously intended for shoppers don't tie it up during shopping hours because you work nearby.
2. Don't stay plugged in after you're done charging.
3. Don't use it more than once per week.

As for the etiquette of unplugging someone or being unplugged, I have two rules:

1. If a car is finished charging, it is fair game to be unplugged. If it isn't finished charging, it isn't fair game. The idea of having "an emergency" where your need for L2 outweighs someone else is stupid. If you've really got an emergency, call a tow to a DCFC.
2. It is never worth confronting someone who is being a jackhole. Let it go. You're squabbling over a couple dollars' worth of electricity.

 

[DevSecOps]

- No charger should be free, ever
- All stations should have idle fees
- Cameras should be used to ticket non charging offenders.

Problem solved.

 

[Logal727]

- No charger should be free, ever
- All stations should have idle fees
- Cameras should be used to ticket non charging offenders.

Problem solved.

So you're saying signs don't do anything?

 

[Deleted member 16048]

- No charger should be free, ever
- All stations should have idle fees
- Cameras should be used to ticket non charging offenders.

Problem solved.

I disagree that chargers shouldn't be free. You can make them whatever you want to attract people to them and compete for business.

However, yes they should all have idle fees. This will definitely deter abuse.

Cameras though aren't legal for ticketing in some states so that wouldn't work everywhere. (Like here in MN. Minneapolis learned the hard way after installing red light cameras for millions of dollars just for the state supreme court to rule them illegal.) In states that do allow it, it could be an option but would have to look into the legality of it on private property. Could create some issues there.

But let's face it, at the end of the day, it's hard to enforce idle fees if someone unplugs but doesn't move the car and blocks the space. Those are the real EV-holes and should get ticketed somehow.

 

[DevSecOps]

I disagree that chargers shouldn't be free. You can make them whatever you want to attract people to them and compete for business.

While I agree with you that businesses shouldn't be mandated to do anything, the problem is with the idiots, not the businesses. People will plug into free charging at 90%, because, well, it's free. Charging a fee higher than their utility might deter that.

Unfortunately, based on many many experiences, there is no etiquette among a very large percentage of EV owners. Selfishness over common courtesy is the norm. Most of the scenarios discussed here aren't even patrons of business, they are just leeching and going elsewhere.

 

[Logal727]

While I agree with you that businesses shouldn't be mandated to do anything, the problem is with the idiots, not the businesses. People will plug into free charging at 90%, because, well, it's free. Charging a fee higher than their utility might deter that.

Unfortunately, based on many many experiences, there is no etiquette among a very large percentage of EV owners. Selfishness over common courtesy is the norm. Most of the scenarios discussed here aren't even patrons of business, they are just leeching and going elsewhere.

People will stay plugged into the ones at Disney World for 12 hours all day at 90% and those aren't even free. Good parking spots though.

 

[DevSecOps]

People will stay plugged into the ones at Disney World for 12 hours all day at 90% and those aren't even free. Good parking spots though.

Yes, I forgot in my list

- placement should be far away from entrances

 

[alexgorod]

Does it matter whether the charger is free or not? Is it a different set of rules?

 

[DevSecOps]

Does it matter whether the charger is free or not? Is it a different set of rules?

No, same rules, different mentality.

Would you rather pay higher than gas prices for charging plus idle fees if you leave it there, vs home charging (pay scenario)?

Vs

Free charging and no idle fees = insert favorite word for inconsiderate people.

 

[Deleted member 16048]

While I agree with you that businesses shouldn't be mandated to do anything, the problem is with the idiots, not the businesses. People will plug into free charging at 90%, because, well, it's free. Charging a fee higher than their utility might deter that.

Unfortunately, based on many many experiences, there is no etiquette among a very large percentage of EV owners. Selfishness over common courtesy is the norm. Most of the scenarios discussed here aren't even patrons of business, they are just leeching and going elsewhere.

It's true, it might deter them, but then what's the point in even having charging? If they are at 90% and want to top off, let them if they were first. Once they hit the 100% mark, time to hit their wallet. That's all I'm saying. It's a way to social engineer it, and minimize abuse.

Yeah, there are a lot of people that just leech, but if I was a business owner, just having them on property and that chance of them stoping in would be worth it. Having a chance is better than not having one at all.

I almost wish that in order to charge at a station you have to pass an etiquette test before you activate it. With having to use apps on a lot of chargers to activate them, it could be an easy little thing to add before an account is created. But of course, those who don't care will always just cheat on it or ignore it.

So you're saying signs don't do anything?

Love this, since there is so much truth. Common sense and reading just aren't a thing anymore. :-/

 

[alexgorod]

No, same rules, different mentality.

Would you rather pay higher than gas prices for charging plus idle fees if you leave it there, vs home charging (pay scenario)?

Vs

Free charging and no idle fees = insert favorite word for inconsiderate people.

I guess I'm looking at it from a different angle - if I need a charge to get back and/or avoid DCFC on my way and see a plugged car that is fully or almost fully charged - how bad will it be to unplug it? Will I be upset if someone unplugs me if I'm 80% charged? I guess, if it's not enough to drive to my destination, I will be regarding if it's free or not.

If I don't really need any and use the free charging because it's available and I can use it while doing something, and someone unplugs me, my only concern will be if they did it right and didn't break the port.

 

[dmastro]

Yes, I forgot in my list

- placement should be far away from entrances

As an owner of commercial EV chargers, I'd rather have the chargers located in highly visible areas with lots of foot traffic to prevent vandalism.

Also (and probably more importantly), power tends to be closer to your buildings, and it's expensive to start running power out to the extreme reaches of parking lots.

There's also code compliance to consider, including ADA path of travel (so now I need to create a path of travel all the way across my parking lot)

 

[DevSecOps]

As an owner of commercial EV chargers, I'd rather have the chargers located in highly visible areas with lots of foot traffic to prevent vandalism.

Also (and probably more importantly), power tends to be closer to your buildings, and it's expensive to start running power out to the extreme reaches of parking lots.

There's also code compliance to consider, including ADA path of travel (so now I need to create a path of travel all the way across my parking lot)

Then I hope as an owner you enforce the rules and tow violators. Otherwise you're contributing to the problem of people using chargers as convenient parking spots.

There's many ways to address the problems, but owners enforcing the rules is typically something that doesn't happen in my experience.

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