Keep it or return my MachE 2021 FE?

[Mjtee2]

My 2021 First Edition has just over 5,000 miles and I bought it after the options lease ended. Unfortunately, my frustration at not getting software updates and on going software “bugs” has gotten me the point of seriously considering moving on. It is really too bad because I really like the car . . .

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[UW2]

Is your financing an Options purchase or a lease? It makes a difference in what I’d recommend.

If a lease does it have a buyout? If an Options, what is the interest rate?

Options at 4.99%

 

[ChuckA]

Options at 4.99%

If you like the FE and it hasn’t had a lot of problems, you can refinance through Ford Credit @ 4.99% for 36 months. Does the features of the new MME outweigh the cost if a do-over?

 

[Blue highway]

1 of those studies are more than 9 years old, 1 of them is over 5 years old. Something a bit more recent would be nice. At least the last link is only a year old.

.... those are the studies mentioned in the article I posted... Point being it may not be recent, but it is not made up facts... like ... you know... some posts.

 

[devmach-e]

.... those are the studies mentioned in the article I posted... Point being it may not be recent, but it is not made up facts... like ... you know... some posts.

I know that things have improved in the heat-pump space, and would like to see studies that provide real data showing that. I know that the heat-pump installed at my house works well, but I'm not in an area that sees sub-freezing temperatures. I have to rely on the reddit posts of heat-pump users to verify the ability of heat-pumps to handle -20F weather easily.

 

[Alan]

I know that things have improved in the heat-pump space, and would like to see studies that provide real data showing that. I know that the heat-pump installed at my house works well, but I'm not in an area that sees sub-freezing temperatures. I have to rely on the reddit posts of heat-pump users to verify the ability of heat-pumps to handle -20F weather easily.

I would expect the Mach-e heat pump to work very well between 20F to 60F, and the further you go below 30F the more resistive heat will be added to support the heat pump until the heat pump is virtually useless below some sub-zero temp and you will have all resistive heat with the same efficiency of a non-heat-pump equipped Mach-e below that. That is, it will help very much in all but the extreme cases where it will not help at all.

 

[Mach1E]

.... those are the studies mentioned in the article I posted... Point being it may not be recent, but it is not made up facts... like ... you know... some posts.

Unless you have a study on the exact heat pump used in the 2025 Mach E, this is all speculation at this point.

Either way, heat pumps being more efficient at certain temperatures isn’t “made up,” it’s the physics on how they work. It’s basically an air conditioner ran backwards. And to pump heat, there has to be heat to pump.

There is a good reason why heat pumps have “back up” resistance heaters for when it’s really cold.
https://www.estesair.com/blog/at-what-temperature-does-a-heat-pump-quit-working-efficiently

Do we know if the 2025 Mach E has a resistance heater in conjunction with the heat pump? If so, there wouldn’t be much savings at low low temp.

Either that, or we might just have a hard time staying warm in sub zero weather.

Minus 30 degrees in Minnesota is a real thing for some people.

 

[devmach-e]

Unless you have a study on the exact heat pump used in the 2025 Mach E, this is all speculation at this point.

Either way, heat pumps being more efficient at certain temperatures isn’t “made up,” it’s the physics on how they work. It’s basically an air conditioner ran backwards. And to pump heat, there has to be heat to pump.

There is a good reason why heat pumps have “back up” resistance heaters for when it’s really cold.
https://www.estesair.com/blog/at-what-temperature-does-a-heat-pump-quit-working-efficiently

Do we know if the 2025 Mach E has a resistance heater in conjunction with the heat pump? If so, there wouldn’t be much savings at low low temp.

Either that, or we might just have a hard time staying warm in sub zero weather.

Minus 30 degrees in Minnesota is a real thing for some people.

Based on the comments I see in r/heatpumps in Reddit, most cold-climate heat pumps are very effective down to -20F, and don't require the use of the backup electric heat strips, or an alternate fuel source like gas/propane/oil. The link you posted claims that at 25F to 30F they lose efficiency. That is true to a certain degree, but not nearly as much as you might think. I have a non-cold climate heat pump that has a COP of 3.35 at 47F. That drops to 2.61 at 17F, and 1.9 at 5F. Anything above 1 is more efficient than just electric heat strips.

I do agree that we don't know enough about the specific heat-pump being used in the Mach-E. I don't know if it is possible to lookup the COP for the heat pumps used in EVs right now. That would be a good starting point. I suspect that that data hasn't been published.

 

[Alan]

Based on the comments I see in r/heatpumps in Reddit, most cold-climate heat pumps are very effective down to -20F, and don't require the use of the backup electric heat strips, or an alternate fuel source like gas/propane/oil. ...

I suspect the comments about heat pumps working well down to -20F without backup support refer to home/office units that are multi-stage units, and most certainly not applicable to single stage units used in EVs. Single stage heat pumps are able, at most, to raise the temp 40F, which means an ambient 20F with an EV heat pump and no resistive heat will leave the cabin at no more than 20F. I doubt any auto heat pump is going to get more than 30F heating, as the loss in efficiency above that makes resistive heating supplement nearly as efficient and much less expensive.

 

[UW2]

If you like the FE and it hasn’t had a lot of problems, you can refinance through Ford Credit @ 4.99% for 36 months. Does the features of the new MME outweigh the cost if a do-over?

Good point. I should keep it.

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