Mercedes-Benz Announces Subscription-Based ‘Acceleration On-Demand’

[SWO]

This is the key to your argument. In traditional vehicles you got what you bought, end of story. If you wanted something else you went with a 3rd party and you paid for it.

People assume because they have a connected vehicle that they are entitled to everything developed new, for free. These subscriptions actually help keep the car fresh. Some things I think are a bit petty, like heated seat subscriptions, but I think subscriptions in general are gonna become the norm.

Flipping a switch that decreases the values in a table controlling motor output is analogous to subscription seat heaters. They are spending more developer time on the subscription software than the actual changes to the vehicle.

Bringing up BlueCruise or satellite service is a strawman, nobody is making that argument because there are obvious costs for the provider associated with both.

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[cjljr41]

Want to go to work? Ever wish your turn signals would work? Just upgrade to our "turn on stuff your car already has" subscription service.

 

[DevSecOps]

Flipping a switch that decreases the values in a table controlling motor output is analogous to subscription seat heaters. They are spending more developer time on the subscription software than the actual changes to the vehicle.

Bringing up BlueCruise or satellite service is a strawman, nobody is making that argument because there are obvious costs for the provider associated with both.

It's their car, they can do what they want. If you don't like it, don't buy it. I think the future will be a single electric motor that has software limits to unlock different performance values. This would make EVs cheaper.

There are plenty of people who argue over BC subscriptions. This forum is full of those conversations. Putting it aside, you realize that if you use the built in navigation you're using a subscription right? I've never owned a previous vehicle where that was a subscription. DCFC through Ford is using a subscription.

Either way, you're missing the point. These are upgrades, just like if you purchased an ICE vehicle with a slightly different tuned engine, which can also be purely software. MFGs do this quite often and have been for years. This is no difference, you just can't wrap your head around "subscription" when there's a one time fee option as well. This would actually give people the option to have a faster car when they want it, and not pay nearly the same amount when they deactivate it.

I said previously in this thread, I don't really agree with the heated seats being a sub, but engine tuning is nothing new.

 

[TGIF]

This is the same as EVERY manufacturer with a turbo car that has less boost on some models and more boost (and horsepower) on others for more money.

Why charge more $$ for more horsepower? Because they can.

And I for one would gladly pay.

Not sure where people get the idea that software should be free.

The disconnect seems to come in the fact that the extra HP is already in the car. It just feels different from ordering a car with a bigger engine. I suspect it’s something people will become more comfortable with over time, which is probably what the manufacturers are counting on.

 

[KevinS]

There are plenty of people who argue over BC subscriptions. This forum is full of those conversations. Putting it aside, you realize that if you use the built in navigation you're using a subscription right? I've never owned a previous vehicle where that was a subscription. DCFC through Ford is using a subscription.

This is why phone projection systems such as CarPlay and Android Auto are so contentious right now. It mucks with their ability to make you buy a subscription for a manufacturer-branded experience.

I expect every subscription service "trial" I'm using will lapse without renewal. For my area, BlueCruise is little more than a party trick since it's only available on a single stretch of road for about 7 miles. And, I haven't even touched the free 250kW of charging since I bought the car in October 2021.

The advantage of being older is that I've owned many cars without any of these things, so I can get along without them without feeling that I'm being deprived. An electric car with hand crank roll-down windows would be just fine by me. ?

 

[2021-MMEx-RT1]

So I understand if you purchase the FSD in a Tesla, the Steering wheel is a subscription add-on.

/I mean, with FSD, you don't really need a steering wheel right?

 

[SWO]

It's their car, they can do what they want. If you don't like it, don't buy it.

I think everyone realizes this. Nobody here is saying Mercedes should be banned.

I think the future will be a single electric motor that has software limits to unlock different performance values. This would make EVs cheaper.

If you think manufacturers are doing this to make less money, I'd strongly disagree.

There are plenty of people who argue over BC subscriptions. This forum is full of those conversations. Putting it aside, you realize that if you use the built in navigation you're using a subscription right? I've never owned a previous vehicle where that was a subscription.

BC is a level 2 autonomous driving system. It uses mapped roads so it's common sense that there will be associated maintenance costs. Maybe there's someone else arguing against BC subscriptions

Either way, you're missing the point. These are upgrades, just like if you purchased an ICE vehicle with a slightly different tuned engine, which can also be purely software. MFGs do this quite often and have been for years. This is no difference, you just can't wrap your head around "subscription" when there's a one time fee option as well. This would actually give people the option to have a faster car when they want it, and not pay nearly the same amount when they deactivate it.

I said previously in this thread, I don't really agree with the heated seats being a sub, but engine tuning is nothing new.

I get it - and I will add that having a one-time purchase option is a substantive difference which I recognize. I think where we disagree is the nuance of your characterization of this as "tuning". If anything, I think they are de-tuning and making folks pay extra for what they've engineered to begin with. This isn't analogous to a tuner pouring through A/F ratio and fuel / timing tables trying to tune an engine to peak power without melting pistons or cats. I would bet that if you looked at the management software (which you can't, because Mercedes hates you), the changes are very simple.

 

[SWO]

I will go so far as to say that I would possibly be ok with a 1-time upgrade fee for more performance if the company was able to articulate that it was required due to a perceived reduction in reliability of the powertrain over the course of the warranty period. IE, mean time between failures of "X/Y/Z" has decreased.....

 

[Mach1E]

Can you give me an example of two vehicle models with significantly different horsepower and the same part number for the long block? I'm drawing a blank.

Outside of the obvious exact replica examples from Tesla and Volvo offering more hp for a fee…..

My last car had an LS3 and Chevy offers the identical engine with various states of tune.

BMW has been bumping up the boost on their engines in various versions (comp models for example). Sometimes in conjunction with minor hardware improvements, sometimes they just bump the boost to get more power for the next model year.

Actually every single factory turbo car ever made was limited from the factory by the computer in terms of boost.

Electric cars are obviously much easier. Power is given or limited by the manufacturer. None of us are getting “full power.” And the manufacturers know we are willing to pay for more.

I’m completely fine with this.

 

[Mach1E]

I will go so far as to say that I would possibly be ok with a 1-time upgrade fee for more performance if the company was able to articulate that it was required due to a perceived reduction in reliability of the powertrain over the course of the warranty period. IE, mean time between failures of "X/Y/Z" has decreased.....

Why do they need to articulate that? Should be obvious that less power = less strain on the drivetrain and in this case the battery.

 

[SWO]

Outside of the obvious exact replica examples from Tesla and Volvo offering more hp for a fee…..

My last car had an LS3 and Chevy offers the identical engine with various states of tune.

BMW has been bumping up the boost on their engines in various versions (comp models for example). Sometimes in conjunction with minor hardware improvements, sometimes they just bump the boost to get more power for the next model year.

Actually every single factory turbo car ever made was limited from the factory by the computer in terms of boost.

Electric cars are obviously much easier. Power is given or limited by the manufacturer. None of us are getting “full power.” And the manufacturers know we are willing to pay for more.

I’m completely fine with this.

LS3 isn't a good example. I assume you mean Camaro vs Corvette- the difference is really power rating and the marketing thereof vs any really difference. Dyno tests showed it was really the same engine with differences really coming down to exhaust. Bottom line is the poverty model can't outshine the corvette.

BMW has mechanical changes - not a good example.

You said the tune was the only change - I can't think of a single example. Take the 3.5 EcoBoost vs the HO version. Ford changed the compression, pistons, exhaust, and turbo design. You could tune the normal 3.5 to the same power but it's a misnomer to say the tune is the only difference.

 

[buzznwood]

Think if it as paying for a warranty that covers more extreme usage.

It's like an extended warranty but not extended in time, extended along the performance axis. The manufacturer is covering more risk when they unlock that extra power.

As for the BMW heated seat subscription, if BMW saves money by streamlining their parts and manufacturing processes, that's how they win even when they install a software-disabled heated seat. How do buyers win? When they pay less over the duration of ownership for a warm tuchus only when they need it. When they move to a colder climate or when they sell or trade in their car. They're "Florida" care can be easily upgraded, relatively cheaply to warm their own buttocks or the buttocks of a bigger market. People who don't want heated seats don't lose because they're not paying for them. People who pay up front for permanent heated seats don't lose because it doesn't cost any more than the option.

Your sensibilities may be highly offended but the concept makes no less sense that paying BMW's industry leading profit margins. Corporate profits don't warm your tush, make your car go faster, or even tickle your aesthetic pickle with fancy paint colors and matte finishes.

This is the general idea behind it with the premium brands as for the most part these vehicles are leased first time and not purchased then when the lease is up and it is given back and the vehicle ends up on the used lot the ones without the options typically have a lower resale value and lower demand.

By just building vehicles with the options already in place and offering it as one time payment / monthly people can not activate it to keep the lease cost low, but it also means when the term is up and it ends up on the used lot it is a lot easier to sell as the options can be enabled.

The theory is generally ok and should be a benefit but like everything is starts to become a very slipper slope as everything becomes a one time / subscription cost option that should really be standard at the base price point . It can of course be argued you already have this with certain premium brands already.

You also have the issue of repair costs, need a replacement of part x and you could potentially be paying for a part that includes an option you do not have access and I doubt you will be given a discount.

 

[SWO]

Why do they need to articulate that? Should be obvious that less power = less strain on the drivetrain and in this case the battery.

Not necessarily if the vehicle is actually detuned, which I bet the Mercedes is.

 

[2021-MMEx-RT1]

I blame Adobe, they showed that the subscription model works and others have followed. Adobe first launched Creative Cloud back in 2012 and other companies have jumped right in.

And the Auto companies are doing the same thing.

 

[leeman]

Want to go fast? You'll have to pay M-B a monthly or yearly fee.

https://tflcar.com/2023/04/mercedes-benz-acceleration-on-demand-upgrade-subscription-pricing-news/

Yep if you don't electric car, you don't own it, they own you.

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