Manufacturers' Subscription Services

[tomking29]

As the character Spicoli said in Fasttimes At Ridgemont High "This is bogus man!!" Tesla charging a subscrition fee for heated seats. And we wonder why the adoption of EVs is slowing down. Please Ford, DO NOT go down this road.

https://cleantechnica.com/2023/11/16/is-tesla-seriously-going-to-start-charging-for-heated-seats/

I was born in the wrong generation to ever pay a car feature subscription. No way.

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[tomking29]

I'm wondering whether that is even legal? I mean, I buy a car with certain features (read: hardware) included, but you are not letting me use them unless I pay a monthly fee..

What's next? Limiting my car to go 30mph, and if I want to go over that I have to pay for it?

Right. Queue the class action lawsuit for selling me hardware I can’t use.

 

[Mach1E]

In fairness, the BMW heated seats subscription was offered as an optional alternative to the normal "just buy it once" model. So you could buy the car with the heated seats option (with no subscription) or you could skip that and decide later to add it as a subscription.

IMHO this is a lot different than making heated seats ONLY available as a subscription. You know, like HF Bluecruise.

Yeah, this topic comes up fairly regularly and the BMW heated seats is always a source of “outrage.”

But it’s just a payment plan OPTION. If you are the kinda person who buys a new car every year, it’s actually a better/cheaper option.

But people seem to ignore the fact that it’s an option!!

What’s wrong with manufacturers giving you a choice? Apparently the fault was that the consumer didn’t understand the program and got angry about nothing.

It’s the equivalent of people yelling at the dealership if they give them the option to lease or finance a car rather than paying cash.

 

[Mach1E]

I was born in the wrong generation to ever pay a car feature subscription. No way.

Ever finance a car?

How do you pay for your internet, phone, TV, gym membership, newspaper, magazines etc? I would guess your generation actually invented and popularized the “subscription.”

And FWIW, your satellite radio and GPS and Bluecruise are all subscriptions, so you may already be doing the thing you said you wouldn’t.

Unlike the heated BMW seats or financing, the satellite, GPS and Bluecruise are forced on you as subscriptions.

 

[Auto Motive]

I wonder if you could think of it from the perspective of including a feature that some people won't use that much (Hi, I live in Florida, heated seats come on maybe a handful of weeks a year). If it makes it cheaper to build the vehicle by just making sure all vehicles have this feature, then maybe it's better to just let people unlock the feature that want to use it?

We'll definitely be seeing more of this with the goal being to cut down manufacturing costs and hopefully pass cost savings down to buyers.

Lived in Key West in the 50s and my dad bought a cadillac and it didn't come with a heater. We moved to NJ and he had one installed with ac.

 

[ChehRob]

Subscription can be a good value. If it includes some wi-fi, music, updates to maps, new ADAS improvements. Tesla's $16K for an ADAS that doesn't work is the worst.

 

[awp0]

And Ford is actively working on pushing out an update that changes both the free ADAS and paid BC systems.

Yep. The first BC update of any kind in my 16 months (and counting), and IMHO the most important "feature" they're delivering in 1.3 is to make it work as originally advertised, without ping-ponging or hugging the right lane or frequently disengaging. Meanwhile, many other modules have been updated via PowerUps without any subscription whatsoever, so I'm not bought in that "active development" really means much in this context. On top of all this, I think it's pretty well established that 99% of us believe $800/yr is fully outrageous (especially given they quadrupled the price months/years after many of us purchased). The whole situation sours me on this brand.

 

[Alutacon]

The arti pe says fee to "activate". I didn't see anything about subscriptions.

 

[tomking29]

Ever finance a car?

How do you pay for your internet, phone, TV, gym membership, newspaper, magazines etc? I would guess your generation actually invented and popularized the “subscription.”

And FWIW, your satellite radio and GPS and Bluecruise are all subscriptions, so you may already be doing the thing you said you wouldn’t.

Unlike the heated BMW seats or financing, the satellite, GPS and Bluecruise are forced on you as subscriptions.

Financing a car and paying for a perpetual feature are not the same thing.
Although I don’t subscribe to satellite radio or bluecruise, those are also different than heated seats. Satellite is a service which requires ongoing costs, as does bluecrusie. Maybe I’m unaware of the ongoing support costs associated with a resistant wire embedded in a car seat, but I’m assuming the car maker’s costs end at the point of manufacturing.

 

[Mach1E]

Financing a car and paying for a perpetual feature are not the same thing.
Although I don’t subscribe to satellite radio or bluecruise, those are also different than heated seats. Satellite is a service which requires ongoing costs, as does bluecrusie. Maybe I’m unaware of the ongoing support costs associated with a resistant wire embedded in a car seat, but I’m assuming the car maker’s costs end at the point of manufacturing.

You don’t have to pay monthly for heated seats.

You can pay a 1x fee and have them “forever.”

But if you’re only keeping the car for a year or two, the subscription model is cheaper.

No one is forced to do either. I actually like that manufacturers are being creative and giving you a choice.

My point about satellite radio, BC, and navigation was just that those are WORSE because you don’t have a choice. It’s subscription or nothing.

But leasing a car or paying cash is exactly the same as paying monthly or paying once for a feature on the car.

The option to pay monthly has nothing to do with ongoing costs.

And again, I can’t say this enough until people understand: it’s an option. Buyers choice. People like choices, right?

 

[tomking29]

I was under the impression it was a monthly subscription, like BMW was proposing. One time makes sense.

 

[Mach1E]

I was under the impression it was a monthly subscription, like BMW was proposing. One time makes sense.

The Tesla article is speculative clickbait.

BMW gave people options and it was just something they tested in some markets and later abandoned the idea because of the (unnecessary) backlash it caused.

“Depending on the region, a monthly subscription to heat your front seats was roughly $18, with options to subscribe for a year ($180), three years ($300), or pay for “unlimited” access for $415.”

https://www.theverge.com/2023/9/7/23863258/bmw-cancel-heated-seat-subscription-microtransaction

I’m actually annoyed that people killed this idea. They didn’t understand how it works and how it actually could save some people money. So in typical “internet outrage” and “horrible journalism” fashion, they ruined it.

I would LOVE to be able to test out features and add the ones I like and use and get rid of the ones I don’t later.

Instead you have to buy the car fully loaded to get it all, or buy a new car if you didn’t and want something.

The one “subscription” service I hope takes off is the ability to add more horsepower (either temporarily or permanently) for a fee. Sign me up!

 

[Exordium01]

Yep. The first BC update of any kind in my 16 months (and counting), and IMHO the most important "feature" they're delivering in 1.3 is to make it work as originally advertised, without ping-ponging or hugging the right lane or frequently disengaging. Meanwhile, many other modules have been updated via PowerUps without any subscription whatsoever, so I'm not bought in that "active development" really means much in this context. On top of all this, I think it's pretty well established that 99% of us believe $800/yr is fully outrageous (especially given they quadrupled the price months/years after many of us purchased). The whole situation sours me on this brand.

$800/year is outrageous, and people who purchased Job 1 cars have an opportunity to extend for the old price. I mentioned it in one of my comments above, but I think Ford is going to release revised pricing before anybody who purchased a car with a 3 year subscription even has the opportunity to pay $800/year. We're just now getting to the $200/year renewal period for early adopters and they will absolutely be watching the percentage of job 1 owners that renew at that price. if <50% of Job 1 owners with BC renew, we are going to see price cuts.

At the end of the day, high adoption rates are good for Ford even if revenue is relatively flat because it will likely lead to more future sales and customer satisfaction.

 

[johnohuc]

has anyone noticed any recent changes in how Ford is handling subscription features in newer models? I’m thinking about trading mine in and wondering if these services are becoming more locked down or if there’s been any pushback from buyers that made them rethink anything.

 

[Keramzzit]

I really don’t mind subscriptions if they actually add value, but it drives me nuts when basic stuff gets locked behind a paywall. One thing that would make me less annoyed is a user friendly interface that doesn't make me dig through menus to find what I need. If they're gonna charge monthly, the whole experience better be easy and smooth from the start.

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