Comparing DCFC costs to gas prices

[GlennMacC]

Could you show your work on how you equate the DC charging to $1.00/gallon?

Using $.42/kwh and 30 miles per gallon, I’ll compare the cost to travel 30 miles….

If it’s 3 miles per kwh efficiency- then it would take 10 kwh to go 30 miles. 10 times $.42 is $4.20.

So it’s $4.20/gallon equivalent. Your at home math is the same (multiply by 10 = $1.40/gallon).

Again, that’s using your numbers. Let me know how you got a significantly different result.

I've been getting around 3.5 m/kwh (summer). And these calculations are based on my 2023 electric rates which were $.12/kwh, all in. No demand/premium rates in VA. Sorry, I forgot that I've used $.12 up til now, we just had a rate increase this January.

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[Mach1E]

You do what you can do, within your economic capabilities, to reduce your carbon footprint and impact on the environment. So yes, driving an EV helps, so does solar power and wind power.

My suggestion to you dear friend is to stop finding excuses, for why we shouldn’t change and simply change for the betterment of the world even if it is minuscule, you’ve done your part.

I don’t disagree.

I was just pointing out that if you want to get people to listen, focus on the immediate and obvious results of the actions.

No need to pour on hyperbole of flood, fire and brimstone. People just look at you like a crazy person and won’t listen.

 

[Mach1E]

I've been getting around 3.5 m/kwh (summer). And these calculations are based on my 2023 electric rates which were $.12/kwh, all in. No demand/premium rates in VA. Sorry, I forgot that I've used $.12 up til now, we just had a rate increase this January.

That gets you around $1/gallon equivalent at home, but still not DC on the road.

Either way, even using 3.5 mi/kwh, it’s still about the same price as gasoline to DC charge.

 

[Mach1E]

we are fortunate and live in a ground floor apartment that allows us to run an extension cord from our porch to our MMEGT, all we had to do was add a waterproof contain for the extension, cord and charger, and we were good to go.

OTOH, even though we are not, but 25 feet away from our circuit box, the apartment complex wants to charge us over $2000 for a 50 amp plug for level two charging ?

I guess the good news is sometime this year. They are supposed to have public DC fast charging in the parking lot by the gym and swimming pool in our apartment complex.

Ideally the apartment complexes will install these themselves and it’ll just be one of the perks for living there.

It’s ballsy of an apartment building to expect a tenant to pay for permanent infrastructure.

Do you get to remove the plug and wiring when you move out?? ?

 

[Opa]

Ideally the apartment complexes will install these themselves and it’ll just be one of the perks for living there.

It’s ballsy of an apartment building to expect a tenant to pay for permanent infrastructure.

Do you get to remove the plug and wiring when you move out?? ?

exactly!

We don’t plan on moving for many years - This is a great apartment complex with superior management, and they do try to stay in competition with the cutting edge, high-tech apartment complexes in the Huntsville area of these days..

(however, we’re retired, and frankly, the only way I want to move out of this place is feet first????)

Also, we are blessed with the fact that we live less than 2 miles away from our daughter, son-in-law, and granddaughter (of whom we care for daily), and they were kind enough to install a L2 Autel charger for us to use when we’re over at the house.

so the only time we have issues are road trips, certainly not around town. ?
*sigh*
now, if only Ford could manufacture,
a 500+ mile battery like the lucid air and life would be grand!

 

[Billyk24]

… And Installing and maintaining a DCFC station costs = ?

Tesla has stated $60,000.00 purchase price for one Supercharger stall.

 

[Mach1E]

exactly!

We don’t plan on moving for many years - This is a great apartment complex with superior management, and they do try to stay in competition with the cutting edge, high-tech apartment complexes in the Huntsville area of these days..

(however, we’re retired, and frankly, the only way I want to move out of this place is feet first????)

Also, we are blessed with the fact that we live less than 2 miles away from our daughter, son-in-law, and granddaughter (of whom we care for daily), and they were kind enough to install a L2 Autel charger for us to use when we’re over at the house.

so the only time we have issues are road trips, certainly not around town. ?
*sigh*
now, if only Ford could manufacture,
a 500+ mile battery like the lucid air and life would be grand!

To be fair the Lucid doesn’t seem to hit its mileage claims. But the way they get more miles is simply a larger battery.

Ford has shown us it does make a big battery in the Lightning.

 

[GreaseMonkey]

I get what you all are doing, but it’s comparing apples to oranges.

The Mach-E has certain characteristics that are very similar from a performance perspective (size, capacity, acceleration, etc) to a Porsche macan, BMW x3 and Audi Q5. For example: a premium is close to Q5 55 which has a 25 mpg on premium gas. The GTPE is closest to Macan GTS with a 19 mpg. That should be the basis for comparison, not a hybrid Camry or an escape, cause that’s ridiculous.

For a premium that makes 3.3 miles / kWh charged on a EA @ $0.36 / kWh, the equivalent gallon of gas (driving an Audi) should be $2.75. I have not seen premium at that price anywhere in the country.

You can do the math on the other trim levels.

Therefore, charging cost of an EV under the most expensive circumstances is not equivalent to an ice. Let’s not create false equivalencies that make no sense.

 

[kennethjk]

I get what you all are doing, but it’s comparing apples to oranges.

The Mach-E has certain characteristics that are very similar from a performance perspective (size, capacity, acceleration, etc) to a Porsche macan, BMW x3 and Audi Q5. For example: a premium is close to Q5 55 which has a 25 mpg on premium gas. The GTPE is closest to Macan GTS with a 19 mpg. That should be the basis for comparison, not a hybrid Camry or an escape, cause that’s ridiculous.

For a premium that makes 3.3 miles / kWh charged on a EA @ $0.36 / kWh, the equivalent gallon of gas (driving an Audi) should be $2.75. I have not seen premium at that price anywhere in the country.

You can do the math on the other trim levels.

Therefore, charging cost of an EV under the most expensive circumstances is not equivalent to an ice. Let’s not create false equivalencies that make no sense.

not to quibble too much but I will, The GTPe is probably closer to a Macan S

 

[Mach1E]

I get what you all are doing, but it’s comparing apples to oranges.

The Mach-E has certain characteristics that are very similar from a performance perspective (size, capacity, acceleration, etc) to a Porsche macan, BMW x3 and Audi Q5. For example: a premium is close to Q5 55 which has a 25 mpg on premium gas. The GTPE is closest to Macan GTS with a 19 mpg. That should be the basis for comparison, not a hybrid Camry or an escape, cause that’s ridiculous.

For a premium that makes 3.3 miles / kWh charged on a EA @ $0.36 / kWh, the equivalent gallon of gas (driving an Audi) should be $2.75. I have not seen premium at that price anywhere in the country.

You can do the math on the other trim levels.

Therefore, charging cost of an EV under the most expensive circumstances is not equivalent to an ice. Let’s not create false equivalencies that make no sense.

Not many here (almost nobody) came from a Macan GTS to the Mach E. No point in comparing it to a car we wouldn’t buy.

The fair comparison is to whatever you would drive instead.

Some it’s a gas hog, but many others? Not so much.

We have a TON of former Prius drivers here for example. And you aren’t coming close to the cost per mile DC charging vs a Prius. ?

Me? My last car got 24 mpg on the highway and took premium. So if I ever DC charged (never have) it would still be cheaper in my GTPE.

 

[Mach1E]

not to quibble too much but I will, The GTPe is probably closer to a Macan S

If we are quibbling, the GTPE isn’t getting 3.3 mi/kwh on the highway either. ?

And do we need to even mention efficiency loss in the winter? That’ll definitely add to our DC cost formula.

 

[kennethjk]

My last car was a Macan S and I got 20 mpg

 

[ryano7700]

I track my charging costs and mileage cost of my MME. I have Ford charging station in my garage, so I use what the station app shows went into the car. I am pretty sure this includes losses, preheating the car, etc. which should be considered in the cost per mile. My electric cost at home is about $0.12/kwh(I use the exact amount in my spreadsheet). In 16 months of ownership, the MME averages about $0.048/mile.
The 3 times I used a DCFC, the average was $0.14/mile. If we had driven our Toyota Highlander on the road trips that I used the DCFC, it would have been $3.00/24mpg=$0.125./mile. (I assumed $3 a gallon which I think is pretty close). Therefore, it would have been cheaper to drive the Highlander.(fuel cost). Definitely cheaper to drive the hybrid Lexus.

 

[GreaseMonkey]

My last car was a Macan S and I got 20 mpg

@Mach1E and @kennethjk : no one is saying you would cross shop. That’s irrelevant. We are comparing capability and efficiency of gas vs electric and the implications on the energy portion of operating costs. The size of the vehicles I listed are within an inch from one another. The acceleration is almost identical. That’s what matters. And it’s a much closer comparison than the mache with a Camry hybrid like some suggested. Also, the 3.3 efficiency is for a premium, not a gtpe. I don’t drive a gtpe and have no sense of its efficiency. But I drive a premium and do so in harsh weather conditions. Last time I checked lifetime efficiency it was in that 3.3 range.

Again, the statement that cost of DCFC is equivalent to gas is lazy and wrong. It is way cheaper than gas.

 

[GlennMacC]

That gets you around $1/gallon equivalent at home, but still not DC on the road.

Either way, even using 3.5 mi/kwh, it’s still about the same price as gasoline to DC charge.

Yes, I was talking about home charging only. DC charging seems to me to be purposely priced to be roughly equivalent to gas.

Glenn

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