The end of the federal EV tax credit?

[zvez]

Not just EV’s. Proposed tariffs will send the price of electronics and other goods through the roof. Upgrade your televisions and cell phones now. Clothing, shoes and even furniture prices will go up.

He's proposed 10% tariffs on ALL imports, so you'll see a spike in costs of EVERYTHING that's imported, that's the "little bit of pain" elmo talked about before everything becomes bright and rosy and US will no longer need to import ANYTHING. Welcome to fantasy island. This will all be massively inflationary

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[zvez]

They do in fact lead in coal production, however they export quite a bit.

But coal used for power is a different animal.

In 2023, coal accounted for 60% of electricity generation in China.

In 2024 it’s down to a record low of 53%.
Renewable energy in China is around 44%.

China and the world know renewable energy is the future for energy and national security. It’s why China is moving fast away from fossil fuel.

Fossil fuels are a dead end.
The technology for renewables is here.
Countries who stay with fossil fuels will be left behind

Hence why there is a push in the US for new nuclear power generation. It’s cheap clean, energy production.

Isn't china's awful pollution in direct relation to the amount and quality of coal they use?

 

[Sikkun]

China also leads the world in power generation by coal, so there’s that ?

of course, the US will quickly catch up as soon as we get all those strip mines opened again! ?

Coal Power Producers

We probably don’t need to lead at generation given the whole having over a billion less people thing.

 

[kflats]

Trump may end the $7,500 EV tax credit. Elon Musk and Tesla would reap the rewards

Per CNN:
https://edition.cnn.com/2024/11/15/business/musk-tesla-trump-ev-tax-credit/index.html

 

[markw314]

Most all gasoline is made in America and America produces more oil then we use. import tariffs will only impact gas prices coming from gulf coast refineries, that get their oil from OPEC because that’s what their refineries are design to refine. This will make prices higher not lower.

America does not produce more oil than we consume. We produce about 13-13.5 million bbl/day (https://www.eia.gov/dnav/pet/pet_crd_crpdn_adc_mbblpd_m.htm). We consume about 20 million bbl/day (https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=33&t=6)

But like most things, It's more complicated than it would seem on the surface.

 

[shutterbug]

I for one would welcome the fall of fossil fuels, oil and natural gas mostly come from the same wells! So a subsidy for one is a subsidy for the other.

https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=13571

You still haven't answered what would constitute "sky high" increase in gasoline prices.

 

[phil]

Now Tesla can put out cars faster than any manufacturer (EV or ICE).

Faster? Tesla can put out a car faster than Volkswagen? I'm not clear what you are saying here.

You are certainly right that Musk got a lot of taxpayer money. His business empire is largely built on government subsidies - Tesla, Solar City, SpaceX. We have paid that guy a fortune. I don't think it was money well spent.

 

[Jimrpa]

Most all gasoline is made in America and America produces more oil then we use. import tariffs will only impact gas prices coming from gulf coast refineries, that get their oil from OPEC because that’s what their refineries are design to refine. This will make prices higher not lower.

I was being … sarcastic. The additional detail is nice to know though. ?

 

[Jimrpa]

They do in fact lead in coal production, however they export quite a bit.

But coal used for power is a different animal.

In 2023, coal accounted for 60% of electricity generation in China.

In 2024 it’s down to a record low of 53%.
Renewable energy in China is around 44%.

China and the world know renewable energy is the future for energy and national security. It’s why China is moving fast away from fossil fuel.

Fossil fuels are a dead end.
The technology for renewables is here.
Countries who stay with fossil fuels will be left behind

Hence why there is a push in the US for new nuclear power generation. It’s cheap clean, energy production.

China is still building coal power plants like crazy. China Coal Power Plant Expansion

that said, I happen to love nuclear power.

 

[Mach1E]

It's different because if any company has >$7500 margin left in the car, they could drop the price and go on... if you only have say $4000 margin left you can't just drop the price $7500.

when the cars cost $10K more than they do now, they had that margin... It's unlikely they do now at current prices.

Margin? Almost no electric cars have margin. They’re losing money no matter the price.

I’ll say it again. The “market” determines selling price.

Manufacturers lower prices until people buy cars. Doesn’t matter what the margin is.

It’s what Ford did after the 2023 Mach E’s were sitting on lots for 200+ days.

 

[rhougey]

I doubt it. If the net long-term profitability of most EVs across the entire US industry is reduced by $7,500 per car, normal market forces will increase prices across the entire industry.

Ford's strategy is said to involve cutting costs to eliminate the huge losses they've incurred in their EV line in recent years. That already was going to be extraordinarily difficult. It may soon get even more difficult, by about $7,500 per vehicle.

The sky is falling.

 

[Blue highway]

Margin? Almost no electric cars have margin. They’re losing money no matter the price.

I’ll say it again. The “market” determines selling price.

Manufacturers lower prices until people buy cars. Doesn’t matter what the margin is.

It’s what Ford did after the 2023 Mach E’s were sitting on lots for 200+ days.

In the real world, margin does matter. Lack of margin is why Ford has delayed or curtailed its EV plans. Tesla has margin... it gives them pricing power that others don't have.

 

[doogie63]

Google where they took the money from to pay for the EV rebates. Google inflation reduction act and EV 7,500 rebates.

Inflation Reduction Act re-routes Medicare savings into tax credits for electric vehicles.

Now soon part of that money will run out and senior rates will go up.

So maybe it does need to end or maybe not. But one thing for sure we can not keep printing money. Already 36 trillion in debt.

 

[Sikkun]

Don’t worry we can cut corporate taxes and lower taxes for the 1% to work on that national debt one party pretends to care about occasionally.

Elon will be first in line to pay less.

 

[Jerrytball]

Since I didn’t qualify in 23 the tax credit has no bearing on my decision to buy. I understand people taking advantage and if I could I would certainly have done so.

It would’ve counted for me, but I’m kind of like you when you go to your CPA and they said you’re not getting nothing back but you don’t owe anything so I’m like so I’m not gonna get $7500 back no cause you don’t pay no taxes lol?

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