40 Mach E competitors. Why did everyone have the same SUV idea at the same time??

[SyNRG]

Well you can thank old Croc Dundee himself who showed up in a jacked up Subaru wagon with plastic cladding in the early 90s.

AMC Eagle (1979 - 1987) says "hello"....

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[Snakebitten]

I think to some extent trends cycle.

Big<>small
Focus on fuel economy <>give me the power and luxury
etc

Although when many years separate the swing, we might not identify the new version with the previous version because the advances in technology and styling can be dramatic.

I'm an old geezer.
When I glance at my Mach-E, I don't see an SUV. And of course it's not a sedan or coup. To me it's like a modern hi-tech midsized station wagon. And in that context I find it even more appealing.

 

[Mach1E]

easy answer... They would rather have some market share of cars that can be sold profitably (SUV) vs all of a market that can't be sold at a profit... that is why Ford and GM left (or mostly left) the sedan market.

That profit theory works in ICE world but is yet to be seen for 98% of the models on this list.

I would think it would have been wise to replace a couple of the SUVs on the list with an affordable sedan and a sporty coupe.

Oh and while I’m complaining about the market misses that I think car manufacturers have made with BEVs……. Make the cars GOOD looking!!

So many odd design choices.

 

[Dear_OP]

AMC Eagle (1979 - 1987) says "hello"....

And that's why no one adopted CUV craze back then and AMC seized to exist.

 

[Jeff-NoVA]

This is why Ford has its "skunkworks" working on a sub-$30K EV. The low-cost commuter EV is where they are hoping there is a ton of unmet demand. Look how well the Chevy Bolt and Bolt EUV started selling when gas prices shot up - a mediocre EV with sloooow charging and awkward looks was being marked up 20% over MSRP.

 

[Dear_OP]

This is why Ford has its "skunkworks" working on a sub-$30K EV. The low-cost commuter EV is where they are hoping there is a ton of unmet demand. Look how well the Chevy Bolt and Bolt EUV started selling when gas prices shot up - a mediocre EV with sloooow charging and awkward looks was being marked up 20% over MSRP.

Great idea and strategy. However the Ford dealerships would rather sell you trucks than some small efficient vehicle. Let alone ones that don't require gas and oil.

 

[Jeff-NoVA]

Great idea and strategy. However the Ford dealerships would rather sell you trucks than some small efficient vehicle. Let alone ones that don't require gas and oil.

Yeah, I agree. I’m not sure how Ford is going to address the issue with their dealerships. I think they have to use the carrot and stick approach. Market EVs properly or no pickups for you.

 

[phil]

Yeah, I agree. I’m not sure how Ford is going to address the issue with their dealerships. I think they have to use the carrot and stick approach. Market EVs properly or no pickups for you.

Better to simply use the tried-and-true profit motive. It never fails.

Of course, that is hard to do when there are no profits...

 

[Dear_OP]

It's opposite of profit in the case with the MME. The reality is Ford's actions are not syncing with its goals. They planned to have the Oakville plant to build EVs. But now have decided to build diesel HD trucks instead.
How's that for a giant middle finger to zero emissions.
And why should they as we now have Fortress America to protect against Chinese EV competition. What's the rush to innovate?

The losers? Consumers and Earth.

 

[Jeff-NoVA]

Better to simply use the tried-and-true profit motive. It never fails.

Of course, that is hard to do when there are no profits...

The profit motive is exactly the issue. Dealers make big $$ selling pickups and SUVs at MSRP (or higher). Then they make even more money servicing those vehicles for years to come. So naturally they are not particularly motivated to sell EVs.

Given the likely target market of the small EV - urban and suburban commuters - Ford will undoubtedly be selective with which dealers they are pushing EVs on. A dealer in the sticks that sells 95% pickups isn't going to be a market for Ford's small EV.

 

[phil]

The profit motive is exactly the issue. Dealers make big $$ selling pickups and SUVs at MSRP (or higher). Then they make even more money servicing those vehicles for years to come. So naturally they are not particularly motivated to sell EVs.

Given the likely target market of the small EV - urban and suburban commuters - Ford will undoubtedly be selective with which dealers they are pushing EVs on. A dealer in the sticks that sells 95% pickups isn't going to be a market for Ford's small EV.

I'm not sure whether you're agreeing or disagreeing with me...

Which would you pay more money for: a vehicle that never breaks down, or one that needs service all the time? Which type of vehicle would and should be more profitable to sell? Does Samsung deliberately sell smartphones that break and need service all the time, so they can make more profits on repairs? Of course not. The answers are the same whether service is provided by the manufacturer directly or by independent business partners/dealers/service centers.

Ford should not need to be selective. They should simply produce vehicles that are profitable for themselves and their dealers, and the dealers will be begging to sell them. If they have to be "pushing" EVs on their dealers, then something is wrong.

And, of course, something IS wrong. EVs are too expensive, and they are not profitable. That is the problem. When and if battery costs come way down, EVs may become a viable business, even without billions of dollars of government subsidies. Until then, car makers will just have to "push" EVs on unwilling dealers and customers if they want to sell them in large numbers.

(BTW, it's a myth that EVs don't require much dealer service. Just read this forum for an hour, and you'll get a sense of how much of a myth it is. I owned my Lexus for 25 years, and could count the number of service days on my fingers. I have already had more days in dealer service for my three year old electric Mustang.)

 

[Thunderbuck]

Still think the Mach-E doesn't quite fit the SUV template. It's too low, and really it's more of a 4dr "Shooting Brake". It's not even as tall as an Escape or RAV4, and those are somewhat smaller vehicles.

Even my registration refers to it as a "4 dr hatchback"

 

[cbagwu]

I just want a small electric convertible damnit!!

 

[Jeff-NoVA]

I'm not sure whether you're agreeing or disagreeing with me...

Which would you pay more money for: a vehicle that never breaks down, or one that needs service all the time? Which type of vehicle would and should be more profitable to sell? Does Samsung deliberately sell smartphones that break and need service all the time, so they can make more profits on repairs? Of course not. The answers are the same whether service is provided by the manufacturer directly or by independent business partners/dealers/service centers.

Ford should not need to be selective. They should simply produce vehicles that are profitable for themselves and their dealers, and the dealers will be begging to sell them. If they have to be "pushing" EVs on their dealers, then something is wrong.

And, of course, something IS wrong. EVs are too expensive, and they are not profitable. That is the problem. When and if battery costs come way down, EVs may become a viable business, even without billions of dollars of government subsidies. Until then, car makers will just have to "push" EVs on unwilling dealers and customers if they want to sell them in large numbers.

(BTW, it's a myth that EVs don't require much dealer service. Just read this forum for an hour, and you'll get a sense of how much of a myth it is. I owned my Lexus for 25 years, and could count the number of service days on my fingers. I have already had more days in dealer service for my three year old electric Mustang.)

I think we're on roughly the same page here. As I understand it, the entire point of Ford’s secretive small EV project is to make a profitable and inexpensive EV.

The Chinese are doing it, of course they have the advantage of extremely cheap labor and access to raw materials, but the point is it can be done.

Yes there are a lot of people here with service issues. That's true of every car forum. But there are plenty of us, myself included, who have never had any significant issue with their Mach E aside from having recall work done. Ford has been struggling with quality broadly; I sure hope they get that sorted. We'll see.

 

[ChehRob]

ICE vehicle makers need to make the very difficult transition from ICEs to EVs. It is expensive, fraught with hurdles, and will take time, as well as those profits from sales of politically correct big ICEs.

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