Lesson Learned with 120v Charging

[HuntingPudel]

ummmmm, what? Sorry, I don't think that's a "thing"...

It actually is. Since the EVSE draws the maximum amount of sustained current that the circuit can support, no other devices should be connected to that circuit while the EVSE is attached. Onc e the EVSE is removed from the circuit, of course something else can be attached, just not while the EVSE is part of the circuit. ??

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[ipca204]

It actually is. Since the EVSE draws the maximum amount of sustained current that the circuit can support, no other devices should be connected to that circuit while the EVSE is attached. Onc e the EVSE is removed from the circuit, of course something else can be attached, just not while the EVSE is part of the circuit. ??

You have a funny definition of "dedicated"....lol

 

[Ziggy]

Yep, just like your stove, dishwasher or other appliance, EV chargers should be the only thing on the circuit. This is because if you have your car charging, and then decide to clean it and plug the shop-vac in on the same circuit, you will likely exceed the rating of the circuit. Do that long enough and the breaker trips or you get a fire.

 

[ipca204]

one more thing to note is that the outlet must be dedicated for EV charging only.

this is the post I was referring to, to which I did not agree. There is no reason why the "Outlet" needs to be used ONLY for EV charging. I swap between my charger and a portable heater in my garage. As long as the OUTLET is of good quality there is no reason it can not be used for other devices. Yes, I am aware of the "melted" cheap ass outlets, but a properly designed outlet should not have any issues.

 

[Sikkun]

Notice,,,no response!

Post some random pictures, don’t interact with any of the comments. Maybe post again on the forum after a year has passed.

Honestly even if it really happened (which it’s in the realm of possibility). I don’t understand the purpose of making an account for that one post.

 

[bbulkow]

I suspect the Ford L1 charger is rated at 15A 110V, no?

This essentially means you should use the same gauge as a 20A circuit (because 20% derate), which is 12AWG copper. I tend to -2 on my AWGs because home fires kinda suck, so I'd say a reasonable length 10AWG extension cord is safe. Both 12AWG and 10AWG can be found at any home depot / lowe's any day of the week. And minimize your length.

It is, of course, safer to not use an extension cord and obey the manual !

That being said, I don't use L1 and I don't use an extension cord. I am sometimes in situations where I need to use extension cords for 15A rated devices, and I have this extension cord which I can barely carry ("the mother of all extension cords") for specifically this purpose. I will admit I bought it at Harbor Freight so it is *probably* the noted gauge. Whenever I have to use it I try to remember to do spot heat checks. It's been "fine" so far.

A house across the street from me burned and was a tear-down write-off due to an extension cord fire, not 10 years ago. People that use extension cords tend not to spend money on a really good extension cord, I supposed.

 

[Maquis]

I suspect the Ford L1 charger is rated at 15A 110V, no?

This essentially means you should use the same gauge as a 20A circuit (because 20% derate), which is 12AWG copper. I tend to -2 on my AWGs because home fires kinda suck, so I'd say a reasonable length 10AWG extension cord is safe. Both 12AWG and 10AWG can be found at any home depot / lowe's any day of the week. And minimize your length.

It is, of course, safer to not use an extension cord and obey the manual !

That being said, I don't use L1 and I don't use an extension cord. I am sometimes in situations where I need to use extension cords for 15A rated devices, and I have this extension cord which I can barely carry ("the mother of all extension cords") for specifically this purpose. I will admit I bought it at Harbor Freight so it is *probably* the noted gauge. Whenever I have to use it I try to remember to do spot heat checks. It's been "fine" so far.

A house across the street from me burned and was a tear-down write-off due to an extension cord fire, not 10 years ago. People that use extension cords tend not to spend money on a really good extension cord, I supposed.

It is 12A, not 15.

 

[ChrisO]

When you have a 15-amp circuit, that is what the circuit breaker trips at, so you can't be running 15-amps through it. The rule of thumb (by the code standards) is to multiply the circuit rating by .8 to get the max you should be running on that circuit. So, 15 * .8 = 12-amps. Which when you multiply that times 120 volts you get a max of 1.44kW. From my use of the Ford mobile charger I know that it draws about 1.3kW.

As it turns out our garage door was on the same circuit as the garage plug (found out when the circuit breaker tripped). We ended up putting in a 240v 50-amp circuit/plug and now get 7kW of the Ford Mobile charger.

 

[Mach-Lee]

When you have a 15-amp circuit, that is what the circuit breaker trips at, so you can't be running 15-amps through it. The rule of thumb (by the code standards) is to multiply the circuit rating by .8 to get the max you should be running on that circuit. So, 15 * .8 = 12-amps. Which when you multiply that times 120 volts you get a max of 1.44kW. From my use of the Ford mobile charger I know that it draws about 1.3kW.

As it turns out our garage door was on the same circuit as the garage plug (found out when the circuit breaker tripped). We ended up putting in a 240v 50-amp circuit/plug and now get 7kW of the Ford Mobile charger.

Yes, if you’re plugged into a 120V circuit in the garage and then open the garage door, it can overload the circuit and trip the circuit breaker.

The last time I visited my dad, I was charging my car in the garage. Unbeknownst to me, he had gone out and started vacuuming with a shop vac. After a minute or two, the breaker blew. He was puzzled about why it happened until I explained that the vacuum overloaded the circuit due to my car charging. I told him that he couldn’t run any vacuums or tools in the garage while I was charging. To prevent that problem from happening again, I installed a 50A circuit and 14-50 outlet in his garage. 240V is just so much better than 120V, EV charging just really stresses the 120V stuff to the limit.

 

[mkhuffman]

Wait... what? Are you saying that all these EV manufacturers have sent us little wired death-boxes in the form of our EV chargers?

He is saying a 120V EVSE will stress a standard 120V outlet to its limit, and it isn't a good idea to rely on that for daily charging. Most 120V outlets are not designed to handle the constant high current needed when charging a BEV. My suggestion is to use a 20 Amp 120V outlet. But then you need wire and a circuit breaker rated at 20 Amps. Maybe Lee has another suggestion.

 

[Rusky]

That is a 15 amp receptacle. That happened to me with an above ground pool pump. Replace the receptacle with a 20 amp one. This has nothing to do with the breaker size. The 20 amp receptacle has one of the slots that is t shaped

 

[DennisD]

this is the post I was referring to, to which I did not agree. There is no reason why the "Outlet" needs to be used ONLY for EV charging. I swap between my charger and a portable heater in my garage. As long as the OUTLET is of good quality there is no reason it can not be used for other devices. Yes, I am aware of the "melted" cheap ass outlets, but a properly designed outlet should not have any issues.

I think he meant that when using said outlet, it should be dedicated and not used by any other current draw if you will. The outlet has two places to plug devices in. Only the EV (if it is being used) should be the only one that should be used.

Of course, one could use other "things" when the EV is not being used. For safety reasons, I would only use one of the outlets and use a child safety clip so that an unsuspecting person didn't accidentally plug two things into the same outlet if the EV is being charged at the same time.

They could also hang a sign on the wall near the outlet saying, "Only one plug at a time when charging the car" or something to that effect.

I would strongly encourage that he installs a 240 v outlet and only use the 110 v only when no other 240 is available.

 

[ChrisO]

One thing I would say about a "dedicated circuit" is that I think in a lot of cases people might be fooling themselves into thinking that a given outlet is "dedicated" because they only see one thing plugged into that outlet. Do you have a garage door? Most likely it is on the same circuit. Do you have more than one outlet in your garage?

And note that if you are going to have to put in a dedicated circuit the cost difference between say a 120 volt 20-amp circuit and a 240-volt 20+ amp circuit is minimum provided that the main circuit in the circuit breaker box can handle it.

 

[Mach-Lee]

That is a 15 amp receptacle. That happened to me with an above ground pool pump. Replace the receptacle with a 20 amp one. This has nothing to do with the breaker size. The 20 amp receptacle has one of the slots that is t shaped

You can't put a 20A receptacle on a 15A circuit. You can get a 15A federal spec grade outlet, which are built to handle a lot more punishment. Other than the T slot, the fed spec 15A and 20A outlets are built the same inside and can handle the same amount of current. There is such a thing as a 15A outlet that is rated for 20A passthrough.

 

[ChrisO]

That is a 15 amp receptacle. That happened to me with an above ground pool pump. Replace the receptacle with a 20 amp one. This has nothing to do with the breaker size. The 20 amp receptacle has one of the slots that is t shaped

The breaker size gives you an indication of how the circuit is wired. For 15 amp circuit the code says to use 14 gauge wire. For 20 amp circuit it says to use 12 gauge wire. If you stick a 20 amp outlet on a 15 amp circuit a person that doesn’t know anything about it might believe that that is a 20 amp circuit and overload it and even burn out the wires and cause fires. Very dangerous thing to do if you don’t know what you’re doing. If on the other hand that was already a 20 amp circuit with a 20 amp circuit breaker then you’re pretty sure that the wiring was correct and maybe they just made a mistake and put a 15 amp outlet on it. But you’re very much should know what you’re doing before doing something like that.

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