LFP battery vs. NCM

[MacherAWD]

Let's be real about quoting ranges. The reality is:

- Any of the ranges quoted by the manufacturers are EPA range, not real world
- The Guess-O-Meter range is not a real range
- Highway driving yields a lower range than local driving. At 73 or so mph, you'll get around 2.8 - 2.9. With a 70kWh battery, that's 196 - 203. With an ER 91kWh battery that's 255 - 264.

BUT, that's BS, because you only go from 100% on the first leg (or at a hotel stay), not DC fast charging. And no one goes down to 0%. The real highway range is from 80% down to 20% and back up to 80%, or 60% of the numbers above. So an SR's distance between chargers on the highway is 196 x 60% or 118 miles. An ER is 255 x 60% or 153 miles.

Sure, in perfect conditions maybe you get 3.0. Or, you drive 65mph and get 3.2 or 3.3.

Last month we did a 4,708 mile trip over 14 days to 8 national parks across 10 states. So please, stop the "can't go on long distance trip" stuff.

277 mile road trip Boston to Quebec, SR AWD, just got here. Charged to 100%, one charge stop at lunch for 45min, Maine only has 62kw chargers up north. Did 72mph most of the way, 3 mi/kw average. Easy trip with 2 kids

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[Garbone]

Considering an MME premium with choice of standard range vs extended. Are LFP batteries better because you can actually charge to 100%. Plus standard range LFP are $7k less than extended range. Help me decide

RWD SR batt works for us here in Fl.

On road trips out of state it gets sketchy, but that is more due to EA and piss poor charger coverage. Once you hit that FPL charger in Yullee and headed north on 95 it all is in route planning and 40 miles of range are not going to get you over those gaps. Tesla network access can not come soon enough.

 

[Mirak]

Does the ER battery give you more acceleration?

AWD gives you more acceleration. But if you couple AWD with standard pack, you're gonna have the shortest range of any configuration.

 

[Mach1E]

Does the ER battery give you more acceleration?

Yes.

You get more horsepower and better acceleration.

Standard range 266 hp rwd
Standard range 266 hp AWD (but more tq)

Ext range 290 hp rwd
Ext range 346 hp AWD

Also the new standard range battery is heavier and slower than the old one.

Here is an old chart because it’s confusing-

 

[Mach1E]

AWD gives you more acceleration. But if you couple AWD with standard pack, you're gonna have the shortest range of any configuration.

SR AWD is slower than ER AWD and has less horsepower. See above.

 

[FCCinAZ]

Do yourself a favor and don’t overthink it. If it’s your only car, get a plug-in hybrid and save even more money without any range concerns.

 

[llinthicum1]

IMHO, the smaller LFP battery pack is better for most driving situations, i.e. 250 mile range (RWD) is not bad. Why carry around the extra weight of a larger battery pack if you don't need. Also consider the added cost of the NCM battery. And the LFP is cheaper to make which should help reduce the cost of the vehicle. Battery technology is chemistry. Scientists will find the right combination of elements and optimal battery pack size to get longer ranges.

 

[Monke]

Even at 90%, I'd gain only 38 miles with the extended range.

Those are crucial miles to reach the next charge or skip a charger during out of town trips.

 

[Anders31]

Well, for my own, I have never considered any car as an investment... so, what is worth however is the 8 years warranty on all the electric package, whether it is ncm/lfp the thing is if I keep my car 8 years and only loose about 10-20% it is 100% OK and at this point I am already at the pivot time for a car change, in average people keep their cars 7 years.

It's never easy,but as a rule of thumb I would just think a little about what you need now and include any future plans you have
> regular roadtrips? LR
> 90% commute? SR...
> home charger? SR
> no home charger? LR

only a few hints, but thinking about resell value and range is just gambling like with all cars.

 

[Mach1E]

Threads like this remind me of how this car is such an anomaly.

It brings former Prius drivers and former v8 performance vehicle drivers together.

But since everyone is talking range and efficiency and no one seems to acknowledge the horsepower and performance difference between the batteries……. I’m guessing it’s mostly the Prius folks chiming in here. ?

 

[Anders31]

Sugar boy kissing the rain!

Anyway, I don't know if you are right with your Prius thing, but what I know is I don't care about driving eco or not, I will just commute and do my daily like I did with any ICE car, get home, plug and forget, and for all the long trips? I'd just rely on the Planner like I would with any gas station indications on the highway to plan where I would stop, I never ran out of gas even on small cars with very small range (I had a car that would do only 350km with a full tank...) welllll, well well well...

 

[thekat03]

Threads like this remind me of how this car is such an anomaly.

It brings former Prius drivers and former v8 performance vehicle drivers together.

But since everyone is talking range and efficiency and no one seems to acknowledge the horsepower and performance difference between the batteries……. I’m guessing it’s mostly the Prius folks chiming in here. ?

Hah! Former Prius driver here! I assume the LFP version has less horsepower, but really have no idea. I just went with the CR1 because I live in the woods in central Maine and want my car to drive across to rural Ontario, and the rural bits of that trip (and wide gaps between chargers) are kind of long. Also, I want to be able to road trip in winter, and at 34% less range in winter, the extended range battery still is plenty fir a reasonable stretch of driving between charging stops.

 

[Anders31]

Maths are simple (will take km & wltp)

SR NCM WLTP was 440km with 68kWh, when released
SR NCM was extended via software to 70kWh, so theoretically this push the real numbers to 452km

SR LFP WLTP is 470km with 72kWh

IF the NCM could be unlocked to 72kWh, this would reach 465km

So globally they just matched as much as they could the NCM/LFP ranges to not bother with early adopters

End to end the LFP adds around 150/200kg of weight, and should be worst in cold climate than the NCM ....

 

[737flyer]

Anyone have a charging curve chart for the LFP batteries. Curious to see how fast it is past 80%.

 

[c-had]

LFP batteries degrade much more slowly than NMC. If you're only going to keep the car for a couple years, this may not matter. But if you tend to keep cars for a long time (like me), the range difference will become smaller as the battery naturally degrades.

https://www.engineering.com/story/why-ev-manufacturers-are-switching-from-nmc-to-lfp-batteries

I got my Premium RWD SR LFP almost a month ago. One of the things that drew me to the Mach E over some of its competitors was the LFP battery.

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