One pedal drive (vs) Brake regen

[ctenidae]

Well, I just want to know which is more efficient, WOT to 80 mph with 1PD, or with 2PD?

14, except with a tailwind, it's 19.

Sponsored

 

[Space Ghost GT]

Forget about what got you to speed, becasuse it is the same for 1P or 2P; what counts is the energy stored in the car moving at that speed. That amount of stored energy is going to be the same whether in 2P or 1P mode. Going from X MPH to 0 in each case will convert the same amount of energy into whatever. If the car travels farther in 2P mode, then more of that available energy is consumed in moving it the longer distance (against road friction, air resistance, etc.). In 1P mode, it traveled significantly less and thus consumed much less energy moving the car against those other forces. Where did the extra energy go? It went into the regenerative system. You have one bucket of energy in both cases; it is just a matter of how you allocate it.

Sort of you just lost 40%-60% out of the 1pd bucket, didn’t travel as far and used more energy to get there. Why because regen is not 100% efficient!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It isn’t that hard to conceptualize. 1pd is a gimmick plain and simple, which uses more energy to travel a given distance because you are stuck in a negative sum game. You are only recovering 40-60% of the distance lost through regen. It’s not a wash in the least.

 

[Space Ghost GT]

There's No One-Pedal Driving
Many EVs provide enough deceleration when lifting off the throttle to bring the vehicle to a complete stop and enable true one-pedal operation. Not the Taycan. Citing the fact that the most efficient thing to do is coast, and clearly not trusting the pedal control of its buyers, Meier said they decided to not offer much regen capability and instead wait to do the majority of regen when the driver pushes the brake pedal. There are two settings, though. The default is none, but a slight amount can be enabled, if desired.

 

[mkhuffman]

Sort of you just lost 40%-60% out of the 1pd bucket, didn’t travel as far and used more energy to get there. Why because regen is not 100% efficient!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It isn’t that hard to conceptualize. 1pd is a gimmick plain and simple, which uses more energy to travel a given distance because you are stuck in a negative sum game. You are only recovering 40-60% of the distance lost through regen. It’s not a wash in the least.

I can't believe I am actually going to enter this debate, as ridiculous as it is. But here I go...

You can coast using 1PD. It is super easy. You keep saying you loose 40-60%, but you are assuming you are driving differently using 1PD. You can drive exactly the same way in 1PD and 2PD, you just have to make an effort to control the speed with the pedal. Of course if you want to take your foot off the pedal and coast you cannot do that with 1PD. But you can still coast if you want to.

If your argument is it is easier to coast using 2PD, then maybe for you it is. I find it pretty easy to coast in 1PD, but that is my personal experience driving using 1PD all the time.

You really should not take the position that 2PD is more efficient. It is not. It is possible to drive just as efficiently using 1PD. In fact, a good argument has already been made (about 100 times) that it is easier to avoid applying the brakes using 1PD, so some people will be able to drive more efficiently using 1PD. But if you can't, not a problem. Stick with your 2PD.

Meanwhile, I have some WOTs to do.

 

[AKgrampy]

Well, I just want to know which is more efficient, WOT to 80 mph with 1PD, or with 2PD?

I tested it and I think 1PD is quickest. I tried 2PD and when I pressed both pedals I got nowhere!

 

[Motomax]

Sort of you just lost 40%-60% out of the 1pd bucket, didn’t travel as far and used more energy to get there. Why because regen is not 100% efficient!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It isn’t that hard to conceptualize. 1pd is a gimmick plain and simple, which uses more energy to travel a given distance because you are stuck in a negative sum game. You are only recovering 40-60% of the distance lost through regen. It’s not a wash in the least.

The idea of regen being efficient comes from comparing it to friction brakes. The reality is that no one, except the drivers that annoy everyone else on the road, free roll to a stop every single time. Forget the idea of free rolling to a stop, seriously just stop doing it for the sake of everyone else around you. If you are going to apply the brakes, regen over friction will always be more efficient. No ifs, ands, or buts about it. 1PD or 2PD, under normal driving, can be intentionally driven in the same way which means neither is more efficient unless personal factors come into play.

 

[Dave-O]

I have other ICE car and just want to make sure I wire my brain correctly.
1PD also auto holds right, because my ICE car won't and I don't want to run into things

Trust me, you’re not alone. Whenever the wife or I trade cars after driving the Mach-E in 1pd for a while it can be a shock at first. The Odyssey is great but damn we sometimes have heart attacks when we realize it won’t brake on its own ?

 

[fpasta]

From the coasting standpoint,

Felt like I was coasting in an ICE.

Whisper mode, 1PD, going 55 mph (no fluctuation on pedal) there was a slight grade down. For a good while.

I think keeping the pedal still key to getting that coast.

From regen standpoint, absolutely. You toggle off 1PD while driving and you rocket lurch off feels something disengaged.

 

[mfbrown]

Sort of you just lost 40%-60% out of the 1pd bucket, didn’t travel as far and used more energy to get there. Why because regen is not 100% efficient!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It isn’t that hard to conceptualize. 1pd is a gimmick plain and simple, which uses more energy to travel a given distance because you are stuck in a negative sum game. You are only recovering 40-60% of the distance lost through regen. It’s not a wash in the least.

I agree with you. My point was that the amount of regeneration isn't the same for 1P and 2P during a coast. You get more regeneration from 1P than 2P (inefficient as it may be) when coasting to a stop. Not saying it is better; just stating the fact that there was more regen with 1P and more distance with 2P.

I also agree with you that because of the inefficiency in regen, you would be better off if you coasted to the stop. The energy consumed moving the car would be more efficient than going the shorter distance and using the rest for regen (with its inherent inefficiency). Agreed.

The problem is I don't know many people who coast efficiently (not having to friction brake at all). Once you start adding braking to the equation (granted some are better than others) - it is no longer clear that coasting is better. Coasting effectively takes a lot of effort and timing and if you are good at it (which will probably make you annoying to be driving behind); I certainly believe you can outperform 1P. I find 1P is an easier way of coasting, because it requires the same requirement to ease off the accelerator (a coasting tact), so you don't need to use the brake. On a downhill 1P is going to be more efficient, because you have no option in 2P but to use friction braking.

In the end, I'm sure both solutions can be efficient or inefficient depending on the routes taken (hills or flat), and how good you are at timing your coast, (limiting friction brake use). That's probably why both modes are available!

 

[Space Ghost GT]

For national security reasons I updated my bio with the receipt date of my GT. Also here’s a pic of the GLE 450 as well, to prove my bio is indeed accurate.

 

[ctenidae]

For national security reasons I updated my bio with the receipt date of my GT. Also here’s a pic of the GLE 450 as well, to prove my bio is indeed accurate.

I don't see anything about the kiddy pool. How can this be trusted?

 

[Secret Sauce]

I can't believe I am actually going to enter this debate, as ridiculous as it is. But here I go...

You can coast using 1PD. It is super easy. You keep saying you loose 40-60%, but you are assuming you are driving differently using 1PD. You can drive exactly the same way in 1PD and 2PD, you just have to make an effort to control the speed with the pedal. Of course if you want to take your foot off the pedal and coast you cannot do that with 1PD. But you can still coast if you want to.

If your argument is it is easier to coast using 2PD, then maybe for you it is. I find it pretty easy to coast in 1PD, but that is my personal experience driving using 1PD all the time.

You really should not take the position that 2PD is more efficient. It is not. It is possible to drive just as efficiently using 1PD. In fact, a good argument has already been made (about 100 times) that it is easier to avoid applying the brakes using 1PD, so some people will be able to drive more efficiently using 1PD. But if you can't, not a problem. Stick with your 2PD.

Meanwhile, I have some WOTs to do.

You've put your finger on some of the problems with this debate, but I believe the most fundamental one is with the flawed concept of "coasting." It really doesn't apply to EVs, not in any practical way. On an EV, either the motor is driving the wheels or it is running in reverse and functioning as a generator. Finding a sweet spot where it does neither ("coasting") is essentially impossible. The only place where it might be beneficial is on downhill grades with unobstructed driving where you don't care if the car speeds up. Otherwise you are just playing mind games with yourself.

So, OPD is giving you your best opportunity to regenerate energy when you aren't using energy. It's teaching you that keeping to a constant speed and allowing the car to regenerate at any opportunity is always going to be the most efficient. It's just basic physics, really.

But as I said long, long ago in this discussion, the majority of people drive by the stab and release method and pay virtually no attention to their speed, so this concept can be hard to explain. And anyone who disbelieves that only needs to set their cruise control and pay attention to the other drivers on the road.

Sponsored