How many watts does the home charger use plugged into 120V wall socket?

[nmope]

Just wondering how many watts does the home charger use plugged into a regular 120V?

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[macchiaz-o]

V x A = W

So at 120 volts and 10 amps, you have 1,200 Watts.

The mobile EVSE might use as much as 12 amps at 120 volts?? If so, then this is 1,440 Watts.

Your home voltage may vary a bit and is probably higher at night. So if you're looking for a maximum wattage consider it being 125 volts.

 

[Mach-Lee]

Yup, 1440 watts. It’s only about 80% efficient so there’s about 1.1 kW going into the pack.

 

[nmope]

Thank you, that is what I wanted to know!

 

[Fremont Kid]

Thank you, that is what I wanted to know!

Great information. I'll add to help you understand the difference between volts, amps and watts. Simplified, watts is the work that can be produced from the electricity that is flowing through the wires. Amps is the amount of electricity flow. Volts is the speed or pressure - think water hose diameter - of the electrical flow. The formula V x A = W indicates that the amount of work - think about powering a light or fan or stove - is dependent on the amount of electricity flowing to the light or fan or stove during a given time period. Plenty of internet explanations and visuals regarding this.
So, if you have a 100 watt light bulb that is only receiving the amount of electricity to produce 50 watts through the electrical wires, that light bulb will glow dim because it is designed to receive sufficient electricity to produce 100 watts of work. This is why charging using a 120 volt (hose diameter) charger that is supplying only 25 amps (electrical flow) takes much longer than charging at 240 volts (larger hose diameter) at 38-50 amps, which is even slower than a fast charger. I think the BEV charging industry confuses this all because the commercial chargers are displaying kWh or kilo-watt hours, not volts and amps. In essence, they are translating the electrical input to the work potential being pushed into the battery. Hope this helps. But certainly the terms used are not always consistent and the formula can help translate.

 

[nmope]

Great information. I'll add to help you understand the difference between volts, amps and watts. Simplified, watts is the work that can be produced from the electricity that is flowing through the wires. Amps is the amount of electricity flow. Volts is the speed or pressure - think water hose diameter - of the electrical flow. The formula V x A = W indicates that the amount of work - think about powering a light or fan or stove - is dependent on the amount of electricity flowing to the light or fan or stove during a given time period. Plenty of internet explanations and visuals regarding this.
So, if you have a 100 watt light bulb that is only receiving the amount of electricity to produce 50 watts through the electrical wires, that light bulb will glow dim because it is designed to receive sufficient electricity to produce 100 watts of work. This is why charging using a 120 volt (hose diameter) charger that is supplying only 25 amps (electrical flow) takes much longer than charging at 240 volts (larger hose diameter) at 38-50 amps, which is even slower than a fast charger. I think the BEV charging industry confuses this all because the commercial chargers are displaying kWh or kilo-watt hours, not volts and amps. In essence, they are translating the electrical input to the work potential being pushed into the battery. Hope this helps. But certainly the terms used are not always consistent and the formula can help translate.

Great explanation! I was wanting to compare the Ford charger in a 120V vs a hardwired 48amp Level 2 charger.
So ford charger is about 1.1 KW vs hardwired 11.3 KW which is more than a factor of 10!

 

[breeves002]

Yup, 1440 watts. It’s only about 80% efficient so there’s about 1.1 kW going into the pack.

Unless you're using a 16 gauge 100' long extension cord then you'll get about 95V and maybe 900W going into the battery pack. Ask me how I know?

All jokes aside 1440w max but if your voltage is lower (extension cable or just you have lower voltage) it will be a little less. Normally on a regular extension cord I see about 1kW into the pack itself after losses.

 

[Fremont Kid]

Great explanation! I was wanting to compare the Ford charger in a 120V vs a hardwired 48amp Level 2 charger.
So ford charger is about 1.1 KW vs hardwired 11.3 KW which is more than a factor of 10!

Also remember that electrical guidelines recommend a circuit breaker that is 20% larger than the rated electrical flow. This is why the Ford home charger at 240 volts rated at 38 amps should be pulling from a 50 amp circuit breaker at your home. 38 amps X 20% = 7.6, so 38+7.6 = 45.6, and rounding up to the next largest circuit breaker, my electrician installed a 50 amp breaker. This will ensure that other devices pulling electricity will not reduce the current enough to cause the charger to stop working.

 

[devmach-e]

Also remember that electrical guidelines recommend a circuit breaker that is 20% larger than the rated electrical flow. This is why the Ford home charger at 240 volts rated at 38 amps should be pulling from a 50 amp circuit breaker at your home. 38 amps X 20% = 7.6, so 38+7.6 = 45.6, and rounding up to the next largest circuit breaker, my electrician installed a 50 amp breaker. This will ensure that other devices pulling electricity will not reduce the current enough to cause the charger to stop working.

Ford mobile cordset that comes with the car is 32A@240V. Requires a 40A breaker/circuit. Maximum amperage that can be drawn from a 50A breaker/circuit is 40A.

 

[Fremont Kid]

Ford mobile cordset that comes with the car is 32A@240V. Requires a 40A breaker/circuit. Maximum amperage that can be drawn from a 50A breaker/circuit is 40A.

Thanks for the correction of 38 amps to 32 amps. I still agreed to a 50 amp circuit to ensure the charger would not be interrupted.

 

[devmach-e]

Thanks for the correction of 38 amps to 32 amps. I still agreed to a 50 amp circuit to ensure the charger would not be interrupted.

There are 40A EVSEs that will plug into a 50A outlet. However, if you want take full advantage of the MME’s 48A charging capabilities, you’ll have to install a 48A EVSE with a hardwired connection with a 60A circuit & breaker.

 

[mrsiegfried]

Great information. I'll add to help you understand the difference between volts, amps and watts. Simplified, watts is the work that can be produced from the electricity that is flowing through the wires. Amps is the amount of electricity flow. Volts is the speed or pressure - think water hose diameter - of the electrical flow. The formula V x A = W indicates that the amount of work - think about powering a light or fan or stove - is dependent on the amount of electricity flowing to the light or fan or stove during a given time period. Plenty of internet explanations and visuals regarding this.
So, if you have a 100 watt light bulb that is only receiving the amount of electricity to produce 50 watts through the electrical wires, that light bulb will glow dim because it is designed to receive sufficient electricity to produce 100 watts of work. This is why charging using a 120 volt (hose diameter) charger that is supplying only 25 amps (electrical flow) takes much longer than charging at 240 volts (larger hose diameter) at 38-50 amps, which is even slower than a fast charger. I think the BEV charging industry confuses this all because the commercial chargers are displaying kWh or kilo-watt hours, not volts and amps. In essence, they are translating the electrical input to the work potential being pushed into the battery. Hope this helps. But certainly the terms used are not always consistent and the formula can help translate.

ehhhh that’s a somewhat sloppy explanation of the water-flow analog (a speed is not a pressure differential), and you missed the fact that a W is a *rate*, not the amount of work. Thinking about charging makes that abundantly clear: a W is a joule per second; charge for a certain amount of time, and you’ve added energy (kWh) to the battery.

In the water-flow analog, amps are a the (volumetric) discharge (which is a rate, so something like m3/s for water) and voltage is the pressure (a force over an area [N/m2]) difference driving flow. Multiply together and you end up with a N•m/s => J/s => W. A rate.

Yes, you can think about this in terms of work (N•m) instead of energy (J = N•m), but I can promise you more people are confused by the concept of work than the concept of energy.
Back to coffee.

 

[Fremont Kid]

ehhhh that’s a somewhat sloppy explanation of the water-flow analog (a speed is not a pressure differential), and you missed the fact that a W is a *rate*, not the amount of work. Thinking about charging makes that abundantly clear: a W is a joule per second; charge for a certain amount of time, and you’ve added energy (kWh) to the battery.

In the water-flow analog, amps are a the (volumetric) discharge (which is a rate, so something like m3/s for water) and voltage is the pressure (a force over an area [N/m2]) difference driving flow. Multiply together and you end up with a N•m/s => J/s => W. A rate.

Yes, you can think about this in terms of work (N•m) instead of energy (J = N•m), but I can promise you more people are confused by the concept of work than the concept of energy.
Back to coffee.

Understood, but confusion is the point because circuits and current are described as volts and amps while work or battery capacity is described as kW. This is confusing to the lay person, as I interpreted based on NMOPE's original question. I was simply trying to help resolve the confusion.

You introduced another term, i.e. joule, which I hope sincerely EV manufacturers will not begin to apply. We can all understand why physicists and electricians need these terms, but as more lay people purchase EVs understanding through clarification will be helpful.

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