Adding chargers at convenience store/gas stations?

[Glen Boise]

One of the complaints from BEV drivers is the lack of amenities at charger stations. Most seem to be installed in shopping center parking lots without easy access to amenities like trash cans, toilets, food and drink, and security. Amenities that are expected at most convenience store/gas stations today. How difficult would it be for existing convenience stores/gas stations to add charging to their offerings?
After all, a charger and a gas pump do the same thing. They refuel vehicles using different technologies. Installing charging at existing convenience store/gas stations would address BEV's drivers complaints. A convenience store/gas station adding charging would be "future proofing" themselves against a changing world.
Most convenience store/gas stations are independently owned. They contract with the Big Oil companies for their gasoline. In most cases, the convenience store/gas stations make most of their profit from their sales of items in their stores with the Big Oil companies keeping most of the profit from selling gasoline.
The biggest obstacle, to adding chargers, would likely be the convenience stores/gas stations contracts with the oil companies supplying their gasoline. Clearly, the contracts would prohibit selling competitors gasoline. Do they prohibit selling competing products using different technologies? Especially, the older stations with contracts from before BEV's became a viable competitor.
Please respond only if you have actual knowledge of these matters. Speculative chatter does not address the question.

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[Maquis]

It’s already happening. EVGo at Pilot/Flying J, Bucee’s, Wally’s, Shell ReCharge, and others.
Many posts about this.

 

[Darkenmage]

I am sure most of us, if not all, would love for this to happen sooner than later,

What gets me are the big malls who does not have chargers? They could have all their retailers chip in a little of the cost to build them and would be an added bonus traffic to all of them!

 

[Maquis]

Another one just announced yesterday:

 

[bshaw]

Please respond only if you have actual knowledge of these matters. Speculative chatter does not address the question.

That's not how this works. The primary function of the internet is to enable speculative chatter.

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

Small, independent gas stations with convenience stores are unlikely to add ev chargers because their tax subsidies are dependent on being fossil fuel delivery stations and they make the rest of their money on moving people out as quickly as possible.

The larger companies (pilot, TA, etc) get those same subsidies but also make a lot more money on people who stay for longer periods of time.

 

[dtbaker61]

How difficult would it be for existing convenience stores/gas stations to add charging to their offerings?

Several large chains of conveinience/filling stations are moving forward with this concept as we speak... The challenges are multiple:

- is there 3-phase power nearby such that a dedicated transformer and feeders can be installed at a price that doesn't shoot their business model (depending on X charges per day to start with and increasing over time).

- the local utilities rate structures vary by location. urban/suburban distribution grids can handle 150kW coming on and going off-line.... but rural lines sometimes cannot, or have high 'demand charges' based on peak load before you even sell any electricity. for example Northern NM rural Co-ops have demand charges ranging anywhere from $20-$25/kw... which means your power bill for ONE 150kw 'handle' would be $3300 per month before you sell even one charge!

- there are ways to mitigate the peak loads by putting big Battery buffers on site that charge at a steady rate like 50kw, and then empty at 150kw whn charging a vehicle... but that only works if you have time between to buffer up, or accept that 50kw is all you get if batteries are empty. AND the extra cost of Batteries has to be accounted for in the business plan to offset the savings from lowered demand charges.

- cost, backlog, and Electrical Contractors capable of installing 250kva transformers and equipment like this generally all work for the local Utilities, so you have to get them on board as well...

.... basically, there is a lot more to it, at a much higher expense, than installing L2 in your Garage.

 

[dtbaker61]

I am sure most of us, if not all, would love for this to happen sooner than later,

What gets me are the big malls who does not have chargers? They could have all their retailers chip in a little of the cost to build them and would be an added bonus traffic to all of them!

The better bet for mall, schools, workplaces with parking lots is to add solar carports, and LOTS of L2 or even L1 chargers if cars park there 'all day'.....

That would certainly inspire people to shop or eat for a couple hours. .... And would be a great benefit at job sites and schools for Staff.

 

[Glen Boise]

It’s already happening. EVGo at Pilot/Flying J, Bucee’s, Wally’s, Shell ReCharge, and others.
Many posts about this.

Unfortunately, those brands have little presence here in "fly over country". The only one I am aware of in North Central Indiana is a Pilot/Flying J truck stop in the next county. The only public charging in town is Level 2 at two downtown public parking structures. We are scheduled for a DCFC station that will be funded by either Volkswagen "Diesel-gate" funds or with Federal funds. Being Indiana, construction will probably be years from now.

 

[ChasingCoral]

I was surprised to find an EA at a Shell station in FL. Shell Recharge is one of the players in the charging market. Unfortunately, the setup was pretty bad for pulling a trailer behind our Lightning.

 

[Logal727]

Just chiming in with non-speculative chatter because that type of chatter is apparently allowed by OP.

 

[Logal727]

I was surprised to find an EA at a Shell station in FL. Shell Recharge is one of the players in the charging market. Unfortunately, the setup was pretty bad for pulling a trailer behind our Lightning.

All the current setups at EA are bad for pulling a trailer

 

[Maquis]

Unfortunately, those brands have little presence here in "fly over country". The only one I am aware of in North Central Indiana is a Pilot/Flying J truck stop in the next county. The only public charging in town is Level 2 at two downtown public parking structures. We are scheduled for a DCFC station that will be funded by either Volkswagen "Diesel-gate" funds or with Federal funds. Being Indiana, construction will probably be years from now.

That’s pretty much the way it is here. There is a Love’s Travel Center about 30 miles from me. That’s the only National chain close.
But as long as there’s a decent DCFC 150 miles in any direction (not quite there yet, north is a problem), that’s all I need. I’m not going to DCFC near home.
I’ve driven across Indiana on both I70 and 74, and there are Pilot/Flying Js all over the place. I’d expect there to be Travel Americas too, since they’re based in Ohio, but I don’t recall for sure.

 

[theriddler]

I see this starting but i also think one of the barriers to this is that the real estate required is greater than a typical gas station. Due to the length of time to charge it does not lend itself to the typical gas line that you see at a petrol station. And vehicles pulling anything are even more troublesome due to the current thought process on charging station setups.

All this can be overcome but requires thinking and planning for real estate management and vehicle/customer throughput.

 

[ChasingCoral]

All the current setups at EA are bad for pulling a trailer

Not all. There are some good ones. Unfortunately, the chargers weren't working in some of the most convenient pull-throughs and I had to go to another charger in the bank.

You can check out my other @RateYourCharge tweets to see an array of them from the mid-Atlantic south and west to Texas (so far).

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