EV Charger Prewire in new construction home

[Maquis]

I was having a related discussion on an electrician/EE forum. Many are running an empty 1” or 1-1/4” conduit to the garage. This gives ultimate flexibility in the future without spending a ton of money up front when most homeowners don’t yet know exactly what they want or will need.

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[Earplug]

What would be the access from the electrical panel to the garage be? Maybe you can have it done on your own after you move in.

Another option would be to go nuclear and contact the news stations on how the builder is anti EV.
Denver7 | Investigates

 

[Logal727]

Well, I did ask to see their load calculations to see how they arrived at the conclusion that my house needs an electrical panel upgrade to accommodate a single 220V/50A circuit.

This is their reply:

"We are not obligated to share our load calculations with you. May I remind you, you’re under contract with a production builder. You have zero say in how we build this home, questioning our products, our pricing, our policies, our processes, etc. etc. We are not your personal general contractor building a customer home for you. We’re building your home the same as the other 60,000 we’ve built in Colorado over the last 45+ years. Clearly you aren’t comfortable with our set pricing on this option, simple solution….do not pay us for it. This matter is closed"

A real gem of a company. Can't wait to deal with them should any warranty issues arise.

Wow, I’d be having second thoughts

 

[minders]

Well, I did ask to see their load calculations to see how they arrived at the conclusion that my house needs an electrical panel upgrade to accommodate a single 220V/50A circuit.

This is their reply:

"We are not obligated to share our load calculations with you. May I remind you, you’re under contract with a production builder. You have zero say in how we build this home, questioning our products, our pricing, our policies, our processes, etc. etc. We are not your personal general contractor building a customer home for you. We’re building your home the same as the other 60,000 we’ve built in Colorado over the last 45+ years. Clearly you aren’t comfortable with our set pricing on this option, simple solution….do not pay us for it. This matter is closed"

A real gem of a company. Can't wait to deal with them should any warranty issues arise.

Wow. Just wow. What company is this so we can all avoid it in the future? Sounds like something Lennar would do. I'm in a D.R. Horton right now that is almost 2 years old and trying to get them to do anything warranty-wise was impossible. We got into contract when it was already mostly completed, so I couldn't have them add the outlet, etc in the garage ahead of time. With that kind of response, I'd probably try to get out of contract with them if there was a way without losing anything. I'm way too outspoken to deal with that kind of attitude... I'd be their worst nightmare.

 

[CHeil402]

Well, I did ask to see their load calculations to see how they arrived at the conclusion that my house needs an electrical panel upgrade to accommodate a single 220V/50A circuit.

This is their reply:

"We are not obligated to share our load calculations with you. May I remind you, you’re under contract with a production builder. You have zero say in how we build this home, questioning our products, our pricing, our policies, our processes, etc. etc. We are not your personal general contractor building a customer home for you. We’re building your home the same as the other 60,000 we’ve built in Colorado over the last 45+ years. Clearly you aren’t comfortable with our set pricing on this option, simple solution….do not pay us for it. This matter is closed"

A real gem of a company. Can't wait to deal with them should any warranty issues arise.

Wow! What a terrible answer. It'd be one thing for them just to say no... this is a whole other level where they went out of their way to be rude about it. Basically, they had one pre-set design using a 30 A setup and they just don't want to change it. I have 200 A service in my house and have two 50 A outlets in my garage (and we have an electric range and dryer). Basically, their answer is BS, 200 A service is fine.

 

[Mach-Lee]

Well, I did ask to see their load calculations to see how they arrived at the conclusion that my house needs an electrical panel upgrade to accommodate a single 220V/50A circuit.

This is their reply:

"We are not obligated to share our load calculations with you. May I remind you, you’re under contract with a production builder. You have zero say in how we build this home, questioning our products, our pricing, our policies, our processes, etc. etc. We are not your personal general contractor building a customer home for you. We’re building your home the same as the other 60,000 we’ve built in Colorado over the last 45+ years. Clearly you aren’t comfortable with our set pricing on this option, simple solution….do not pay us for it. This matter is closed"

A real gem of a company. Can't wait to deal with them should any warranty issues arise.

Wow, that was a total broadside of a reply. It's such an odd hill to die on considering the actual cost to go from 30A to 50A would only be a couple hundred dollars more? The removal of the electric range should almost certainly clear up enough load capacity to increase the garage EV charger by 20A. They are just being assholes.

Since it looks like EV charging is required by Denver code, you might have some means to fight this. It looks like Denver requires new houses to be "EV-Ready", and uses the IECC definition which is as follows:

EV-READY SPACE. A designated parking space which is provided with a dedicated branch circuit that is not less than 40-ampere and 208/240-volt assigned for electric vehicle supply equipment terminating in a receptacle or junction box located in close proximity to the proposed location of the EV parking space. For two adjacent EV-Ready spaces, a single branch circuit is permitted.

So I would be talking with your city code inspector about the exact definition of EV ready and how many amps it is. Remind the inspector the IECC definition is 40+ amps. You might be able to twist the builders arm into correcting it for free if it's a code issue. They might have been doing it wrong for years if the definition changed and nobody caught it. The idea is to provide a NEMA 14-50 or 6-50 outlet minimum since less than 40A circuits are outdated for EV use in my opinion. 40A should rightfully be the bare minimum for new construction.

 

[gordonf238]

Wow. Just wow. What company is this so we can all avoid it in the future?

Richmond American Homes.

Sadly, all the other big players (Lennar, Toll Brothers) are no different. The reviews and overall customer service is pretty much the same across the board.

In this neigborhood, we really had no choice as the only lots left were owned and developed by them.

 

[gordonf238]

Another option would be to go nuclear and contact the news stations on how the builder is anti EV.
Denver7 | Investigates

We've opted to just go with a 30A outlet. They still asked what it's going to be used for, as their electrician had to ensure it won't overload the panel (eyeroll).

News investigation isn't our way of resolving it. Last thing I need is some pissed off supervisor delaying or jeopardizing our home due to bad press he received.

 

[gordonf238]

Since it looks like EV charging is required by Denver code, you might have some means to fight this. It looks like Denver requires new houses to be "EV-Ready", and uses the IECC definition which is as follows:

This is a VERY good suggestion! Thanks for thinking outside of the box here. Sadly, the town of Castle Rock is a separate municipality (and county), just south of Denver. We'll have to stick it with a regular 30A outlet and figure things out once we move in. This builder couldn't care less.

 

[Jimrpa]

Well, I did ask to see their load calculations to see how they arrived at the conclusion that my house needs an electrical panel upgrade to accommodate a single 220V/50A circuit.

This is their reply:

"We are not obligated to share our load calculations with you. May I remind you, you’re under contract with a production builder. You have zero say in how we build this home, questioning our products, our pricing, our policies, our processes, etc. etc. We are not your personal general contractor building a customer home for you. We’re building your home the same as the other 60,000 we’ve built in Colorado over the last 45+ years. Clearly you aren’t comfortable with our set pricing on this option, simple solution….do not pay us for it. This matter is closed"

A real gem of a company. Can't wait to deal with them should any warranty issues arise.

Ok, this is crap. If you love the house and the community, you can always have a licensed electrician add a dedicated 60A circuit to the panel and hardwire your EVSE after you get your house. Obviously, the panel will have space for the breaker and obviously, the existing panel will be sized for the load. Just drop it with the builder and smile stupidly.

 

[gordonf238]

Ok, this is crap. If you love the house and the community, you can always have a licensed electrician add a dedicated 60A circuit to the panel and hardwire your EVSE after you get your house. Obviously, the panel will have space for the breaker and obviously, the existing panel will be sized for the load. Just drop it with the builder and smile stupidly.

At this point, I did. I tried to save myself the headache of running a 4/3 cable to accommodate a 60A breaker half-way around the house, especially since we saw it advertised. Pick your battles, can't win them all.

 

[RickMachE]

Richmond American Homes.

Sadly, all the other big players (Lennar, Toll Brothers) are no different. The reviews and overall customer service is pretty much the same across the board.

In this neigborhood, we really had no choice as the only lots left were owned and developed by them.

The big builders are more than willing to add options to the home, as long as the options are options that they offer. As soon as you go outside their list, forget it. They aren't "custom home builders".

That said, that response is totally unacceptable for a publicly traded company.

 

[mjs020294]

In all fairness we are only party to one side of the conversation with the builder. In the OP the author suggests taking legal council. If there was any suggestion of that to the builder they will automatically let legal respond.

Too much drama for something that is incredibly easy to rectify yourself once you close.

 

[Earplug]

I just called Castle Rock and they have not adopted the IECC 2021 Building Code.

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