Heat Pump Cold Weather Range?

[RickMachE]

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[Jimrpa]

Would be even better if battery temperature could be displayed/revealed while driving the heat pump issued vehicles.

Isn't battery temp available via CarScanner?

 

[Jimrpa]

Listen there is no magic here, it's a very complex answer. Just remember energy usage for the HVAC is accrued over time. So if the 5kw heater is running full tilt each hour it will use 5KW, so for an hour of drive time it would reduce the future range of a AWD mustang 16.3 miles (5x3.26).

You have to realize that in the situation that the ptc is running full tilt it's not obvious the heat pump would be using less power.

Now imagine the ptc is using 1kw which would reduce range 3.26 miles per hour. If the heat pump was perfect it would only use 1 ish miles per hour.

The endurance of the mach e is only like 5 hours at 65mph on a flat road.

So a ptc mach e would lose 16.3 miles the heat pump mach e could potentially only lose 5.5, over an entire 0-100 5 hour 300 mile trip, this is assuming a cop of 3 ish.

The relationship is not simple, it's even less simple given the car can scavenge heat in the later model years. So will it be better than a 21, yes, but will it be better than a 24 l, probably but less so.

Does this help you?

I know it's fun to be excited about a car but heat pumps are not magic fairy dust, they probably save energy at an increase to complexity.

Now if we work in their risk due to their complexity and future cost the whole thing probably goes tits up.

I have never not had to service the air conditioning on a car I've owned. The PTC can break but it's only a heating element hooked up to a couple of pipes.

"Does this help me?" I'm sorry, but not really. I do understand what you're saying. My point is that Ford stuck a heat pump in, ostensibly because there would be less of a battery hit at lower temperatures. Ideally, I'd like to see a range comparison of a 2021 GT (without a heat pump) versus a 2025 GT (with a heat pump) in the same climate conditions and similar driving conditions. (My reason for specifying a GT is. because the 2021 and 2025 GTs have the same battery pack, while the Premiums and Selects have different battery pack technology. I'm trying to make the playing field as level as possible).

In Bunny Rabbit English: Ford took away my frunk because they claimed I was going to get lots more cold-weather range. OK Ford, prove it!

Fun Fact: the 2021 - 2023 Mustang Mach E GT had a published range of 270 miles. In 2024, the published range changed to 280 miles. I don't believe the heat pump arrived until 2025, so that 10 miles of range improvement can't be due to the heat pump.

 

[Jimrpa]

AI should be banned. Total crap information.

No one, including Ford, has posted any comparison between pre and post heat pumps. Why. Negligible impact.

Over all Mach-Es sold by Ford, a negligible impact adds up to fleet impact. For a person, it's not noticeable.

Do you know what I don't care about as a buyer? Fleet impact. Do you know what I DO care about as a buyer? Impact on me. Following the reasoning you're proposing. Ford has taken away a useful feature (a frunk) and replaced it with a more mechanically complex system than the prior heater, which will provide me no discernible benefit.

I'm not trying to shoot the messenger here (unless the messenger works for Ford and can impact product planning decisions )

 

[RickMachE]

Do you know what I don't care about as a buyer? Fleet impact. Do you know what I DO care about as a buyer? Impact on me. Following the reasoning you're proposing. Ford has taken away a useful feature (a frunk) and replaced it with a more mechanically complex system than the prior heater, which will provide me no discernible benefit.

I'm not trying to shoot the messenger here (unless the messenger works for Ford and can impact product planning decisions )

I think it's pretty clear that when a manufacturer doesn't toot their own horn as in "our new heat pump Mach-E gets XXX better range / efficiency", it's likely because it does not.

I don't disagree with your reasoning, but this is nothing new. The F-150 an Lightning has a deployable air dam that comes down at like 45 mph. It gives non-noticeable efficiency improvements to an owner, but helps Ford overall hit their targets. It breaks, people need to get it repaired (warning light / codes).

 

[Sikkun]

Ford took away my frunk because they claimed I was going to get lots more cold-weather range. OK Ford, prove it!

Did that claim that? Surely the press release claiming you would have significant cold weather range due to a heat pump would have the numbers you want if they made that claim.

 

[Space_Pony]

Do you know what I don't care about as a buyer? Fleet impact. Do you know what I DO care about as a buyer? Impact on me. Following the reasoning you're proposing. Ford has taken away a useful feature (a frunk) and replaced it with a more mechanically complex system than the prior heater, which will provide me no discernible benefit.

I'm not trying to shoot the messenger here (unless the messenger works for Ford and can impact product planning decisions )

What happened to the earlier model MME you had? It's sad that it's gone and you bought something you don't like. Maybe you should have looked for another model you liked.

 

[jmath07]

In my 2025 RWD I just got 2.7 mi/kWh on a 40 mi drive in 4F temps with the HVAC set to 72F. I did leave with a departure time'd battery on a 7.5kW charger.

I'm not super familiar with cold weather mi/kWh in pre-2025 models but from reading anecdotes around the internet, it seems they would get about 2.3 mi/kWh or below. That seems pretty significant to me.

 

[RickMachE]

In my 2025 RWD I just got 2.7 mi/kWh on a 40 mi drive in 4F temps with the HVAC set to 72F. I did leave with a departure time'd battery on a 7.5kW charger.

I'm not super familiar with cold weather mi/kWh in pre-2025 models but from reading anecdotes around the internet, it seems they would get about 2.3 mi/kWh or below. That seems pretty significant to me.

Speed?

I get 2.7 to 2.8 doing low 70s with an AWD in summer. A RWD would get 3.0 or higher. In winter I get 2.3 if things go well.

Unless the two vehicles are identical, driven side by side in the same conditions, starting with the same conditions (like parked together overnight in the same temps), nobody has posted a valid comparison that I have seen.

 

[Sikkun]

In my 2025 RWD I just got 2.7 mi/kWh on a 40 mi drive in 4F temps with the HVAC set to 72F. I did leave with a departure time'd battery on a 7.5kW charger.

I'm not super familiar with cold weather mi/kWh in pre-2025 models but from reading anecdotes around the internet, it seems they would get about 2.3 mi/kWh or below. That seems pretty significant to me.

I hit higher numbers like that on my 2023 RWD also. I got 3.5 driving Fl to TN in 20-35 degree weather and anecdotes around the internet say that’s impossible.

If your departure time also preheated the cabin your heater likely didn’t have to actually run that much.

 

[Jimrpa]

What happened to the earlier model MME you had? It's sad that it's gone and you bought something you don't like. Maybe you should have looked for another model you liked.

I still have my 2021 Mustang Mach-E. I love the vehicle. Yes, I’ve looked at other EVs. Nothing is perfect

 

[Kamuelaflyer]

I still have my 2021 Mustang Mach-E. I love the vehicle. Yes, I’ve looked at other EVs. Nothing is perfect

There's no such thing as a 10.

 

[Teslaeata]

Hey the AI is probably pulling the results from the last time someone posted the AI results on here and therefore now they are fact!

Aye, garbage in/garbage out

 

[jmath07]

Speed?

I get 2.7 to 2.8 doing low 70s with an AWD in summer. A RWD would get 3.0 or higher. In winter I get 2.3 if things go well.

Unless the two vehicles are identical, driven side by side in the same conditions, starting with the same conditions (like parked together overnight in the same temps), nobody has posted a valid comparison that I have seen.

More details here. https://www.macheforum.com/site/thr...r-trip-in-2025-rwd-premium.51139/post-1064984

I just got the car in September and didn't have a long drive until the end of October, so I have no summer data yet to compare. I will be watching closely when it warms up.

 

[Kamuelaflyer]

More details here. https://www.macheforum.com/site/thr...r-trip-in-2025-rwd-premium.51139/post-1064984

I just got the car in September and didn't have a long drive until the end of October, so I have no summer data yet to compare. I will be watching closely when it warms up.

The numbers you’re reporting are not appreciably different than the earlier electric heater system. It’s a small data set obviously, but it bolsters @RickMachE ‘s point that there’s a reason for Ford’s radio silence on any range of bonus from the heat pumps.

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