Is GFCI necessary?

[BryCola]

I had the outlet for my charger installed today, and the electrician talked me out of using GFCI. He said that GFCI was used around water...such as an outdoor charger, hot tub, etc. So there's no need for it in my garage. So I let him install the outlet without it. Now I'm having second thoughts. He said he would be glad to come back and change it out if I changed my mind, and would not charge me for labor. Only the upgraded part. Does he know what he's talking about?

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[Scooby24]

I believe it's now required by code but there's a built in GFCI in all the reputable EVSE's that I've seen...it's redundant and unnecessary from where I sit.

 

[ZuleMME]

It's in the middle of a code change to require it. But most EVSE's have it built in and malfunction when you daisy chain them. It's likely best without for now but if you want an inspection it's up to the inspector if they are going with the new code or the old code. All regions will be different for years...

 

[BryCola]

I'm primarily going to be using the mobile charger that came with my Mach E. I'm thinking that does not have GFCI built in.

 

[ZuleMME]

If you plan on it being a wet environment and only using a non GFCI EVSE than getting it swapped might be a good idea. It's a gray area right now. But... Note that most GFCI breakers fail every couple years as they just start tripping for no reason. Doesn't always happen but something else to consider when you price them at over $100. It's unlikely to be a do it once and forget it thing. AFCI also are known to periodically fail. Wonderful stuff.

 

[TheVirtualTim]

Most wall-mounted EVSE's seem to have the GFCI built in (for example the Ford Connected Charge Station has it built in).

The Ford Mobile Charger does not have GFCI built in and they recommend you add one: https://www.ford.com/ntzlibs/conten...specs-sheet/Home_Install_Spec_Sheet_FINAL.pdf

Your electrician is correct. I asked my electrician and also the city inspector the same question. They told me that since I use mine only "inside" the garage, it wasn't really needed. But I did install it anyway because my NEMA 14-50 outlet is on the front of the garage (between the two garage doors). I picked that spot so that a car can be out in the driveway being charged and no problem with the cord reaching.

Over time, cables being dragged along the floor could wear and wearing the insulation. Add some rainwater, melted snow, etc. and you could see how a GFCI would be a good idea.

The Ford Mobile Charger is weather-sealed and can safely be used outside ... even in rain and snow provided the box and cables are not damaged/compromised.

 

[Mach-Lee]

I'm primarily going to be using the mobile charger that came with my Mach E. I'm thinking that does not have GFCI built in.

All reputable EVSEs have GFCI built in, including the mobile charger. You don't need it on the breaker unless required by code. I have yet to see an EVSE that doesn't have GFCI.

From your owner's manual:

• GFCI Protection: The charger is equipped with a Ground Fault Circuit Interruption (GFCI) reaction system to protect against electric shock. If the charger module detects an output ground fault, it will shut down power to the output cable and illuminate the RED indicator.

Most EVSE manufacturers do not recommend using a GFCI breaker because it can cause nuisance tripping. This means you will come out and find that your car hasn't charged which could be an issue.

The Ford Mobile Charger does not have GFCI built in and they recommend you add one: https://www.ford.com/ntzlibs/conten...specs-sheet/Home_Install_Spec_Sheet_FINAL.pdf

Not true, see above. Other EVSE manufacturers such as Chargepoint and Grizzl-E recommend against using a GFCI breaker.

 

[bruceski88]

Most wall-mounted EVSE's seem to have the GFCI built in (for example the Ford Connected Charge Station has it built in).

The Ford Mobile Charger does not have GFCI built in and they recommend you add one: https://www.ford.com/ntzlibs/conten...specs-sheet/Home_Install_Spec_Sheet_FINAL.pdf

Your electrician is correct. I asked my electrician and also the city inspector the same question. They told me that since I use mine only "inside" the garage, it wasn't really needed. But I did install it anyway because my NEMA 14-50 outlet is on the front of the garage (between the two garage doors). I picked that spot so that a car can be out in the driveway being charged and no problem with the cord reaching.

Over time, cables being dragged along the floor could wear and wearing the insulation. Add some rainwater, melted snow, etc. and you could see how a GFCI would be a good idea.

The Ford Mobile Charger is weather-sealed and can safely be used outside ... even in rain and snow provided the box and cables are not damaged/compromised.

I have installed 2 chargers, both with permits. Neither inspector required a GFCI. You can call the building department to confirm requirements. I called Grizzle who made my charger and they confirmed the extra GFCI will not work with the one in the charger. There is an update to the national electric code that may require one, but has not been widely adopted.

 

[Motomax]

I have installed 2 chargers, both with permits. Neither inspector required a GFCI. You can call the building department to confirm requirements. I called Grizzle who made my charger and they confirmed the extra GFCI will not work with the one in the charger. There is an update to the national electric code that may require one, but has not been widely adopted.

Grizzle told me the opposite. As long as you buy their most recent version it will work fine. My area is required to have it per code.

 

[TheVirtualTim]

I have installed 2 chargers, both with permits. Neither inspector required a GFCI. You can call the building department to confirm requirements. I called Grizzle who made my charger and they confirmed the extra GFCI will not work with the one in the charger. There is an update to the national electric code that may require one, but has not been widely adopted.

The docs for the Ford Connected Charge Station state that the GFCI is builtin and an additional GFCI (such as a GFCI breaker) is not recommended.

The PDF I linked from Ford pertains only to the Ford Mobile Charger ... which says a GFCI breaker is recommended.

FWIW... my city inspector did not require the GFCI outlet either. When I asked about it, the comment was that it wasn't needed because it was inside the garage. While he didn't state it plainly ... I took that to mean that had it been an outdoor outlet then perhaps the GFCI would have been required.

 

[bruceski88]

Grizzle told me the opposite. As long as you buy their most recent version it will work fine. My area is required to have it per code.

Mine are 8 months old so things may have changed

 

[TheVirtualTim]

All reputable EVSEs have GFCI built in, including the mobile charger. You don't need it on the breaker unless required by code. I have yet to see an EVSE that doesn't have GFCI.

From your owner's manual:

• GFCI Protection: The charger is equipped with a Ground Fault Circuit Interruption (GFCI) reaction system to protect against electric shock. If the charger module detects an output ground fault, it will shut down power to the output cable and illuminate the RED indicator.

Most EVSE manufacturers do not recommend using a GFCI breaker because it can cause nuisance tripping. This means you will come out and find that your car hasn't charged which could be an issue.



Not true, see above. Other EVSE manufacturers such as Chargepoint and Grizzl-E recommend against using a GFCI breaker.

The article I linked is from Ford and does recommend a GFCI breaker for the NEMA 14-50 outlet used by the Ford Mobile Charger ... and appears to be in conflict with what you are reading in the manual.

Give me a day ... I'll get the correct answer.

 

[fightinag]

Im in Bryan Texas......
they are recommended since there can be liquids on the floor in a garage.....
but
They are not required, except in newly constructed homes that are for sale

 

[Maquis]

A NEMA 14-50 receptacle outlet is only required to be GFCI-protected if your area has adopted the 2020 NEC. Prior to that, only 120V receptacle outlets in garages were required to be GFCI-protected.

All reputable EVSEs have GFCI built in, including the mobile charger. You don't need it on the breaker unless required by code. I have yet to see an EVSE that doesn't have GFCI.

The reason the code now requires GFCI even if the EVSE already has one, it because if a person comes into contact with voltage between the outlet and the EVSE, the the EVSE will not provide protection. "You don't need it" as long as there is no fault before the EVSE!

It's also a myth that cascaded GFCIs will nuisance trip.

 

[jaycake]

I installed a Charge Point home charger and the manual stated that it had GFCI built in, If Code requires GFCI on a plug install we recommend doing a hardwire installation. That is not verbatim, but it's close.

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