Little heat verified by data log

[camdenlake]

Transport Canada emailed me. They've opened a safety investigation.

Awesome. No word on my filing with them so far. I checked my spam filter too lol.

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[IamIA]

something is wrong with your data collection sensors OP. How can the Ext temperature go from -30 to around -20 C within 20 minutes and be so erratic?

 

[Gullwingdmc]

Well I just had a scary drive in the snow. The car handled fine, but the heat was blowing luke warm at best and couldn’t keep the windshield warm to melt the snow. So I had to use the wash fluid every 10 minutes to keep it clear enough.

Time for a trip to the dealership!

 

[camdenlake]

Well I just had a scary drive in the snow. The car handled fine, but the heat was blowing luke warm at best and couldn’t keep the windshield warm to melt the snow. So I had to use the wash fluid every 10 minutes to keep it clear enough.

Time for a trip to the dealership!

Yep sounds like it.

 

[JimmyMachE]

something is wrong with your data collection sensors OP. How can the Ext temperature go from -30 to around -20 C within 20 minutes and be so erratic?

There are several ambient temperature sensors in MME, one seems to fluctuate way more than others, probably due to sunshine or some heat source.

Bjorn Nyland's video shows these fluctuations:

 

[camdenlake]

Well darn. My hopes of a complete fix have been dashed. Finally had a cold day the other day -18 and very little to no heat. It is a tiny bit better at those temps than before but data logs still show it dropping the coolant temp close to 50c which is better than the 40c before. So the case has been reopened. We shal see what happens.

 

[camdenlake]

Figured i would update in hopes of other cold climate owners with similar issues and data logs being able to toss some data on fire. The problem continues and ford has stuck their head in the sand and gone radio silent.

 

[Nklem]

Figured i would update in hopes of other cold climate owners with similar issues and data logs being able to toss some data on fire. The problem continues and ford has stuck their head in the sand and gone radio silent.

So sad that this has not been addressed. It was one of the major issues with my Mach E in Maine Winters. I moved onto the Hyundai and it's night and day different. I get 115 degree air from the vents in 2-3 minutes and full cabin temp in 5-10 minutes when it's in the single digits outside. I actually achieved 110F+ in the car the other day melting ice from an ice storm within 15 minutes.

The way the Ford system works, by using a 6 kW immersion PTC heater to heat moving super cold fluid , through uninsulated piping, to a conventional heater core is so old school and slow. Also splitting the battery heat off from that same heater was a bad idea. So bad, they used the same system for the Lightning.

The way it should be done is like the Hyundai (and I did not know the system design until well after I Purchased). The Hyundai has the heat pump (6KW equivalent heating) plus a direct air duct heater (6 KW) that literally blasts the heat with up to 120F at the vents.

If Ford would ditch the heater core and replace with an electric duct heater, leave the PTC for just the battery, they would have an equivalent system. I do not recall if the Ford had a DX refrigerant evaporator for the AC in the heater box (I assume so) and only chills the water for battery heating. If Ford would go with a heat pump they would assist in Winter Range and cabin heating in cold climates, a win-win for them.

When it gets to the single digits again, a friend of mine with a Mach E and my Hyundai are going to do a "time to 70F temperature test" from dead cold for both cars, for Youtube. There was one recently for the Tesla and we want to do similar. I will post a link when complete although I am glad for only a few single digits this Winter so far.

 

[camdenlake]

So sad that this has not been addressed. It was one of the major issues with my Mach E in Maine Winters. I moved onto the Hyundai and it's night and day different. I get 115 degree air from the vents in 2-3 minutes and full cabin temp in 5-10 minutes when it's in the single digits outside. I actually achieved 110F+ in the car the other day melting ice from an ice storm within 15 minutes.

The way the Ford system works, by using a 6 kW immersion PTC heater to heat moving super cold fluid , through uninsulated piping, to a conventional heater core is so old school and slow. Also splitting the battery heat off from that same heater was a bad idea. So bad, they used the same system for the Lightning.

The way it should be done is like the Hyundai (and I did not know the system design until well after I Purchased). The Hyundai has the heat pump (6KW equivalent heating) plus a direct air duct heater (6 KW) that literally blasts the heat with up to 120F at the vents.

If Ford would ditch the heater core and replace with an electric duct heater, leave the PTC for just the battery, they would have an equivalent system. I do not recall if the Ford had a DX refrigerant evaporator for the AC in the heater box (I assume so) and only chills the water for battery heating. If Ford would go with a heat pump they would assist in Winter Range and cabin heating in cold climates, a win-win for them.

When it gets to the single digits again, a friend of mine with a Mach E and my Hyundai are going to do a "time to 70F temperature test" from dead cold for both cars, for Youtube. There was one recently for the Tesla and we want to do similar. I will post a link when complete although I am glad for only a few single digits this Winter so far.

Thank you I heard that Hyundia/Kia was doing things different in cold climates. Its very frustrating as I love driving the car just not when its cold.


Josh

 

[Nklem]

Thank you I heard that Hyundia/Kia was doing things different in cold climates. Its very frustrating as I love driving the car just not when its cold.


Josh

I did enjoy my time and warm weather drives as well. It is a Mustang....for sure. I do not miss layers, hat, wool socks and frosted windows though...in my $57K EV.

 

[mkhuffman]

So sad that this has not been addressed. It was one of the major issues with my Mach E in Maine Winters. I moved onto the Hyundai and it's night and day different. I get 115 degree air from the vents in 2-3 minutes and full cabin temp in 5-10 minutes when it's in the single digits outside. I actually achieved 110F+ in the car the other day melting ice from an ice storm within 15 minutes.

The way the Ford system works, by using a 6 kW immersion PTC heater to heat moving super cold fluid , through uninsulated piping, to a conventional heater core is so old school and slow. Also splitting the battery heat off from that same heater was a bad idea. So bad, they used the same system for the Lightning.

The way it should be done is like the Hyundai (and I did not know the system design until well after I Purchased). The Hyundai has the heat pump (6KW equivalent heating) plus a direct air duct heater (6 KW) that literally blasts the heat with up to 120F at the vents.

If Ford would ditch the heater core and replace with an electric duct heater, leave the PTC for just the battery, they would have an equivalent system. I do not recall if the Ford had a DX refrigerant evaporator for the AC in the heater box (I assume so) and only chills the water for battery heating. If Ford would go with a heat pump they would assist in Winter Range and cabin heating in cold climates, a win-win for them.

When it gets to the single digits again, a friend of mine with a Mach E and my Hyundai are going to do a "time to 70F temperature test" from dead cold for both cars, for Youtube. There was one recently for the Tesla and we want to do similar. I will post a link when complete although I am glad for only a few single digits this Winter so far.

So if I am mathing correctly, that is 12 kW of power being sucked from the battery, which should mean twice the range hit in cold weather. Maybe that is an acceptable result, maybe not. I wonder if it was part of the design decision process at Ford.

 

[camdenlake]

So if I am mathing correctly, that is 12 kW of power being sucked from the battery, which should mean twice the range hit in cold weather. Maybe that is an acceptable result, maybe not. I wonder if it was part of the design decision process at Ford.

I would take the hit over no heat and no defrost.

josh

 

[mkhuffman]

I would take the hit over no heat and no defrost.

josh

Probably I agree with you but I live in a mild climate and twice the range hit would be overkill for me.

 

[Nklem]

So if I am mathing correctly, that is 12 kW of power being sucked from the battery, which should mean twice the range hit in cold weather. Maybe that is an acceptable result, maybe not. I wonder if it was part of the design decision process at Ford.

No. It needs only the heat pump most of the time. The electric heater is only for when the heat pump cannot keep up or/and it’s super cold. I smelled it come on once. At 10F the heat pump pulls 3.0 kW to start and averages out at 1–1.5 kW to maintain 74 F the cabin. When we do the heat test between the two I will log all data. It’s amazingly efficient.

 

[camdenlake]

Probably I agree with you but I live in a mild climate and twice the range hit would be overkill for me.

The two systems they use regulate in mild cold only heat pump and would draw very little.

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